to wonder what IPOAT stands for?

[Hullygully]

We had the right idea being Amish.

Or he could say he's part Japanese and has a reduced ability to metabolise alcohol. Can he pass for part Japanese?

I am not ready for jokes.

Sorry, Hully... But I am serious about the watch and wait - if he can resist trying to dive in to any one group, remain open and friendly, he may see where he fits in without having to try, iyswim? Because trying to fit in, pretending, is a recipe for disaster, and somehow I can't see a child of yours wanting to do it for long. It's tedious and no fun.

Yes, I agree. The problem is compounded by the fact that he joined his last school halfway through and spent a whole year miserable before he felt part of things. He got full of despair when I said about waiting and watching that he would have to go through it again.

He asked me earlier if we were going to have a talk, I said that we were, but not immediately.

In fact that's part of the prob too - he is a bit different (like his dear Mamma), but he doesn't want to be. He doesn't prize it at 14. He wants to be like the others.

Hully, can absolutely see your worry founded in your family history (something that I share). But DS, though only 14, is also shaped by your and DH's nurture, not just by his matrilinear nature. Does that make sense? I mean, he is what you both have brought him up to be, in that loving and thoughtful environment - he is NOT just going to repeat patterns from your family's past.

Having said that, there's no doubt that these parents behaved irresponsibly, and I get your point about worrying over how he is to confront such situations in future. Talk and trust. But not easy at all.

Sorry for all platitudes (and have to go as old friend just turned up), but hugs galore for you and yours.

It is hard being different at school. And you do just want to fit in and not think so deeply about everything.

Without wanting to put pressure on you hullster, I do think the way you approach this will make a big difference. Try really hard not to come across as dictating who he should be friends with and what he can and can't do.

Instead let him know how proud you are of what an intelligent, focused and self assured young man he is becoming. How you know it can be tough at times but being true to who he is and having the balls to be his own person is what will ultimately make him well liked and respected.

Be honest about your fears re your father and brother. It's finding that balance between setting firm and clear boundaries and having a 'grown up' type chat that makes him feel confident about making the right decisions and being master of his own destiny type thing.

Agree with Gibbon - it's what I meant by 'Talk and trust', but she of course put it better.

Hully, does 'gulps' mean you have had a chat, or that you are gathering thoughts in preparation for it soon? Either way - know you can do it, and do it well. (No pressure there, then...)

More hugs. x

If all else fails, you could tell him it's forbidden in JuLuBu. Until you reach 18, and then you have to drink copious amounts.

Sorry, Habb.

So, we had a Talk this morning (pretty much along your lines, Beri, with Pag's lines in the sand thrown in), and it went along ok. I explained about father etc and how I would have to trust him and his dsis, and said about being cool and not drinking and getting respect for being his own person, and how we are proud of him and all that. He said, all sad, that he is a bit fed up of being his own person as it doesn't get respect, he says that, for example, he stands up for the bullied ones (he is big for his age) and tells the spiteful ones off, but this doesn't get him respect. I said I was sure it did but they didn't show it...and that anyway it was important to do the right thing for its own sake and to be a shepherd rather than a sheep, at which point I got terribly tangled up in my own metaphors and he went to school, but I think we reached an understanding.

No doubt more will follow.

Thank you all for concern, support and advice. XXXXXX (that should be one each and if not you'll have to share)

I see his point, but it's hard to distinguish between proper respect and - what's the word? - people being superficially impressed. Ages ago there was a thread about a woman who was really struggling with her children, and one really good tip she got was to imagine she was constantly being filmed for a reality parenting programme. It's struck me as a great general tip - if you see yourself on a TV programe, would you be impressed with yourself or think you were a tosser? And it's worth asking ds - he does all this really fucking good decent stuff, and I bet he'd think that guy on TV was cool, whereas all the in-with-the-cool-crowd shit may look and feel good when you're in the middle, but as soon as you step back it can look very different.

The path he's been following is a hard one, no doubt, but it is utterly, utterly cooler to be your own person. Shame he can't see how people will look back on him in 10-20 years time!

Darling girl, that went well.

I really do, really do understand.
I had the conversations with ds about why is he always the loser kid
he had food issues and sensory issue too which just made him stick out as well. At one point we took him for counselling because we asked him what made him happy and he just sat there with big fat tears.

Our kids do come through it. They do. Because they have us and we get how hard it is.

I may be dull and mail you stuff. I don't like putting too much out there about my dcs. If you wouldn't mind me doing that.

Maybe I'll show him this thread..

That would be lovely, Pag.

God I hope I don't sound up my arse here [worried]

Tell your DS I was v different at school. I was always in a ruck, sticking up for someone being picked on. I looked odd and my best friend since aged 5 was the campest and overweight chap (not easy being a gay kid in the 80's) Together we faced a ton of shit and would sit on the bus home discussing what neanderthals the boys were and how superficial the girls were (this would be around aged 13)

Deep down we both longed to belong. Friend just wanted to be accepted for who he was and I just wanted to be pretty and be liked.

By the time we hit 6th form we were the cool kids on the block. As we all grew, people changed and what was important 2/3 years ago had been and gone and we had gained respect for being true to ourselves.

I hope this does not sound like ooohhh we were ugly ducklings and we became beautiful swans bollocks. But maybe tell DS that being a little different, owning that difference and claiming it as your strength and what sets you apart from everyone else is empowering. And people cannot resist confidence.

It may take patience. But his sense of right and wrong and justice will be his biggest strength. You should be very proud Hullster, he's going to make a fine young man

Fingers crossed, Beri...and thanks!

Oh pag, I just filled up at your memory

Sorry I have been out of it and only just catching up. What a dilemma Hully, I agree with all other posters re- anger and support. This 'respect' thing is so high on the agenda these days. I heard it from a complaining father the other day, his daughter did not show him respect ( in my book she was doing her damndest). So how will you know when you are getting respect? what will the signs be? Or are your expectations unrealistic? It might be helpful to get clear.
Anyway I ramble , but hope its a helpful ramble. Thank God you are the parent you are Hully, agony though it is , your love and care shine through.
Big hug.

Thanks Mini (X - in case there weren't enough)

Oh poor you Hully. What outrageous behaviour on the part of the parents. they can make that decision for their own children, but not for anyone elses.

Yes, Mimi. I have thought about writing to them. But I think least said and move on for now. Got to gather my energies for the syringes under the bed...

and the bongs in the bathroom....

Am having a delightful time here. Exp refusing to help out with ds fees, is having a hissy fit because he does have PR and apparently this is my fault, and and that in some arcane manner, I have rigged the school system so that ds goes to school near me.

He is mad. Poor ds. Can't go back to school until this is sorted! Bah. Where do I find £3.5k by tomorrow?

Hum.