in thinking £15,000pa is a perfectly adequate salary for a single person to live on?

[undersofacushions]

Have name-changed to prevent RL 'outing'

Ex-h lives with his parents, working full-time and earning £15,000pa, he moved back in with them when me and DD (almost 2) left 18m ago. He pays no rent or bill contributions, and drives one of their cars that they tax and insure - he just pays petrol. His mum does all the housework, cooking and laundry, he contributes nothing for this.

Me and DD lived near him for a year - me working p/t, 300+ miles away from all of my family. A few months ago I gave up my job and moved to be closer to my parents as both myself and them were suffering ill health.

Ex-h used the calculator on the CSA webpage, and pays what it recommends (£150 per month), the rest he keeps for himself, and regularly boasts about buying 'Waitrose Duchy steak' and other treats for himself. Me and DD make do on IS for now until I find another job.

I asked ex-h (nicely!) whether he would consider upping his contribution for DD as he has plenty of money and no outgoings. I just want to give DD a good quality of life, and he claims to 'love her and miss her' but has only visited us once (for the record, we have no car and I cant drive).

His response was no, he has no spare money, and his salary is so low that he has no choice to live with his parents as his salary is 'not enough to live on', I mentioned to him that is is greater than what I live on per month, and also larger than both my p/t salary and several other jobs salaries that I have lived on at various times.

I did a few calculations, and after tax, NI and maintenance he has £700 left per month for himself. I come up almost £100 short every month.

AIBU in thinking that £15,000 is a perfectly adequate salary, and maybe ex-h is being tighter than a ducks arse?

For the record, I dont want his money, I just want to give DD the quality of life that she deserves, as at the moment if feels like she is being brought up on the breadline while her 'loving and devoted' father lives in luxury.

YANBU!
I grew up and watched my mother struggle and my father was nowhere to be seen and she never got a penny, so I do think you are lucky to be getting some money at all. BUT it makes me so fing angry when men pay maintenence and think they are the best fathers going because of this! If he is living a cushty life at his mothers with no bills or rent to pay, why the hell shouldnt he pay more towards your DC upbringing weather you left him or not! He is a father and should be willing to give his last penny to his DC just as us mothers do and would! Its double standards that women are expected to put up and shut up when men do the bear minimum!

But that said I have huge amounts of respect for my mother for what she did for me and my siblings all on her own. She also takes pride in us knowing she made us who we are with no help from our good for nothing father! (I know my situation is slightly different!)
I dont have any brilliant advice for you but just wanted to let you know I'm on your side!

Lee, you wouldnt have a vested interest in this particular case would you? It being your only contribution to mn, and you feeling so strongly?

Thanks Lee, aren't you kind. You know I used to dislike "women like me" until I became one - what a lesson learnt. I worked full time from when I finished education until my daughter was born, then part time from when she was 8 months old until I moved. I've only been a "woman like me" for a few weeks, nice generalisation.

I posted because I had a differing opinion to ex-H on this matter, basically that I will go without pretty much anything for my DD, and he would rather have little luxuries for himself - it was the same when we were married, never had joint accounts etc.

Ok yeah, he can spend his money on whatever he likes, I would happily do without his money and never have to see him again, but thats not whats best for my DD, and to get whats fair for her I will fight tooth and nail.

Would you let your child be brought up with very little money while you had money to spare? Would anyone?

Disclaimer: I don't drink alcohol, smoke, take drugs, go out socially (night or day), buy clothes for myself, media, books, heck I don't even heat my own bedroom. I'm not sure what lifestyle changes I could make to save money!

In truth, I'm hurt by ex's attitude and his behaviour, for my DD's sake. I don't want his money for me, I want it for her.

Fwiw I think you are doing a fantastic job and your dd is very lucky she has you , I would just ignore anyone who is flaming you on this thread they are obviously idiots IMHO Fight for what your dd deserves what he is paying you is compared to what he has is disgusting . I wish I had better advice for you other than use the Internet if you are struggling with money , I buy my ds clothes from eBay ,use wholesale sites and if you buy anything at all visit quidco first it is a cashback site which means you will get a percentage back from anything you buy online as long as you go through their site , it is especially good if you are renewing insurance or bills. Good luck for the future.

Hi Mrswhiskerson - thanks for your advice, I will check those out, I'd never considered using wholesale sites (I'm quite new at this) but I'm doing a lot of selling on ebay at the moment of old baby clothes, DVDs, books CDs etc trying to save up for a birthday pressie for my DD!

All the best to you too, and thanks!

YANBU to want the father of your child to help his child have a better standard of living.

