...to expect support from DP when MIL has annoyed me?

[LynetteScavo72]

I'm in the middle of a big rift with DP following a visit from his mother over the weekend. I am 31+4 and it's our first pregnancy after 10yrs of ttc, a mc and about a yr of IVF before our BFP. We didn't tell MIL about our inf problems, but we know she found out from another family member because she has mentioned it a number of times, though still acts as if she doesn't know at other times (she is neither the sharpest tool nor my best friend, as you can probably tell...) Anyway - she basically knows what a big deal this pg is for us and it's her third grandchild, but she is still acting a bit like it's her own child and it's annoying me! Sorry this is long (and hardly original) but I need a rant.
Firstly, she decided almost as soon as she found out I was pg that it was a boy and she was excited as this was what she wanted. This was the first thing that annoyed me - my experiences with my mc and inf have made me particularly cynical with people thinking they are a bit spiritual/psychic when it comes to conception, and to me this kind of comment is rather offensive as it implies that she thinks she has a superior connection to my child than I do. It is indeed a boy and she has been gloating ever since.
The second thing is that she has been going on and on to my DP about what she has seen in the shops and what she is going to buy. Though I've done a very basic nursery list, I haven't brought anything home yet, nor shopped for any nice extras, as this is something I wanted to leave as late as possible when I know all is well. Also, I have waited a long time to choose things for my nursery and baby and it's probably going to be my only chance! I was therefore a bit put out when MIL came to visit at the weekend and brought something with her...
During the weekend she told my partner that he was to phone her as soon as I went into labour - I immediately said that I would not even be telling my own mother as it might be a long labour and she might turn up at the hospital (ha ha - hint hint) - but she said that her daughter's labour had only been ten mins (my DP and FIL then pointed out that it was in fact 17 hrs but that she didn't tell anyone - MIL chose not to hear this). She got a bit stroppy, saying that she couldn't come to the hospital (she lives too far away) and I said that labour could go on for ages and might (!) be a very stressful time, so it would be difficult to update everyone all the time (point made, I feel!).
Finally, during an anecdote about a recent run-in we had with a rude cashier in the bank, she said, "I hope my little man wasn't getting stressed out", as if I had been terribly irresponsible to allow this to happen. I deliberately "misunderstood" her and gestured towards my DP, saying that he was quite calm and just worried about me - and she said no, she meant "her little man" (pointing at my bump). I said no, that was her little man and this was mine (ha ha gritted teeth). As she left, she said the next time she would be seeing us, she would have her grandson. I said yes, we might have a child, too;)
All was left amicable. I totally get that there are far worse MILs out there and that she is basically a nice though slightly insensitive woman who is excited about her new grandchild (whilst I am a fairly irrational creature who has been embittered by infertility!). I do however feel a bit crowded out by her as she seems to have no awareness that the baby is going to be our desperately long awaited child first and her (third!) grandchild second. Hopefully, though she did not pick up on my attempts to set her straight this weekend, my lovely, sensitive FIL will have, and will gently remind her of the need to remember her place!

So what's the issue? It's my DP. He refuses to acknowledge that I have any right to feel pushed out by his mother. I mentioned the things that have annoyed me about her - but he says I am wrong to feel like this. I have made it clear that I don't think she is horrible or deliberately trying to push me out, but that I have an emotional response to her behaviour - but he's just angry at what he sees as unjustified criticism of his mother. Last night he was shouting whilst I was crying. I now just feel really alone in this situation, and angry with him that he can't be supportive about how I feel - without judging his mother, who is clearly incapable of empathy. We really have reached a stalemate in this and he is just waiting for me to say I was being irrational and had no right to feel that way at the time, which I am not going to do. This does not bode well for the future.
Is it too much to hope for a man to see that his mother might hurt his partner's feelings, even unintentionally? What are your thoughts?

I think your mil sounds really irritating. I don't really get why that's ok within the confines of motherinlawdom. If my mum was annoying me, I could make it clear to her and she'd stop. And vice versa. That's just part of maintaining good relationships, same for my BF.

Your mil doesn't seemto understand your attempts at converying your frustation: if she did the decent thing to do would be to button down. She sounds like my mil tbh, I have heard similar from her. As you say, not too bright.

I think I'd make up with husband and manage mil as you would anyother tricky relationship. I find it very tough as I don't get on with my pil at all- however noone does, and I get on well with my bil and sil parents so I know it's not all me.

Maybe if people do have sons and don't get on with the DILs they should take a look at themselves and their other relationships before deciding Dil is wrong?

I'm not going to comment on whether you 're being unreasonable or not.

All I will add is that I was (and occassionally still am) in your shoes. My MIL is lovely (TOO lovely) and invaded my space in an unbelievable way following the arrival of her first grandchild.

I hope you will believe me when I say that it will get less annoying (prob cos you'll get used to it rather than MIL backing down)

I was a total control freak surrounding sharing my baby. (I have carried him for nine months and physically letting him go was a nightmare for me in the beginning)

You prob are being precious, but I'm not going to have a go at you about that. I grant you my permission to be!

