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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Need advice badly!!!

383 replies

worriedandneedsomeadvice · 25/04/2011 16:54

I've just been at the garden centre with my 7 month DD and my 4 year old cocker spaniel.

A man bent down to stroke my dog before I could tell him not to and my dog went for him. Badly. His hand was dripping blood immediately.

I apologised and apologised and my BIL (the manager of the garden centre) took over to make sure the man was okay so I could take the dog (and DD) out.

He's been a bit growly lately but has never done anything like this before.

I'm shaking. I don't know what's going to happen and I don't know what to do.

He's fantastic with my DD, gentle as a lamb with her but as I said, lately he's been growly, especially at children he doesn't know so I've made sure to keep him on a lead and mostly just at home. But he loves BIL so I always take him to the garden centre when we go...

I can't believe this has happened. I don't know what to do. I'm waiting for BIL to call me, but the mans hand looked terrible... Absolutely dripping with blood. It was so quick.

Please give me some advice if you can??

OP posts:
FuppyGish · 26/04/2011 21:49

You even say:

"I will NEVER have my dog destroyed. I know my dog and would never ever do this. It doesn't matter how many of you post on here that it is what you would do."

Never? Even if he bites your baby or someone elses child? Nice.

Original poster
worriedandneedsomeadvice · 26/04/2011 21:51

"I apologised and apologised and my BIL (the manager of the garden centre) took over to make sure the man was okay so I could take the dog (and DD) out."

This is from my first post Rostbeef - was it really that hard to find? Hmm

OP posts:
LostMyIdentityAlongTheWay · 26/04/2011 21:53

this thread is running and running... incidentally, what about that fox that jumped into a cot and bit the child's face. Might be worth thinking about... don't think a cocker would be less agile?

I make my previous point. OP asked for advice. She's gotten it - in spades. If people can't persuade her to their way of thinking, why not just give it a rest now? There are people who are pro dogs etc... and those that aren't. I'm not. I'm 100% a cat person and personally can't stand dogs. But whatever.... Look at all the actions that the OP has taken in response to her dog biting and drawing blood. Apart from waving a flag saying 'wooohooooo, I'm a wannabe criminal, come take my dog and PTS' or similar, what else is she to do? The police will step in if the handler thinks it appropriate. Otherwise, the MAN that was bitten hasn't apparently yet done anything. OK, were it a child, the parents probably would, but as the 'victim' hasn't, it's his call now, surely? We can all have our opinions (and for this, god bless us all, else WTF else would we do with our valuable time other than browse on MN?) but sides are now entrenched, and what's the point of continuing?

God. I don't even like dogs and I'm saying this. Give the poor woman a break!

rostbeef · 26/04/2011 21:53

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

Animation · 26/04/2011 21:57

Yes - the OP probably needs time for it all to sink in.

Jellykat · 26/04/2011 22:04

My Golden Retriever bit my DS2, 6 years ago, on his face.
DS2 required stitches, and has 2 scars..

We all learnt a lot that day, it was my, my DSs, and my dogs fault..

Nothing like it has ever occured again.

Worried has done a lot for the future, it is her dog, her child and her decision.

LostMyIdentityAlongTheWay · 26/04/2011 22:07

Oh come on, rost, that's a bit out of order... that's really not a nice thing to say. Personally, I 100% disagree with OPs action to keep the dog and let it sleep under the cot - but it is HER responsibility and not my child, so whatever... BUT she has had quite a lot of shit thrown at her and tbh I'm not entirely surprised she has started to get a bit stroppy with some of the stuf.f

I really do think you can't accuse somebody on MN of being nasty if you're not met them. SUrely - come on, that's just not fair...

cricketballs · 26/04/2011 22:08

after reading through this whole thread a number of points come to mind -

  1. for those who say their dog has issues with chidren etc - dogs need to be taught where their place is; stopping children from gong near food etc shows a dog that they are 'above'children in the pecking order and this will lead to agression on the dogs part as they are putting the children in their place
  1. op was right in going to the vets; our spaniel began a 'low' growling episode recently which was totally out of character and she was suffering with an illness; she is back to her daft self now!
  1. many owners do not understand the breed of dog they are taking on. for example, our springer spaniel was given to a rescue centre as they thought she had issues.......the issues they quoted were the normal character of a springer spaniel
  1. for those who state that they don't allow their DC near dogs etc; then you are just causing more problems for the future. All children need to be aware of the way in which they should act around animals to enable them to enjoy/be safe etc rather than creating a phobia in the future
  1. on terms of the incident; op - as you have admitted that your dog was not its normal self, and you wanted to stop the man from petting him then you should have been more careful in public (when ours become growly then she was nuzzled until we went to the vets). But you should not rule out the need to re-home the dog if there is no medical reason etc as there are many homes out there suitable for your dog if nothing works.

