is it pot luck to get an "easy" baby or is it down to parenting?

[BarbieLovesKen]

This came up at lunch today. Im 31 weeks pregnant and said to some colleagues that I really hope we are as lucky with this baby as we have been with our dd and ds. Aside from the obvious hope that this baby is as healthy as our 2 have been, I'm hoping its as "easy" one too.

We are one of those couples who have just been completely flukey when it comes to having an easy time with children (so far!). I dont mean to put that across in a braggy way, I genuinely mean we dont know we're born/ cant sympathise with others at times as we just havent experienced what its like to have a hard time. I suppose theres no point in pretending we're martyrs when we havent a clue.

My cousin has a 4 and a half year old and an (almost) 2 year old, she works full time and is constantly exhausted - as shes up every hour with one or the other child during the night. I feel really sorry for her - Im very careful not to mention what good sleepers mine are etc but her mum is our CM so she knows. Its the same with eating/ tantrums etc.. I think shes pissed off alot of the time with me to be honest and had said when I was pregnant with ds (more than once) that "I hope this one gives you hell". (joke)

My mum and other family members etc reckon this is no ones fault but hers and her DHs (which I think is a little unfair tbh) - that the children are "ruined" and its all down to parenting.

Colleagues at lunch today responded with something similiar after I said I hoped we'd be as lucky again. They said that luck has absolutely nothing to do with it and its down to the parenting/ how relaxed the parents are etc...

Im genuinely prepared to have this one scream every night for a year but am continuously being told (assuming all is well and healthy) that this wont happen, given the way our current dc are.

I have to admit that I am slightly beginning to come around to that school of thought - I wouldnt go so far as to say that its a parents "fault" if their children are really hard work but am starting to think that parenting has to be a huge factor. (Im going to eat my words, arent I )

I dont even know if its an AIBU to be honest, I just find it interesting. Its came up alot.

Well "easy" means all sorts of things at all stages.

My DD (22 mths) was not easy in the sense that she wasnt a great sleeper until a couple of months ago - other kids had been sleeping through much earlier. I couldnt put her down for the first 8 weeks - she lived in the sling.

However she was very easy in that she was a great feeder for both bfing and solids and stuck religiously to her line on "The Graph", is naturally reasonably cautious so I don't worry about her having accidents, and is sunny and easy to jolly out of a strop/tantrum. She's a great communicator which means she doesn't get too frustrated/stroppy and she is fun.

I don't think all of that is pot luck, but probably some of it is!

I had 2 easy ones. Like, really easy. Good sleepers, good eaters, healthy, entertain themselves, good showmanship (i.e they are always on their best behaviour when out and the old harridans are watching!) and I can't really fault them.

I'm sure its not me. I think general environment can be a bit to do with it, i.e. I'm sure half the reason my daughter was so easy was because my son was already there entertaining her, etc. My son was also easy but I think I had to wave a few toys in his face when he was 6 months old type age than my daughter due to him being the only child.

Sleeping and eating is more "born with" than other things I think. Picky eaters (truly picky I mean) are born not made, though they can be facilitated by bad/selective parenting.

Dogey sleeping can be grown out of with the right management but some will always be a bit dubious.

General clingyness has got to be a personallity trait due to age and developmental stage...also grown out of. With a bit of influence from parenting through generating security I guess.

Everyone told me number 2 would be a nightmare and she wasn't, she was easier still if anything. But I daren't have number 3.

(PS: At the moment they are upstairs playing with some stuff, possibly my paper recycling bag, from the sound of it, but I haven't heard a peep out of them since we got home - they are 18 months and 3 and a half, so play well together even at this age. That could change soon I guess?)

About 90% luck, I reckon. Although anyone that has an easy baby reckons that it's all down to their fabulous parenting.

DD1 just did not respond to a routine at all. She had the same bedtime routine for months and months, and was obviously going to bed at the right time (really grouchy if she had to stay up later, for example). But she still hated bedtime, and screamed, and wouldn't sleep through. We were advised to "get her into a routine" so bloody often and no-one with an easy baby believed me that we had. I was so that not only did I have no sleep, that everyone assumed that it was my fault.

Fast forward to DD2, and although she doesn't need as much sleep as any decent baby (or toddler) would, she responded so well to the routine. It made bedtimes so much easier. DH and I were looking at each other going "aha!, so that's how it is with a normal baby!".

