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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

in thinking £15,000pa is a perfectly adequate salary for a single person to live on?

261 replies

undersofacushions · 20/02/2011 10:46

Have name-changed to prevent RL 'outing'

Ex-h lives with his parents, working full-time and earning £15,000pa, he moved back in with them when me and DD (almost 2) left 18m ago. He pays no rent or bill contributions, and drives one of their cars that they tax and insure - he just pays petrol. His mum does all the housework, cooking and laundry, he contributes nothing for this.

Me and DD lived near him for a year - me working p/t, 300+ miles away from all of my family. A few months ago I gave up my job and moved to be closer to my parents as both myself and them were suffering ill health.

Ex-h used the calculator on the CSA webpage, and pays what it recommends (£150 per month), the rest he keeps for himself, and regularly boasts about buying 'Waitrose Duchy steak' and other treats for himself. Me and DD make do on IS for now until I find another job.

I asked ex-h (nicely!) whether he would consider upping his contribution for DD as he has plenty of money and no outgoings. I just want to give DD a good quality of life, and he claims to 'love her and miss her' but has only visited us once (for the record, we have no car and I cant drive).

His response was no, he has no spare money, and his salary is so low that he has no choice to live with his parents as his salary is 'not enough to live on', I mentioned to him that is is greater than what I live on per month, and also larger than both my p/t salary and several other jobs salaries that I have lived on at various times.

I did a few calculations, and after tax, NI and maintenance he has £700 left per month for himself. I come up almost £100 short every month.

AIBU in thinking that £15,000 is a perfectly adequate salary, and maybe ex-h is being tighter than a ducks arse?

For the record, I dont want his money, I just want to give DD the quality of life that she deserves, as at the moment if feels like she is being brought up on the breadline while her 'loving and devoted' father lives in luxury.

OP posts:
FioFio · 23/02/2011 16:18

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anastaisia · 23/02/2011 16:21

I live with family (with my dd) on less than £15k. Despite not getting maintenance from her dad, we're comfortable because our living situation = low expenses. I'd be ashamed to be the NRP in the OP and to leave my ex struggling to provide for my child, even on the lower amount I get I could pay more than £150/month if I didn't have full time care of dd to fund.

(btw, hate the stigma about living with family = not a good lifestyle/childish/not grown up/etc. Maybe for some people it wouldn't be the choice that they'd make, but some of us get on very well in houseshares even when it's with a parent or other extended family. Not saying that it's the case for the OP's ex; but all the 'he's a grown man living with parents' type comments; what's wrong with living in larger family groups as long as no-one is taken advantage of or whatever - nuclear family living is a pretty recent development really. steps off soapbox)

Original poster
undersofacushions · 23/02/2011 16:29

Sorry for delay, was washing up and putting dinner on!

notbothered he has requested receipts, but I have not provided them, I have shown him my gas/elec/water/rent bills as an indication of the costs of keeping a roof over his child's head, and he has seen receipts from a weekly shop, he has visited our home, both here and when I lived closer to him - and he wouldn't have seen a home full of luxuries!

I'm a little offended, tbh, that you think that I (or actually ANY parent) would be buying luxuries for myself when money was tight, especially with money that was given for a child.

Nope, all his maintenance and more goes on DD.

OP posts:
FioFio · 23/02/2011 16:35

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notbothered · 23/02/2011 16:38

and on you... because you would have to pay rent/water/gas with or without her....so if u could provide £150 from your income you could buy clothes,toys, food for your daughter and provide stuff she needs without major issues.so.... you got hole in your budget which you toping up with his £150.. u short of money for your daughter because of that...and you will be short until u get your own income..

medicalmayhem · 23/02/2011 16:42

£15000 is a crap wage for working full time for anyone, and wont get you on the property ladder, he pays what he is obliged to and if he got any sense will be saving the rest to try to get a place of his own one day,after tax , NI, and pension i dont think anyone would have much left, so i can see why he doesnt want to give you more, not saying its right but i can see hwy.

