to think allowing grandparents to do unpaid childcare is just asking for family problems?

[deaconblue]

My friend's mum has been looking after her two dc's for 2-3 days a week for 7 years now (unpaid). She's now trying for another baby which would add a further 4 years to her mother's unpaid childcare duties. They keep falling out over parenting styles and their relationship is nothing like as good as it was pre-children.
It seems to me that it must be almost impossible to keep all parties happy with such a long term arrangement.

I don't actually know any grandparents who do this (have met one or two at the park who I suspect were grandparents, but amongst my friends none). Most people I know of my parents generation are either too selfish to offer this (even though they benefited from it themselves- my grandparents looked after my sister and I while my mum worked after our parents divorced, and I knew a lot of other kids at that time who were collected from school by grans- now it's either parents or childminders looking at my older daughter's class) or are still working fulltime themselves. I'd pretty much assumed that the baby boomers were too busy on their yachts to look after grandchildren, tbh...

If I am retired and fit enough I would love to look after my grandchildren (if I get any!!!) but I wouldn't do it full time - maybe 2-3 days a week max. If I was in a financial position to so I would have no problem with helping pay for childcare either if it meant my kids/kids in law could make more of a life for their families.

Obviously, it would all depend on health and finances though.

My mum and mil both share Childcare of DS I work 4 days per week ATM although soon going down to 3 they each take 2days each neither looks after him alone mil lives with aunt and uncle and all 3 of them take a role in looking after him my mum looks after him at my grans house and they both look after him. All unpaid.

Mil and aunt also look after ex next door neighbours child 1day per week unpaid and cousins DS who is severely autistic 2overnights per week again unpaid.

I was badgered to give up breastfeeding by both mum and mil so they could have DS when he was still only weeks old.

Mil and aunt can go holidays etc when ever they want (and do) they just tell all the parents in advance so we can make other arrangements.

I'll be going off on mat leave again in October and have already been -told- asked if GPs will still get DS when I'm off to which I replied I'd like to take advantage of extra time with him and wouldn't want to send him off to GPs while I still have small baby as he may feel neglected but if course I'll visit with both children at least 1nce per week while I'm off.

Neither parents would say they are being exploited as either would happily take DS for all 4/3 days if needed and have both said this.

Also because of the fact that there's always 2 or 3 adults at a time they don't miss out on anything socially or doc appts etc as there's always someone else there and they are happy to switch days take extra/less days each per week as their other commitments dictate.

I do realise that this is a very unusual situation though and appreciate how lucky I am.

However, I'm really hoping to do childcare for my grandchildren if I get any (got to start breeding indoctrination asap). I think it must just depend on the person- and how old they are (if families have children in 20s, then grandparents are only in their 40s/50s so lots of energy, but now most people seem to be waiting until their late 30s, it's maybe more unfair to ask a 75 year old to care for a toddler).

usualsuspect -perhaps I didnt explain very well.

My point is that if the decision to use gp's for free childcare is driven by financial need (which many people have mentioned on here, the parents needing to keep a roof over their heads etc) then in a way, an enormous responsibility is put on the gp's from the word go. In this situation, presumably the parents discuss with the gp's first. After all, they aren't going to launch into having children if they can't afford it. So there must be a conversation along the lines of "We really want to have children, but we both need to carry on working and we can't afford childcare. Therefore we can only do it if you are willing to provide free childcare" (I'm sure such conversation would be more detailed, but I'm just giving the gist!) Automatically, the gp's are placed in a really tricky position, because it's almost as if the issue of the having children in the first place becomes the the gp's responsibility, not just the parents. How can they possibly say no? Even if they secretly harbour a desire to take off around the world, or go and live somewhere else, or even just have time to themselves, they are going to feel the weight of responsibility to provide that childcare. I don't think that's fair. And apart from anything else, what if the gps become ill, or frail, or unable to continue the care? It seems very unwise for parents to have children on the basis that they'll get looked after for free.

If on the other hand, the financial aspect isn;t an issue, then as I and many others have said, build a great relationship with the gp's, do lots together, have the close and loving relationship which can exist between gp's and grandchildren without expecting free childcare.

I want my dcs gps to be just that, their grandparents. Not childminders. I want them to be happy to spend time with my dc and look forward to their visits, not for it to be a chore they feel obliged to do.

My parents have only just finished raising children with my youngest sister having just moved out to uni. Dp and I chose to have our dc and it's our responsibility to arrange childcare for them, I gave up my day job to work evenings to avoid massive childcare costs, I would hate to put upon my dm for weekly childcare, I feel guilty enough asking her to babysit once in a blue moon if there is nothing else we can sort even though she would bend over backwards for my dc and I.
But I feel because she knows I try not to put on her that she wants to help out, but we have a good enough relationship she would say no if she didn't want to, knowing that I wouldnt hold it against her like some parents I know.

A work colleague of mine who is in her late 50s would love to (and can afford to) retire but she says she "darent, because I just know I'd be expected to be a permanent childminder for them all"

Now that's a damn shame!

I agree with Stonecold - this idea that the parents have to manage alone or pay for their children to be cared for by strangers is cultural. My parents stay with us during the week, do the childcare while we are at work but we all work together to provide the best environment for the DC's. We discuss issues as they come up, talk about new ideas/approaches. In their culture, when you had a daughter you started building another story onto your house for her family. My mother was still very involved in her job when DD was little so my Dad was very involved with DD. My poor Mum had to wait years before I managed to have DS so she feels it is her 'turn'!. They would be enormously offended if we offered to pay them, it would be a huge insult - but hopefully living here for a majority of the time reduces their outgoings and I always make sure they go home with a treat for the weekend and DH does their DIY/gardening etc.

Add message | Report | Message poster trixymalixy Tue 10-May-11 21:27:58
We can afford the childcare, we have offered my parents money for looking after the kids but they won't take it. My Mum says it is her pleasure to look after them, just as my grandparents looked after my sister and I. That's what being a family is about.

As they won't take any money we instead pay for them to go on holiday and for shopping, meals out etc when they'll let us!!

I think it depends on the people involved. In case of OP 2-3 days a week, 8am to 6pm, is quite a lot. Sounds like it is having a negative impact on the original mother/daughter relationship too. Having said that her DM is an adult who can say no.

My DF lives with me and does lots of babysitting which enables me to work and put a roof over all our heads. Sometimes he's knackered, sometimes I am fed up, sometimes he gets on my nerves and I get on his, sometimes I thank the stars for him. We do all this for each other as we're a loving family, if anything it has strengthened our realtionship.

lynehamrose ...I'm neither old nor frail or even retired
and do you think life is so black and white ..that peoples circumstances don't change? my dd became a single parent not her choice, so I was more than happy to help her out

you and me live in very different worlds obviously

One last thing to add..

Don't assume that the children ask for childcare. I had actually sorted out nurseries first, and then my mother asked me if she could have the children. Some grandparents do offer / request.

Also, don't assume the reason for doing it is financial. We had intended to use a nursery for DD1 and could afford nursery care for DD1. We chose to let my mother have DD2 because of the relationship. The lower costs whilst a brilliant addition was largely irrelevant to the decision we had made.

usual - I wasn't suggesting you are old or frail!!

My point is simply that if a couple having children is actually dependent on the gp's agreeing to provide free childcare, because the couple both need to work and cannot afford paid care (which is the situation a number of people referred to on here) then I don't see how anyone can possibly deny that it's a very 'loaded' situation. The gp's are going to feel under a lot of pressure to agree, even when they might have other ideas about how they would like to spend their retirement. I just think that if the gp's know how much is at stake on the issue of them providing childminding - ie whether a couple can have another child, or even whether they can have kids at all - then it's not really a 'freewill' decision for them to make, and personally I feel that is a big pressure to place on people who have already completed their child rearing years

I think my Mum would be great looking after my DD but unfortunately she works full-time in the City and even if she didn't I have a younger brother who is 11 so I suspect she would want to make the most of her retirement years!

