To think abusing someone for having ginger hair is as bad as racism?

[joogle]

Carrot-top, copper-top, ginger-nut, ginger minger, Duracell, Ronald McDonald. These taunts can make people's lives a misery.

If race is defined as:

an arbitrary classification of modern humans, sometimes, especially formerly, based on any or a combination of various physical characteristics, as skin color, facial form, or eye shape, and now frequently based on such genetic markers as blood groups.

Then we can assume that racism is hate or intolerance of another human being, primarily because of the way they look.

I don't know whether 'gingerism' could be classed as a form of racism, likely not, but do people acknowlegde that it is as bad as racism?

Yes, it was discussed earlier in the thread that she, being the first, was important.

Seeker, obviously not, but every time these threads about red heads roll out, I am 50% sympathetic but 50% thinking "the red heads should try going through life being short". I honestly think that that's more of a disadvantage. Are there any statistics available about red heads earning less?

I am not sure it's as bad as racism but it is terrible. The red haired kids did get teased in my day and still do in DC classes. Mostly the quiet ones. One of my DC has been teased for physical attributes/minor disability and it hurts badly for him and us so i know how it feels. My other DC have also been called names but i think focusing on race/disability is the pits. Red hair, i am not sure. It shouldn't be tolerated though. It would be good if there were more red heads in the public eye to make it fashionable, much like Harry Potter did for glasses. I quite hoped one of my DC would have red hair as it looks so cute and it abit different, I like curly hair too.

jellybeans: The Weasley family in Harry Potter are read heads.

It's not always terrible, you know. It can be friendly and admiring.

red heads!

I think abusing anyone about anything is wrong, as it implies a need to demonstrate superiority and is simply plain rude.

There are a lot of red heads at DDs school which I am pleased about as DD has flaming red hair.
She loves her hair and it is often admired. I hope this will be enough to give her the confidence she will need when the compliments turn to name calling as she gets older.
I got called speccy 4 eyes a lot as a kid, I didn't like it much at the time, but it hasn't harmed me.
I don't like the name calling and mickey taking that goes with having red hair, but I suppose its part of that small mindedness that goes with teasing anyone that is a bit different.

I do think that redheads need to be a bit careful, though. Would you be really offended if a stranger was chatting to your baby in the bus and said "Hello. coppertop?" Would that be different from "Hello, curly?" or any of the other things people call babies?

If I had a red-haired baby and someone commented on their gingerness in a friendly, non "eurgh" kind of way then of course I wouldn't take offence

Anything that uses someone's physical appearance in a bullying or derogatory way is properly wrong. Yet somehow it is acceptable to take the piss out of someone with red hair. I've got friends who are otherwise perfectly nice who think it's alright to spout nonsense about 'gingers'. These are grown women in their 30's. They know my opinion on it VERY well.

Why did it start? This didn't happen to my red-headed parent. It didn't happen to the red-heads I went to school with. I had never heard of this bizarre phenomenon until I was well into adulthood.

I skimmed earlier posts about attitudes to red heads in history, and I think it would be a mistake to suggest 'twas ever thus, because it certainly wasn't. (The important thing being, since we didn't used to do it we can jolly well stop doing it now).

Bad as it is now, it simply cannot be equated with racism, for all the reasons FreudianSlipper gave. Sorry but that part of the OP really made me cringe. I worry about all these people who suggest things like that, because it seems we are rapidly getting complacent about race relations and losing sight of how truly terrible racism really has been over the years.

Hands up all the redheads who:

-were told they would never get a promotion from a particular boss;
-were beaten up by police officers in an unprovoked attack;
-walked into the wrong pub and got their skulls fractured;
-were advised by their school not to even try to enter a particular profession;
because of their hair colour.

Just a few things that have happened to me, family or friends because of being black or mixed race.

So, vile yes, as bad as racism, thankfully no (no yet).

Flangelina if you base your opinions as an adult on fairytale princesses, Disney and Sesame Street then perhaps you might get a slightly skewed overview on things. There is something a little bit disturbing about an adult woman trying to equate not looking like a fairytale princess in books and not getting picked for the lead character in school plays with racism. I'm not for one moment condoning insults (and I've had plenty myself over the years) but part of growing up is developing a bit of a thick skin. Otherwise it just becomes a bit much like attention seeking melodrama.

Many people have their crosses to bear - the short, the bespectacled, the blonde (whom you belittle) and all the people who don't conform to the caucasian stereotype. I think it would be nothing but negative if I went around bemoaning the fact that I am only 5 feet 2 - "woe is me, poor me, I'm discriminated against, sometimes called "shortarse" and bullied". You can have a negative attitue to anything and make a big problem out of something if you try hard enough, true enough.

Nijinsky, please stop inferring things that aren't there. And if you want to analyse me, frigging get it right- I have said several times on this thread that I don't think prejudice against redheads is as bad as racism. So you're wrong.

I am also five feet two. The suggestions about how being short may or may not be worse on this thread don't seem to allow for the possibility of those of us who are both. Speaking as someone who has experience of both being short and being a redhead, unlike yourself, I find prejudice against redheads to be more pervasive, for women anyway. I suspect men probably suffer worse from both though.