1 dream baby followed by a nightmare. Every aspect has been difficult/different - from potty training to weaning to eating to behaviour. SO different

Pot luck.
There is no feeling like the schadenfreude you feel when a smug couple of a perfect first child (who have given you all their best tips, unasked for) get a difficult second child. Evil but true.

However, another way of looking at it is that some people make so much of a meal of it all, they are painful to hear. And you look at their child and he/she's perfectly normal. I was a bit like this at times when ds was younger

Well this thread has completely rubbished any ideas I had then .

Im also due a horror!!. Some really interesting points though.

Working I had relatively straight forward, uncomplicated births - Im now wondering if that does play a huge factor..

I think a lot of it is luck - but there is something to the theory.

I had a v. traumatic birth and a baby who was very difficult - a collicky screamer. However, I always jumped to her every squeak, night and day. I think that if I had not been through such hell, and had been more relaxed, I'd have slept better myself and not always responded instantly. That might have meant that she slept better, which in turn would have helped everything else. There are lots of vicious circles with overtired babies.

Also, I'd read some of the mendacious nonsense written on MN about leaving a baby to cry, and was influenced by it. I now realise that some friends who claim never to have left a baby to cry, don't consider "grizzling" crying . So they can say, e.g. that" X was always a great sleeper, but would grizzle for ten minutes or so when you first put him down".

Or, "I don't believe in sleep training, or leaving a baby to cry, but I had to have a shower every day after putting Y down for her nap, and she would have stopped grizzling by the time I got out".

I had an easy baby, slept through from 6 weeks, easy going, and eats everything. I'm putting it all down to our excellent parenting skills.... that's until the next child comes along and karma bites me in the arse. .

I'm sure it's luck. DD was a very laidback baby despite her mummy being an over anxious, pill popping control freak at the time. I feel loads calmer with this pregnancy so hope it doesn't mean this baby is going to be a tricky little sod individual

It is mostly luck, BUT I think parental personality informs whether you experience your children/their behaviour as easy or not!

I mean you could have a child who doesn't sleep through and is really picky with food, but if you aren't bothered by that kind of thing or don't work or don't need much sleep yourself, you may still find them easy to parent.

"We were advised to "get her into a routine" so bloody often and no-one with an easy baby believed me that we had. I was so that not only did I have no sleep, that everyone assumed that it was my fault."

This drove me crazy too - I knew that I was held personally responsible for my own extreme sleep deprivation. And that added salt to the wound, because I felt I couldn't moan about it without people quietly tutting (my own mother made it so obvious, while saying that DD got it from me, I was a terrible sleeper who sometimes woke ^twice" a night, as a baby). DD went weeks where she never slept more than 45 minutes at a stretch.

With hindsight I regret that I did not act out my fantasy of the time - of just booking into a travellodge for an uninterrupted night's sleep. I think it would have done us all a world of good.

I think it's luck, they come with their own personalities and all the foibles that brings!

For us, DD1 was very easy, DD2 was colicky and it took us months to find a bedtime routine that worked. She would sleep through, but getting her to sleep was a nightmare!
DS is so easy, he's an angel, eats well, is generally well behaved, and adores everyone. Little sod won't sleep though! Bed at 7:30, he'll sleep till about 2, then be up every hour till 6:30. He's 18m.

I'm so tired i could cry. :(

It's all very well to say that it's how you experience the baby too, but after a while the sleep deprivation will get to you. I knew that babies cannot be relied on to sleep through until 6 months and it's luck if they do. But after a while my mind started to shut down, as I was just to damn tired all the time.

Sleep deprivation is used as a form of torture in some parts of the world.

I think theres something in the birth impacting how they are as a baby too. Maybe it's just conincidence in my case though

It is nothing but bad luck to have a baby with reflux, wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. DS2 never stopped screaming for first 6 months which made average DS1 seem like a dream.

unwind you see I do completely agree with you on that one - it was ridiculous for anyone to make you feel responsible for your own sleep deprivation. With a small baby thats just silly. That said, and as horrible and as judgy as I may sound, I just cant help myself secretly throwing my eyes up to heaven at my cousin being constantly exhausted for being up 5 times a night with a 5 year old. I do think to some level shes responsible for her own sleep deprivation in this case.