My DH took ages to get used to being on Team Ginger instead of Team MIL. He does support me now. Not that MIL and at war. He gets "it" now though.

Sometimes I felt MN saved my realationships with MIL and DH. Cos I came on here to have a good old rant!!

My MIL is a godsend in the end. My two boys go away to stay with her on hols. She will do anything for her grandkids. I'm sure your MIL means no harm.

Enjoy your pregnancy!

OK firstly are there two lynettescavos on mn?

Secondly - yes your mil may have been a little insensitive but lordy I wanted to shout at my mil for folding a baby vest the wrong way [yes there is a wrong way] when I was in latter stages of pregnancy - its not a time for rational behaviour

But she means well and thats what you need to remember. And yes - I agree with the other posters who said they'd have been so upset if their son had struggled through 10 years of infertility without telling her.

You're being slightly U but I know how you feel. And don't expect your DH to "side" with you. Don't forget it is his mother your are talking about. How would you feel if it were reversed and he was complaining about your mother?

But I do know what you mean about your MIL. Mine is exactly the same. But I don't actually like her. Our DD was her 1st grandchild, and it felt very much like she was trying to take over.

In the end, what I did was to include her as much as possible. We went shopping together. They bought us a travel system and I did get the one we wanted rather than her choice but did it tactfully. We looked at her choice first and gave it a good going over in the shop, got the full sales chat. Then did the same for the one we wanted. After comparing both we got my choice as there was no way she or FIL could have lifted the one they wanted into their car for days out.

We totally disagree about clothes and she always buys DD dresses (which are impractical now she is crawling) but when they come to visit I will always dress her in an outfit she has bought. It costs me nothing and she feel better for it.

MIL was always wanting to buy stuff so when going shopping together we would make choices together (however I was mightily embarassed when she got overly emotional in Mamas & Papas over cots and stuff)

Difficult as it is, try to go with the flow. It won't get any better as your pregnancy continues or once your baby arrives, so better to get used to it now. It honestly won't seem so bad after a while if you just chill out and go with it.

Yanbu. Totally. Prepare to be overwhelmed by your mil's enthusiasm for "her little man" and for you to be overlooked as your son's mother.

In cases like this (I've been there and still am there actually), do not expect your dp to stick up for you. They won't. They don't get it.

We do. Some grandmothers are naturally enthusiastic as grandmothers. Others see it as an opportunity to mother a child again. To live that motherhood again.

And it really shocked me how unkind they can be when you step in and tell them, "No, actually you are not weaning my child at 12 weeks," or "Sorry but I'm breastfeeding. No formula. Thanks for bringing it over though." (unasked for) or "Actually, I've just had a c-section. I do mind if you bring your brother, his wife and their three children with you without any notice."

Good for you, op for standing up for yourself. Be polite but firm. But don't expect your dp to stand up for you in this. And don't be worn down by ludicrous demands. Luckily, you sound like someone who can stand up for herself. It's your child, your responsibility and you will make the decisions. Hopefully with your dp too but if he rolls over under his mum's wishes, then you'll have to grow his pair, so to speak.

Thanks - and yes he did. Thanks so much for all your support over all this. Think I will stick to other sites from now on as I can't really believe the reactions of some on here. Feel v sorry for their dils/sils! Take care xx

Previous message meant for DuellingFanjo, btw.

Why are you leaving? Bit of an over reaction

Hey OP, stick around. MN is fantastic source of knowledge and support, but AIBU is a bit robust.

But you may want to re-think your name, as there is a already user called LynetteScavo (hence the "Lynette I didn't know you where pregnant" posts).

The majority of the posts here, though saying YABU, were pretty sensitive and gentle.

All the best for the rest of your pregnancy.

You really are overreacting to leave because some people disagree with you - it is a very silly way to be (and I was one of the ones agreeing with you)

Don't be someone who is so sensitive - you are going to need to stop now you are going to be a mum!

RAW - I just mean I don't intend posting about such things again on here. Other websites aimed at those who have experienced infertility are more support groups than anything, and we all understand how each other feels even if we are not really being fair on the other person ( and know it). So many on here make judgements over things they know nothing about, and assumptions about who knows what and why and I bet she told so and so and I bet she wouldn't let this poor man talk about her mother like this and I bet he really wanted to talk to his mother but she wouldn't let him etc. All these were completely be false assumptions but I gave up explaining because with each comment there is a whole background of experience and resentment and in my wobbly moment yesterday I touched many raw nerves! When I was in the real depths of despair, like so many other women in similar situations, I found it hard to be around anyone with children. Was this fair on them? No. Was it rational? No. Was it a perfectly understandable emotional response to all that had happened? Of course. But if you have been on a the receiving end of the cold shoulder from a woman who has recently lost a child, it's obviously annoying to you because you haven't done anything to deserve it. Really, on mumsnet, you are asking for trouble if you post on AIBU because you are effectively asking to be judged and that's what people do, from whatever their own perspective may be! Someone even said they though I had issues with ten years of infertility! So not the best site for such personal things, really!