In fact, we had a dog re-homed when I was pg withe the youngest as she became dominent over children and although we loved her very much, it was more important for our/childre/the dogs health and life that she lived with people without young childrem

Vallhala · 26/04/2011 22:33

Worried has been given details of some first class behaviouralists whom she immediately contacted and who are reputable and very well respected. I can guarantee that.

And btw, my three dogs (large, two of which are popularly used as security/guarding breeds although the original purpose of the breed was herding) generally sleep in my bedroom. If not they're to be found on DD1s bed (DD2's is too high or they'd be there too). Never had an issue, they know I'm boss through nothing but kindness and they are perfect family dogs. All this talk that a dog shouldn't be in bedrooms and should know his place is tommyrot.

GSD1 currently on sofa with DD1, Labrador on sofa beside me, GSD2 asleep by my feet, his choice.

Morloth · 26/04/2011 23:58

Are cockers the ones being bred with their skulls to small to fit their brains properly?

Honestly, I would probably rehome the dog. I have only ever had working dogs though so don't really get the 'dog being as important as my baby' thing. We were often nipped by the dogs but usually when we were doing something stupid and being kelpies/heelers they were capable of doing so without breaking skin.

Have had to shoot sheep killers before though, but that is because you can't supervise sheep.

I would cut out the sleeping under the cot at the very least, in the circumstances that seems very silly.

Let's hope it was a oned off. You have been very lucky that the man has not taken it further. I would have.

ChippingInLovesEasterEggs · 27/04/2011 00:22

I am amazed that worried is still replying to people at all, let alone with so much patience.

I hope those of you saying that the only answer is to either rehome or have the dog killed don't have any animals. I also hope your children don't ever step out of line if your first response to a problem is 'get rid'.

Worried I hope it goes well tomorrow - let us know x

ChippingInLovesEasterEggs · 27/04/2011 00:24

Val what were the 'owners' of those GSD's thinking/wanting?? Both the dogs sound lovely, even under less than desirable circumstances... I honestly don't know how you do what you do without a trail of (human) bodies in your wake.....

wotnochocs · 27/04/2011 00:25

Seriously get rid of it.

in all these awful dog attacks the owners always say what a lovely dog it was and had never done anything like that before.

You've had a warning,heed it.

Vallhala · 27/04/2011 00:40

Chipping, you have no idea how much I'm tempted to run riot with a machete sometimes!

So far today I've dealt with and helped prevent someone taking a dog who has deliberately lied to rescue although any homechecker would have approved them on the basis of that homecheck. Had they not been rumbled they would have ended up unable to train a dog with (non aggressive) issues, making the dog miserable and likely to be returned to rescue within a week, probably lose them their neighbour's goodwill, their own job and potentially leading to a child being harmed through their neglect of the dog and ignorance.

I've passed on an appeal for the rescue of 30 horses and Shetlands which are due to be killed by a farmer owing to the recession and the owners not wanting/being able to keep them.

I've advised on here and put the OP in touch with some excellent behaviouralists that I would happily trust my own dogs with.

I've offered to help as much as I can a fellow rescuer in a problem concerning abuse from another individual (not, I hasten to say, from a rescuer or anyone concerned with animal rescue).

I've passed on information about a dog warden problem to someone who can sort it and advised an owner who "can't cope" with their dog now they are having a baby and want rid... hopefully they'll take the advice as the dog is not a problem and they're over-thinking it).

And I am officially pissed off with numpties!!!

StayingDavidTennantsGirl · 27/04/2011 00:41

She is heeding the warning, wotnochocs - she's asked for advice, taken the dog to the vet, is going to muzzle it when it is out of the house, and is supervising it when it is near the baby.

Morloth · 27/04/2011 00:41

ChippingInLovesEasterEggs

"I also hope your children don't ever step out of line if your first response to a problem is 'get rid'."