I could just be a bitch though, and my next child will make me eat my words.

yes and no. i will recount my experiences trying not to sound like a wanker.

i find dd very easy and she has been like this from day one. she latched on stright away and we had no bf problems ( i KNOW i am really lucky and try to pay it forward by being a peeru supporter). i shunned anything like trying to put her in a routine but i tell you she WANTED to be she who must not be named baby and slept and fed like clockwork and pretty much still does. however i have had compliments in the past that i am a super calm mum (dunno why because i was ridiculously stressed when i was preg and terrified this would rub off on dd). also i am on my own with dd alot due to dh working away and although this is hard in osme ways its much easier for me to keep to her routine and just move at a baby friendly pace. the only thing i conciously stick to is that if she is a bit off colour iwill keep her in for a couple of days and make sure she gets enough rest, even if i miss out on company/activities. i find this works for me. i think being able to make all the parenting decisons helps too. alone i mean

i have a dear friend with a dc the same age as dd who is the total opposite - nowhere near lseeping through the night at 18 months and a v up and down hard work child. my friend's hose for various reasonas operates in a constant state of tension. some intentional and some not. i am not criticising my friend she is fab and a v competant parent but the atmosphere is very different to our house and i would speculate this has affected the temperament of her dc who is rarely v relaxed.

i think its partly luck but i think there are contributing factors as to whether things get better/worse - some we can control and some we cannot

It really annoys me when pukey babies (with no pain or crying) get labelled as having reflux.
(Just getting this off my chest as SIL did this.)
It makes me think that the parents have unrealistic expectations.

Pot luck i think. I am thinking of a friend of mine who had a really easy first baby - he was a dream and was easy throughout toddlerhood too. Then she had her dd and she was very opposite and in my firends words "a bit of a nightmare compared to ds."

I have just read a book called Toddler taming and there is a bit in the book about easy babies and different temperments in a child.

Oh, it's both, but it's absolutely not just down to parenting. Useful analogy I read somewhere, think of your child as coming with its own number on the easiness behaviour scale - from -5 to +5. You can have a +4 easy baby, do a lot wrong on the parenting front (whatever 'wrong' might mean, I don't know the answer to that one! inconsistent and very anxious maybe?), and end up taking them down a couple of points, so you end up with a +2 easy child. Or you can have a -4 really difficult tendencies baby, get lots and lots right on the parenting front (again I'm not specifying what 'getting it right' might mean - wish I knew!), and get them up a whole 4 points - but they're still only at 0, so the easy baby with bad parenting is still easier than the difficult baby who gets great parenting. (I think of this for comfort when dealing with tantrums in public ...)

Oh I am explaining this badly but hope you see what I mean!

FWIW, I have 2, at opposite ends of the ease / difficultness scale in different ways. They've had slightly different experiences but were born pretty close together and parented pretty similarly, as far as I can see.

Definitely pot luck.

DS1 had a traumatic birth and was unputdownable for the first few weeks - needed to be held, fed, reassured all the time and wouldnt stop crying. But by 6 weeks was like a different child - generally contented, smile at strangers, charming, good feeder, generally quite good sleeper - but crap with solids. At 5 he's like that too now - lovely boy, charming, friendly, open, great sleeper and while better with food, periodically crap eater.

DS2 had a lovely calm water birth. As a baby I found he was quite easy - much more serious than his brother and less ready to smile, more attached to me, but great feeder, not so great sleeper (but would self settle most times) and v curious about the world. Then at 6and a half months he started crawling and the toddler years began - and he's much more hard work than he was as a baby. Very independent, creative, practical, funny but not as sociable as his brother. Thankfully at 18 months he finally cracked being a good sleeper - still very curious about the world though...

Hmm well dd had colic for 2 months, didn't sleep through the night til she was 2 and didn't eat solids til she was 13 months so wasn't the easiest BUT was generally a very contented and happy baby who I could take anywhere and who would go to anyone.

DS on the other hand was a nightmare who screamed 24/7, didn't sleep for more than 20 minutes at a time and was always miserable.

If anyone had told me that was my fault I probably would have punched them.

Meant to add, despite dd's non sleeping or eating tendancies I did find her easy because she was so happy and smiley and interactive the rest of the time. But because ds' only response to the world was to SCREAM (and SCREAM and then SCREAM some more) I found the lack of sleep much harder to deal with and tbh I would defy anyone to remain a calm and chilled out parent under those circumstances.

Pot luck. Definitely.