Given you get £150 maintenance, £80 CB and probably £200 plus a month tax creits thats over £400 to support one two year old and it will cost nowhere near that. Why do you need more for her as you state? Thats with no contribution from yourself.

Unless he tells you what to spend your money on then you cant tell him.

I find it a little off to be complaining that you dont have your ideal lifestyle yet dont work.

A friend of mine ended up in the situation that you are expecting you ex to put himself in,paying so much in maintenance that he couldn't afford to move out of his mum's and move on with his life. That was enforced because of the ridiculous CSA1 system. What you can't afford your own place? You can pay even more then since you have no housing costs. Thank God the system has changed.

God these threads are depressing - why the fuck should the OP be grateful that the father of her child is supporting that child??

The CSA is a minimum requirement. Any man who can afford to pay more but chooses to pay less is devoid of morals.

How any parent can live in luxury whilst their child struggles is just beyond me

YABU

channel your energy into being fiercly financially independent... will be better for you and DD in the long run and then anything you get from ex will be seen as a bonus. That way you are less likely to get bitter and twisted about what he does with his cash and puts your relationship back on an even keel.

and no you should not feel grateful that he pays what he owes...

op, you are def, def NBU. i agree with giddypickle, the CSA amount is based on the assumption that he has greater living costs than he actually does. so are def not being unreasonable!

and to those who say its none of your business. it makes my blood boil! why should he have a better standard of living than you, whilst your earnings potential is reduced as you are the primary carer for his child?

£15k is a low salary. but not if its 'pocket money'.

Um... I thought Lee was deliberately exaggerating the opposite point to show how ridiculous that viewpoint is (it's a well known linguistic tactic but I can't remember the proper name for it).

Well said noonar!

I dont think you are being unreasonable op,not one little bit.

OP

You've clearly had a tough time and have made the decision to leave your partner due to domestic violence issues. You should be applauded for that and for your attempts to give your child a stable and happy home, not given a verbal battering on here. Many women stay with violent partners, its not easy to leave and by doing so you HAVE already given her a better life. So hold your head up high and know that you personally are doing your best for your daughter.
In terms of your ex-p - you've depicted him as violent, verbally abusive, selfish etc. I think you need to lower your expectations of him. He gives you the minimum amount he needs to - I would not expect anything more from him as you will only end up disappointed. Focus now on your own life and on getting well yourself and getting yourself a job. DH is covering the neccessities for your DD and it seems that at the moment any 'luxuries' will have to be afforded by you.

You are doing everything you can - don't expect anything from ex-P and you can't be let down again. Let him tuck into his steak, you have something far better - a good relationship with your child which he doesn't have - and your self-respect which he certainly cannot have given what you have said about him. He's a grown man living with his parents after he messed up a relationship - you are BETTER than that.

Go for it!

Good luck

waitrose duchy steak sounds interesting, must try it. I think if your not going to get any more than £150 per month then you need to move on and leave it. He may have the money but you have something more valuable.

Sorry, I only got this far on page one:

'£15k is a very very low wage. Impossible to live on for most people.'

Ha ha ha ha ha! Bollocks! Like hell it is.

DH and I've lived the both of us on less than that.

yes lrd dont ya love Mumsnet?

Second LRD.

Thousands of us live on £15K or less and have done for years.

If you're used to earning a huge wodge then it may be hard to comprehend, but it is totally feasible.

I think I may be in the minority on MN tbh.

It really doesn't matter whether £15k is a low salary or not.

The fact is there is a woman and child who are being supported by the tax payer whilst the father of the child has a "nice" lifestyle.

The fact that men (and female NRP) are allowed to get away with this is shocking and the fact that so many people think it is entirely acceptable takes my breath away.

Takeresponsibility - the word you want is 'hyperbole' I think.

And £15k means very different lifestyles depending on where you live. Moving from a rather grotty town to a very desirable part of the Home Counties has more than doubled our rent - ouch.

This is a useful link to The Joseph Rowntree Foundation's Minimum Income Calculator. It is very useful.

www.minimumincome.org.uk/

I appreciate he is paying what is "legally" asked of him but the fact is he is in a position to finacially support his daughter and refuses not to instead expecting the tax payer to susidise him so that he can continue to live the good life.

I am amazed that any thrid party thinks that is acceptable.

In addition it is morally reprehensible that someone would choose to let their daughter to scrape by whilst they treat themselves. How many mothers here would buy themselves a designer handbag rather than let their children have ballet lessons, or eat steak whilst the children have value burgers, deny them magazines/treats whilst they go to the pub, go without day trips whilst they get their two weeks in the maldives or whichever eaxample you care to pick? I suspect very very few. So please someone explain why the situation is different just beacsue you ar the NRP?