See, I just can't get my head around this thinking. I love my cat, but it pales in comparison to how I feel about my kids, not even close. If I thought there was any chance my cat could seriously injure one of my kids she would be gone in a heartbeat. No question at all. DS1 has been scratched but as she is so small it isn't an issue. DS2 hasn't had much to do with her since being mobile as she has been in quarantine. The kids are not allowed to bother her, she is a bit cranky at the moment because of the trauma of the move so I am ensuring that she doesn't also have to deal with DS2.

We don't have a dog at the moment (mostly because the cat doesn't like them) but when she dies (and at 14 I suspect she hasn't got much longer, even though she appears fine, she is slowing down a lot). We will probably get a dog.

Will research the breed, take out pet insurance, take it to puppy school, train it properly, ensure it has the best care, all of that. But the moment I believe it is actually a danger to my kids (not for silly reasons, like walking away, that is just ridiculous) then the dog is away from the kids. That's it really. I wouldn't allow an abusive man to live in my home and I wouldn't allow a dog I thought was dangerous in either.

I simply cannot grasp loving an animal as much as I love my kids. Don't get it.

piprabbit · 27/04/2011 01:18

Glad the man is OK and the dog seems to be well.

I really hope that the OP has bought a muzzle today - she hasn't mentioned it.
I also hope that she rethinks letting the dog sleep in the bedroom, while the biting is still unexplained at least.

Good luck to you all.

hollyoaks · 27/04/2011 08:52

Morloth - I completely agree with you. A dog cannot be compared to your child and I don't understand this thinking either. I understand having love for the dog and therefore rehoming rather than being pts but I cannot fathom why it would be allowed to stay in the house never mind under the cot.

Secondly, if a human was an unpredictable danger to my dc they wouldn't be stepping foot in my house and I doubt anyone on here would disagree with that.

FuppyGish · 27/04/2011 09:19

Morloth - totally agree.

Original poster
worriedandneedsomeadvice · 27/04/2011 09:27

Morloth "DS1 has been scratched but as she is so small it isn't an issue"

That's where we differ - my dog has never so much as breathed on my baby wrong. Your cat has already injured your child.

Why can yours stay when you're calling for mine to be strung up??

Hypocrite.

OP posts:
oohlaalaa · 27/04/2011 09:28

Cant help much, my parents had something similar happen, where their border collie nipped a haemophiliac.

After this they had their dog snipped, and kept him on lead at all times, when out and about (as you should). Their dog had nipped a couple of people previously, but nothing serious until this incident, and has not nipped for at least 9 years now. He was quite young at the time (less than 3 years old).

hollyoaks · 27/04/2011 09:51

Worried - your dog hasn't scratched someone though, it's bite someones hand to the point it was dripping with blood and needed stitches. It was no warning bite and I would hate to think what damage that could have been to someones face.

RumourOfAHurricane · 27/04/2011 09:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Caron1968 · 27/04/2011 09:55

Well I have just spent the last 30 minutes reading this thread and am impressed at the lucidity of the majority of posters. The occasional poster appears to be deliberately provocative but hey ho that is part of open forum life.
What amazes me is how some of the main protaganists who have very intersting informed views occaisonally lapse into abusive childish idiots. There was always going to be two oppsing views on this. "The dog is misunderstood ahh bless it lets make it all better by treating it as a sentient human being" and the "All dogs are evil and just waiting to tear young childrens faces off".
I have had dogs in the past which have been well looked after and have never bitten anybody they have been around children and every possible precaution was taken to never put the children in a position where they could of been hurt. But the fact that I had to think about those precautions just showed how dogs are animals and have a primal hunting and survival instinct.
I work in a large A&E dept and have lost count of the number of serious injuries inflicted on adults and children by dogs, I have seen the horrific death of a child and as a consequence would never have a dog while I have young children.
I appreciate that the majority of dogs are loving and docile but there will always be that undercurrent that could be unleashed.
Yes the original OP is doing everything she can do to ensure that her dog doesn't bite again but dogs are as highly unpredictable as human beings. Can she be sure her beloved dog doesn't bite her, her child or some unsuspecting bystander in the future.

Original poster
worriedandneedsomeadvice · 27/04/2011 10:17

My dog has never hurt my baby or shown her any aggression.

And plenty of babies are smothered by cats who can usually jump into cribs.

Morloth - I think you should rehome your cat. For all our safety.

OP posts: