Does anybody actually know anyone who had an ELCS just because they thought they were "too posh to push"?

[InAStateOfReflux]

Just watching the Wright stuff. One of the hot topics is that apparently ELCS rates being performed by the NHS are rising because people are deciding they are "too posh to push" and it's costing the NHS lots of money.

They are suggesting that these women should be offered psychiatric counselling to bring them round to the idea of having a vaginal birth.

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but I was given an ELCS because my dd was breech and was in fact strongly advised to (not given much choice in fact) and anyone else I know who's had one has been offered it because of significant trauma or complications in a previous birth.

I have never however met a woman who insisted on one on the NHS just cause she didn't fancy pushing it out of her fanny, and I doubt the NHS would go with this anyway tbh...

And if they're talking about women who have real fears and emotional distress regarding child-birth, then yes of course lets force the hysterical wench to push it out, does she not know how much money she's costing the NHS?

Oh how I love the way the media portray these issues...[sigh] Yes perhaps ELCS rates are rising and perhaps this should be addressed in some way, but to suggest it is for such fickle reasons is so juvenile. Perhaps it is the HCPs fault and not the whole female population who are apparently too cowardly to push their babies out?

i didnt actually i was having a convo with someone else ..............

the reason i would not have made sence to you is because i was not talking to you was i.. Really you just stared picking up random things said in this thread

yes you did challenge me and indeed i try to give my view but at the end of the day it is just my view so it does not matter does it :)

You're right on both counts. (1) It is your view and (2) it doesn't matter.

You said women should be told it is normal. I didn't put words in your mouth the definition of not normal is abnormal. Also I think you will actually find that as a species humans are actually fairly poorly adapted to child birth in comparison to all other mammals.

C sections are not a thoroughly modern invention. Modern style C-sections were first performed in the 1880s. A form of C-section was performed as early as Roman times although back then the mother invariably died. They did however sometimes manage to save the foetus. It is however suggestive of it being normal for babies to be stuck or child birth to go potentially wrong.

I have had 2 c sections. I wanted both of them. I had spent so much time trying to get and stay pregnant I absolutely couldn't bear the thought of anything going wrong. And in c section, the burden of risk is much more on the mother than the child. There are always posts about respiratory distress in babies born by c section and that's true, but not increased mortality. For the baby, it's a safer option.
My consultant agreed with me. She said pregnancies like mine are "extra special" and she knew how hard we had fought to even get to that point. But strictly speaking, I could have delivered naturally.
As it happened, the placenta was very low so I was told a c section was unavoidable, so the decision was taken out of my hands. And I had a very similar situation with my second pregnancy so delivered again by section. It was what I wanted, and even without placenta previa and breech, my ELCS had already been signed off at maternal request.
They were wonderful, calm, pain free experiences, which no amount of counselling could have ever made me regret, or make a different choice. But teaforone, presumably you would never have allowed them, without the element of medical need. How very short sighted.

good then its alright then isnt it :)
I really do not want to upset people and never gave personal attacts on anyone

yes bagofholly you had special cases good for you im glad your babies are well :)

If someone asked for a c section because they were scared of pain need to know the pain after a c section. I was in pain for ages.

yeah my sister looked horrible after hers thats why i could not understand how it was ment to be easier :(
At the end of the day what happens happens

I was lucky I had a good DP to look after things or I would gave been in trouble. But I wouldn't change a thing.

lockets..
I never once said i was totally against c sections..
I just said i thought they should not really be used as pain relief
And when somone said trama to me i thought as in just pain trama so yeah i was very wrong there so sorry it takes me a while to read what people are writing and i get abit confused
But womens cases differ very wide so maybe i should give up on this thread lol :)

"I think maybe you thought you knew about the reasons people might need elcs but are slowly realising you don't really know and are maybe a bit out of your depth? which is fine, it is what fora like this are there for-to widen people's knowledge and understanding."

Very well said. Teaforone, you've contradicted yourself repeatedly, ignored posts, and stated really rather silly "arguments" which you're unable to defend. I really hope this thread broadens your outlook. And my case was no more special than that of every other woman who makes the same request. We live in a civilised society, and the NHS sets out to provide equitable healthcare for all, free of charge at source. Distinguishing between birth options on the basis of perceived need is beset with problems and that's the point of this thread : what is need.
I hope you've got the hang of it and perhaps think differently, instead of blindly sticking to an opinion and yet being unable to defend it.

Maybe next time, you should read the thread a bit before posting. It helps to understand the posts before objecting to them.

haha i love the fact that two grown up ladies feel the need to insult somone over and over again ranting on about a convo they were not even in
i do not take back my thoughts girls i was just saying sorry to one mn users who i upset and did not mean to
But i would not need to defend myself to either of you two as your not even worth trying to talk to as you dont even understand your own posts nevermind anyone elses

Teaforone. I'm off to bed now as you're really boring me. G'night.

nightie night

sorry i did not want to point out names there have been two mumnetters throughtout my chats on here who insits nothing more than to insult everything i say or say i do if you look back you will soon see who
Im not bothering with them now :) im off to beddiebyes
Hope you all have a lovely night

need is subjective to the needee.
When we are saying want, we are inferring that the people carring out a section decide the need.

A surgeon in obs will be assessing need purely in physicalality of mother and child
A counsellor will put mental health before physical recovery.

It's a impossible debate because in a csection, everyone involved has subjective views.

As to whether it can be requested without a need, of course it can. Midwives discuss birth plans from the offset.

Perhaps if these were focused on earlier than the need for your birth of choice, be it surgery, pain relief or on a Bedouin Birthing blanket up a tree on youtube, could be talked through and compared to other options. Then you have the confidence in your decision, and reasons on both sides as to why it can't be a option.

This thread has made me sad, where is the support. Only judgement. Pregnancy is hard, labour is hard. That's why its called labour . Why would you make it more stressful or harder than it needs to be.

Perhaps if we sacked all the csection bean counters and invested in actual antenatal care and facilities, this issue would cease to exist?

I CANNOT BELIEVE THAT THERE HAS BEEN INSINUATION THAT MOLLYDOLLYDOLL AND TEAFORONE ARE THE SAME PERSON. I MEAN, THAT IS QUITE UNBELIEVABLE! THEIR POSTING STYLE AND MN HISTORY ARE SO DIFFERENT, FOR A START.