Original poster
undersofacushions · 23/02/2011 16:45

Without my daughter, I would only need to rent/heat/insure a 1 bedroom home or small flat, rather than a 2 bed. There would only be one person who needed water to drink or wash in, and only one person to feed. I also wouldn't have any childcare costs to pay if I was working.

And I'm not going into my work/income situation AGAIN - if you are that interested in that please read the rest of my posts on this thread!

OP posts:
notbothered · 23/02/2011 16:47

so how come u said you dont have your own bedroom in 2bed flat?

adamschic · 23/02/2011 16:49

Even if we have a child to support on our own, our rent/mortgage, bills etc would still have to be met if we didn't have a child. Presumably you get child benefit, tax credits and the maintenance to provide the extra cost of having a child live with you.

I know it's much harder to go out to work with a small child to look after and that's why the state provides a roof over your head and basic living costs to cushion you until you are in a better position to go out to work.

Harsh I know, but once you get your head around this fact then perhaps you won't feel so bitter about what he is doing with his money.

adamschic · 23/02/2011 16:50

Sorry X post undersofa.

notbothered · 23/02/2011 17:03

im expecting my 1st child next month. we have 1 bed flat..very small and we pay 1k a moth with bills (london) we had to give up our bedroom for our child and move to the living room (which wasnt the big deal for us, we just wanted best for our child) because we cannot afford even bigger one bed, and you single mother can afford 2 bed...damn sometimes i wish i wasnt so honest and could ask gov for some help....no benefits or help for us, but we are just working people...we work so others can get their money...

Original poster
undersofacushions · 23/02/2011 17:13

notbothered - I really do sympathise - when DD was born we were living in a one bedroom flat (both of us were working full-time) and it is hard - we stayed there until DD was a few months old then moved to a small 2 bed (I was on mat leave about to return part time, ex working full time) that was (miraculously, slightly lower rent - further from town and much older building think contributed to that). I'm now in a similar small, old, 2 bedroom flat.

I used to be really grrr that people could just live off the state while I was working too, and I don't like being in this situation now but its by necessity (please forgive me for not going into detail about that - its very personal and health related and does not just concern me). I was working until 8 weeks ago. I do completely understand where you are coming from on that! For what its worth - I don't like being in that situation right now - I'd much rather be working as I feel very guilty.

I really hope things get better for you, your partner and your baby - honestly I do because I've been there and its not easy.

I do have my own bedroom, what I'd said was I don't heat my room, radiators are off, trying to save some money there.

OP posts:
HappyMummyOfOne · 23/02/2011 17:52

OP re "my gas/elec/water/rent bills as an indication of the costs of keeping a roof over his child's head" - you would have all these costs anyway even without a child. A small child could easily sleep in the same room whilst a baby/toddler.

Its irrelevant anyway as these costs are being met by the state not you so the argument is invalid. Childcare costs would also be met by tax credits if you do work at some point.

The £150 plus tax credits plus CB would more than cover the cost of a child per month inc eating well with money over given no childcare costs.

When you are working and contributing more than the £150 he is you would be valid in asking for more but given he is the only parent contributing at the moment its wrong to want more.

EdgarAleNPie · 23/02/2011 18:05

absolutely ridiculous things said on this thread. if you are a single person wih no children - you can live in a shared house ith other adults, share costs, make you own life much cheaper. Or live in a one-room flat - plenty of choice. you can get a job - of any kind, regardless of working hours. Those arrangements aren't appropriate or possible when you have kids, for many reasons.

the op's other half is a twat. an abusive twat. yes, she should accept that fact, accept the £150 a month (yes he could afford more) as a sign of his twattishness, and move on.

but i think slagging the OP when she is in a tight spot with an ex-p who even asks for half her ebay profits is bloody ridiculous.

Janos · 23/02/2011 18:06

Hey HappyMummy and notbothered. Fascinating contributions to the thread from both of you.

Are you naturally this ignorant, or does it come with practice?

OP, you don't need to justify yourself to such people. YANBU.

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 23/02/2011 18:11

well said Edgar. Lets not forget that the new single rate for LHA is up to age 35 (irrc or 34?) for a shared room. Which means that the government expect single people to be SHARING the cost. With the shared costs that go with it.

OP - Edgar is right - you do need to accept he's not going to give you more, it's shit, but you'll tie yourself up in knots and the only people that will suffer as a result are you and your DC.

If you're having trouble budgeting get to CAB/Welfare Rights/MSE/start another thread in money matters on here and get some help with it. Put your energies in what you can do to improve you situation Smile

notbothered · 23/02/2011 18:14

op thanks, but we are fine. we saved money and we are saving them now. we just think 2 bed in our situation is a luxury.. but you know everybody is different and if you feel you need to stay in 2 bed flat(with or without heating in your room) its up to you...if i was you i would cut costs and got smaller place...

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 23/02/2011 18:17

round here the difference between a 1 bed and a 2 bed is neglible (and if the OP is on benefits that'll be paid for anyhow at the momment isn't it?). If you want a bedsit or houseshare you can get it considerably cheaper - but a bedsit isn't a great place to be raising a child.

notbothered · 23/02/2011 18:20

bills difference...heating, electrics, council tax, and as far as i know you can only get up to 90% of your rent paid so in my opinion there is a room to save some money

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 23/02/2011 18:26

where did you hear you can only get 90% of your rent paid on benefits Confused

There's no guarantee council tax will be any cheaper - I'm in the lowest council tax band now - and I'm in a 3 bedroom house¬ And despite being an almost identical house (well it is only on the next street and they were all built the same time) this last winter my bills have been half what they were in my old house the previous winter Shock

Librashavinganotherbiscuit · 23/02/2011 18:42

omg I can't believe some of the responses on here, if I split with my DH I would expect not only money to support the DC but enough money to support the DC and me and if I didn't get it I would be sending ex-DH a bill for childcare costs - I think most CM get approx £4 an hour don't they? Bringing up a child IS A JOB. Why shouldn't the OP exDH help support her as well if she is looking after their child (who isn't even at school yet). £150 a month for one child is peanuts even if it's more than a lot of people get.

candleshoe · 23/02/2011 18:44

Well said Libra! Wine

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 23/02/2011 18:53

Libra - you could send the bill.........but that doesn't mean you would definitely get the money (would depend on how much of a fuckwit your exH was) - you may manage to get the money to support the children through the CSA/courts (or at least a ruling........) but you'd be even luckier to get the money to support you - that would be up to the courts to decide if you were deemed to be "deserving" of anything.

Some men are fuckwits, and nothing you do can change that. What I have learned though is that you can put them on a shelf in your mind as fuckwits, and do your best to get yourself out of the situation you're in. Be that getting a job, getting help with budgetting, etc etc.

Even if exH turned round tomorrow and told me he'd be giving me £500 a month to support the DS's - I would NEVER budget that into my regular income - it's just too risky. He did start regularly (for all of 6 weeks) giving me £20 a week.......and that stopped as abruptily as it started.

Janos · 23/02/2011 18:53

notbothered, when you've tired of attempting to harangue the OP a (single mum on benefits who has recently left an abusive relationship, and has health problems which mean she can't work) you may wish to visit kickapuppy.com or punchanorphanintheface.co.uk.

Librashavinganotherbiscuit · 23/02/2011 19:04

Baroque I understand that what I was trying to demonstrate is that the op isn't actually sitting on her arse eating grapes she is looking after their child. From my point of view the only way my dh could work is if either I stay home OR we got a full time live in nanny and that wouldn't change even if we divorced. I would be cheaper to pay than a ft nanny!

What happened to good old fashioned alimony?