I think I might find it harder with my in-laws as they parent VERY differently to me and I think I would rather pay for childcare than have them do it - non-issue anyway as they're two hours away - despite that I do occasionally get real pangs of jealously that SIL gets free childcare from in-laws when we spend SO much money on it though.

I can understand some grandparents not wanting to do the child care and thats fair enough ..however I don't think its a bad thing if they do want to ..My children are still my children even if they are all grown up now ,and I will do what ever I can to help them out and they do the same for me

I understand that not all families work like mine though

I think its fine for GPs to look after GC if they genuinely want to. But I do think it needs honesty. Things can change. So a GP who is having no problem looking after GC now, may find it too much and too tiring a couple of years down the line.

All my older friends say that they hit a time when suddenly everything became more of a struggle and they got tired much more easily. When this is depends on health. So some can feel this in early 60's, for others it is 70's or even 80's.

GP's, especially if they are older, may struggle with looking after teenagers, especially if they find it hard to understand the issues for teenagers today. Appreciate this is not a problem for all GP's.

I still have a teenager of my own at home so understand the bloody issues exactly

I appreciate it must be harder for older grandparents though

Of course with many mothers having children later, their children are unlikely to be able to use GP's for childcare. If you don't have a child until you are 35 and your child does the same, the GP's will be 70 or in many cases older before their GC are born.

usualsuspect - my only living GM is 75 and she is not a young 75. She was a teenager in the 50's. She still finds it shocking how many teenage girls dress - although she will concede she is being old fashioned. She doesn't understand and won't use a mobile phone although she will use a computer for email now.

She has very old fashioned ideas of how girls should behave with boys. She thinks universities are for posh people and urged my boys to learn a trade - etc.

I appreciate not all 70 year olds are like this. But although she is fairly healthy, I think she would struggle to care for teenagers on a regular basis.

I think it is up to the individuals. I know many families where this works quite well, and have met several grandparents who are extremely proud of looking after their grandchildren, and playing such an important role.

Both my parents and dh's parents are very involved with our children and are happy to spend lots of time with them, but I would never ask them to offer regular childcare.

I am quite intrigued by the number of people whose parents are happy to do childcare unpaid. Are they retired? That puts them in the fairly oldish category, I would guess, not the young and energetic 40 and 50 somethings who presumably are still at work.

Mine was unpaid. My mum dropped from 5 days working to 3, and did the other 2 days unpaid for me. She was 46 or 47 when she started looking after DS1

My mum looks after ds1 after school 3 days a week, and ds2 one day a week (he's in nursery the other days). I work 3 day per week.

She is retired, but my Dad is still working. I can say without a shadow of a doubt that she'd be highly offended if I offered payment. They are comfortably well off, and she says it gives some much needed structure to her day. She's in her early 60's and very fit & energetic.

We are a very close family, for which I'm grateful. As a thank you, we frequently buy gifts for her, and spend a lot more at Xmas, birthdays etc.

It really works well

Bibbity, my mother works part time. She always has and therefore was happy to have DD on one of her days off (and she had the other day off to herself). She is early 50s and still at work.

My mam was working full-time herself when we found out I was pg. Her immediate response after all the excitement was she would finish work to look after my dd when I returned to work. Her own words were "we don't want strangers looking after her when I can". I completely agreed. I have a very close relationship with my own nana because we lived with her for a few years when I was little whilst my parents saved for their first house and I wanted dd to have that closeness with gps.

I pay mam (nowhere near what nurseries charge!), buy her lots of treats and like to pay for weekends away for parents. I really appreciate what mam does and know she wouldn't have it any other way. We are probably an old fashioned close family.

Mam is great with dd taking her to library classes, swimming lessons and play groups. Dad works shifts with lots of time off so he is often at home during the day to help.

I know my dd is very well cared for by my parents who love her and feel I am very fortunate to not have to worry about her at all.

However I am an only child so only my dd to care for.

But all families and financial situations are different and that's fine.