Last of all, it's unfortunate that you refuse to understand how many people, women usually, suffer because of not meeting the pervasive beauty myth. You diminish this suffering, and I bet you haven't looked up a single one of the things I've suggested in order to educate yourself. Being blonde is not bearing a cross like being a redhead is, which in its turn is not bearing a cross like being black, if you want to use that phraseology. For you to blame the people who are carrying the crosses, which is what you're doing even as you lay claim to one, is very undedifying as well as trying to have it both ways.

I was blonde for the first few years of my life and then my hair changed colour.

Now it changes all the time, sometimes it's strawberry blonde (usually in the summer) but at other times it is ginger or red.

I used to get a lot of compliments as a little blonde girl but as soon as it changed all that stopped and these are/were far more common from then on.

"Poor thing, you used to have such lovely blonde hair."

"What a shame about your hair."

"You can't marry a ginger man now, not that you'd want to, but your kids would have no chance" - of avoiding the ginger hair obviously.

"Are you going to dye it back to blonde? You could look really nice if you did."

And then there were the names at school, starting with the obvious 'ginger nut', 'ginger biscuit' and 'carrot head' but as we got older changing to 'ginger pubes' and 'ginger cunt' and 'ginger bitch' and things like "bet if I licked your fanny it would taste like carrots."

I used to go to pre-school day care with my cousin, whose hair was red from birth, and she was attacked on a daily basis by a little boy who hated her hair. He would slap her and pull her hair every single day.

And as she got older she was spat on by other girls in her class. She's had comments and name calling on the same lines as me all her life too.

And have you noticed that in films and especially children's TV programmes and cartoons etc, they always have one ugly child with red hair and glasses? You can bet a red haired character, especially in a cartoon, will always have big, ugly glasses as well and be the least popular character.

Its not that new a phenomenon - my Dad (the originator of the gene) got called redpole by his brothers as he was tall and skinny with red hair.
I wouldn't equate the kind of abuse/teasing you get with racism, but it sure can attract mindless yobbism and occasional violence though - an ex of mine also had red hair and he had been physically attacked more than once, but I think he found the kind of well meant comment of compliments attached to his hair annoying too - he said to me once that it wasn't the sort of thing people felt obliged to say if you had brown or blonde hair and it was just marking out the way he looked different - yet again.
Re takethisonehereforastart post - I think you certainly see a lot of characters with stereotyping 'red' behaviour - such as feistyness etc - Little Miss Naughty for example I believe has red hair...

people will always make comments etc its the world we live in

That doesn;t mean we have to put up with it, ilovesprouts!

i know !

Am coming to the thread a little late. I had very very red hair when I was younger, it wasn't ginger but flame coloured as my mum used to say . I hated it at the time and was bullied very very badly. I love it now and am sad it is fading as I become old and decrepit. I don't think it is racism though as being a redhead isn't a "race". It is bullying and offensive though. For some reason it is perfectly acceptable though. It is heard all the time, I mean Doctor Who uses it as a joke doesn't he! "not ginger, oh thank god". Imagine him saying "not black/asian/whatevs, oh thank god".

My son is ginger headed, as was my dad. I have seen my own BIL insult ginger heads "ginger prick" was one and i was you wouldn't say "blonde prick" or "brunette prick" so why pick on red heads!!!!!!

Oh and we're in Scotland and people still get bullied for it here!

Some recent comments from so called intelligent people:

thank god I didn't have ginger baby
you wouldn't have chosen a ginger though would you?

Just some of the comments I've had said to me about my child. He gets bullied on a daily basis for the colour of his hair. He cries often, he asks if he can dye his hair and he's only a baby. My boss constantly refers to him being ginger (soft g). It really is awful that a child should suffer simply because of the colour of his hair.

I can't believe someone who is blonde is comparing themselves to being a red head and likewise I don't think you can compare it to being black.

People have said to me that I was lucky my kids weren't ginger (I'm ginger and so is DH's mum). I have told them to f-off but I'm starting to think that they are lucky considering the abuse some people on here have had .

I do think it's a lot about personality though. I was never picked on but I was a very cocky, bubbly child. My sister did get teased and I think it was more down to her being very timid and not one to stick up for herself (we are both completely the opposite now though). I think a lot of kids will pick on kids who seem weak or shy whether it be about red hair, weight, glasses or whatever.

What else would I take the piss out of my OH half for if not having a ginger tinge?

He will of course have his revenge when we produce a ginger child (his brother's child is bright orange....).

thegruffalosma - I don't think you can generalise in that fashion, any more than Eldritch can assume that it's only recent because she has no personal experience of it. Even confident kids can be ground down by the constant picking on them; and there is also the "tall poppy" syndrome so it's possible to start off loud and proud and then they just go harder at you - depends on the meanness of the kids involved, I guess. I do agree that a "come on if you think you're hard enough" attitude might stop the generalised class bullying but it won't necessarily stop the vindictive.

In my family, I had more confidence than my younger sister - but then had to start wearing glasses as well as having ginger hair and freckles - she soon outstripped me in confidence, despite being a timid gurl, because she was Blonde (and didn't need glasses). And no one bullied her for that.

eurochick - if you feel the need to take the piss out of your OH for his hair then I hope he has a very thick skin. It gets fucking boring, especially if we have to put up with it in the home as well.