I do (sort of) understand as my sister would dearly love a child but has had 11 miscarriages. She has also had cancer treatment so there is no chance she will ever be a mummy.

I am blessed with two boys and my mother (only grandchildren) was over the moon, my MIL (my two are GC 7 and 9) was also very excited especially with my DS1 as it was her sons first child.

I think all families get excited about new arrivals and also your DH has gone through the same 10 years as you so I would think he wants his mother to share in the joy of his first child.

Good luck with everything and try to cut your MIL some slack

Lynette - it is true that you are asking for trouble opinions if you post on AIBU, and some of those opinions will be unjustified, other opinions will hurt because they are a bit too true but don't want to hear them, others will be rubbish. And sometimes people don't read the OP properly. IMO that's not a good reason to leave. It may be a good reason not to post on AIBU, though

There are many other Topic areas you can post on, where people maybe take a different approach

FWIW I think people's opinions have been pretty balanced on here

I did wince a bit on the first page at how many YABUs you were getting, tho you were so obviously feeling raw. Even when you explained further, you were still getting people replying to the OP

do stick around- oh, dooooo! I wish I'd had mn when I was pregnant

I'd just namechange, to avoid confusion, and go to the pregnancy topic for now. Avoid aibu like the plague!

Can't really stand the attitude of 'that's his mother you're talking about' myself. OK, perhaps in this instance Lynette's dp was right not to side with Lynette- although he sounds like an insensitive arse for not understanding that it is possible to disagree with someone yet comfort them at same time!-but what of those times when any sane human being can see that mil is the one in the wrong?! Should he just side with his mum then regardless cos it's his mum?!

Jeez, men who side with their mum always regardless of circumstances should not be allowed to form relationships. They should stay at home with mummy for rest of days!
I always made this absolutely clear to my ex-husband, and fair play, he did stand up for me against the witch ex-mil.
For all her good Catholic values, the concept of 'leaving and cleaving'- in other words, when you marry your wife now comes before mother was alien to her (possibly owing to her complete arrogance and narcissistic personality)
Yeah, I know people will say, 'But he is your ex' but the reasons we split had nothing to do with mil.

Lynette, you may not be feeling strong at the moment, but in the instances where a neutral party agrees that it is your mil in the wrong, not you, your dp really, really has to stand up for your. Unless of course, he wants to end up back home to mummy.

Wamster, agree completely that DHs shouldn't side with their mums just because. Or their wives . Surely they should be free to decide the rights and wrongs of it themselves, as long as they acknowledge feelings and try to encourage better understanding on both sides?

I know when I've got annoyed with my PILs (ironically, for being entirely UNinterested in my DCs) DH has agreed it's not what he'd like, but it's the way they are so no point getting angry, for example.

And in return, I accept that kicking off about it would hurt only one person - my beloved DH.

Not sure about bringing a third party in to arbitrate for two married adults, but if they both agree then why not?

Lynette, sorry you feel got at. People do make assumptions because they only have the facts you give them. Which did sort of sound a certain way, and as if YWBU. But on the bright side, the MN jury was pretty unanimous that your DH was in the wrong not comforting you. And I don't know if the 'issues regarding infertility' comment was meant to sound as snippy as it did (hope not) but you did say as much yourself.

FWIW I re-read my heavily-pg AIBU thread when DS1 was about a year old, and suddenly saw what the YWBU posters were getting at.

Sorry haven't read the whole thread, but if anyone, grandmother or not, described my long-awaited unborn child as 'her little man' I would probably strangle them.

The third party can be a neutral, anonymous people like those on mn. Let's be honest, the mil/dil relationship can get fraught, we should all pick our battles with our mils carefully and recognise when they are being unreasonable and when it is us. No man should stick up for his wife if she is clearly in the wrong, but he shouldn't stick up for his mother if it is her that is clearly in the wrong.

The problem is that both dils and mils expect the loyalty to lie with them automatically and regardless of circumstances. A mistake.

I never expected my ex to stick up for me if I was being unreasonable, my ego thought he should buy the sensible advice of others told be I was being unreasonable, but if it was my mil that was clearly being unreasonable then I'm afraid I insisted upon it.

That's a disgraceful thing to say, Changing2011, so I am reporting your post.

have also reported changing2011's vile post

Haven't read the whole thread - just first and last but not surprised OP is off if there are any other hideous comments like the one from changing2011 - you should apologise for that!

OP - you know you are having an irrational response and while your DH doesn;t have to agree he should comfort you. I do think it's different for the ones who carry the babies though. Not a popular opinion but it's mine. I'm not dismissing the heartache felt by men who lose/cannot have DC but in my experience it is more raw/irrational for women.

I agree DomeDon, although men obviously do suffer the emotional side of infertility treatment and miscarriage it is always the woman who has to undergo the physical parts of it, even when it is the man who is infertile.

good to see that mumsnethq were very quick with deleting that rude post.

"The problem is that both dils and mils expect the loyalty to lie with them automatically and regardless of circumstances. A mistake."

Exactly! Unless you choose to marry a man without the capacity for independent thought.