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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Wanting to get this teacher fired

690 replies

lividbeyondbelief · 19/02/2011 23:08

My dd attends a language class on saturday mornings in central london. This week due to horrible traffic we were 30 minutes late to collect her. We tried texting her teacher to say we were stuck in traffic but never got a reply. Anyway to make a long story short - she left my dd outside the school, alone with another boy, whilst she went out to go buy lunch. To make matters worse she told her to lie to us and say she was in the room next door if we asked where the teacher was when we collected our dd.

Our daughter was really upset and cried whilst being outside alone with this boy. My dh noticed she had been crying but the teacher just dismissed it, saying to dh she cried because he was late.

Obviously the bond of trust is broken and she wont be going back ever again. My question is what else should we do?

OP posts:
JaneS · 20/02/2011 13:58

Psammead - yes, a note would have been a good idea. Unless the 'lying' was actually the teacher's attempt to get the child to tell her parents where she was?

I have wondered if this teacher actually didn't go for lunch, but when to try to phone the missing parents, or to contact someone for advice.

Blu · 20/02/2011 13:58

LittleRedDragon: if this adult is capable of managing a class-ful of children in a building, including supervising a fire evacuation or a severe asthma attack then yes. Esp as she had the parents mobile number and could have called to say 'I'm popping round corner with them as I have to get lunch, is that OK'. Which is what I think the teacher shgould have done.

Remember: I run a fully regulated organisation that runs activities, and we would never ever leave a child unaccompanied, or run a session in a school premises with only one adult present. IF there was a caretaker of toerh adult present at the school this language class took place in then the children were not unaccompanied or unsupervised.

BecauseImWorthIt · 20/02/2011 14:00

Livid - what's your own contingency policy going to be then, from now on?

Do you, as I asked you earlier, accept any responsibility or agree that YABU in any way?

Or is this, after all, just a wind-up post?

Blu · 20/02/2011 14:00

Laquitar - and quite rightly IMPRISONED. For years and years. Because she wouldn't have called the parents, or left a note, would she? Nah.

In what other context would the MN frenzy decide that leaving 2 kids alone was an OK thing to do?

Being 30 mins late is not ok, but really....

donkeyderby · 20/02/2011 14:01

I assume from the high level of disagreement with the OP, that most of you would not think it too awful if your DC's teachers disappeared to go shopping for half an hour - in the meantime, asking your child to lie - if you were half an hour late collecting your kids from school?

The teacher wouldn't get into trouble, but you would get a good pasting for being late?

Insane

EdgarAleNPie · 20/02/2011 14:02

Add message | Report | Message poster lividbeyondbelief Sat 19-Feb-11 23:31:02

Left outside a primary school, no other adults arounds. Except passerby's on the street"

and then...

Add message | Report | Message poster lividbeyondbelief Sat 19-Feb-11 23:36:19
. Never in a million years did i think she would leave my daughter out on the street unsupervised.

so far no contradiction...then

Add message | Report | Message poster lividbeyondbelief Sun 20-Feb-11 00:05:40
Inside the school gates, which are opened for a car to enter if needed. Anyone could walk in

I'd call that fairly contradictory. not out on the street, but inside school gates.

JaneS · 20/02/2011 14:02

Blu - I think the issue is, this woman wasn't necessarily part of a 'fully regulated' organization like yours. It sounds a lot more casual than that. It's also quite possible she didn't bring a mobile with her, as she didn't get the OP's texts. If so, she'd have had to go elsewhere to a phone - there's presumably not one in the classroom.

I wouldn't bring my mobile to classes - too much of a distraction.

Original poster
lividbeyondbelief · 20/02/2011 14:04

I believe the caretaker opens then school for the first class and then returns after the last class of the day.

Doesnt matter, her asking my dd to tell us a lie was wrong. My being late wasn't intentional, her lying and abandonement of two young children was.

OP posts:
JaneS · 20/02/2011 14:04

Edgar - she did explain that the playground is set up so any passerby could wander in (it's not got key-card gates or anything). So I don't think she meant to be contradictory.

EdgarAleNPie · 20/02/2011 14:05

i think assuming the teacher lied is a bit strong. Especially when it would have been such a stupid lie.

A2363 · 20/02/2011 14:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
lividbeyondbelief · 20/02/2011 14:09

Outside the actual main building of the school is what i meant by outside the school. To me the fact that an o
pen gate is what separates the dcs from the pavement/street is the same. Anyone can wander in if they want. Its all outdoors.

Its ridiculous how people spend such time trying to look for reasons to trip up the OP. English is not my first language, my typing certain responses over others is because of the speed of this thread, not a ploy to avoid questions. Suspicious lot some of you are!!

OP posts:
A2363 · 20/02/2011 14:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Blu · 20/02/2011 14:10

Well, I don't think anyone should leave children that age alone.

Come on: imagine a MN thread that went 'ds had a friend for tea, parents were late and i had to collect DH from station, s I left the child out on the street'.

Or if a piano teacher did that.

No-one who takes on any form of responsibility for a child should leave them unaccompanied. Or be alone in a school without means to phone or without having an emergency contact number and a means to ring it. It's just bad practice.. of course her mobile wouldn;t be on while she was teaching, you can have it with you, but turned off. It would be the fist thing I'd look at if a parent was more than 5 mins late!

Psammead · 20/02/2011 14:11

The teacher had responsibility for those children until she handed them over to their parents. She made a bad judgement call, imo.

In the case I mentioned earlier where the parents were 45 mins late and uncontactable, I was seriously starting to consider taking the child back home with me and leaving a detailed note on their front door explaining where she was.

That could possibly have got me into trouble but would have been better than leaving the child.

It's a hard situation for a teacher to be in. They don't know if you are going to be 10 mins, 30 mins or an hour late, or even if you are going to turn up at all. They have to use their sense.

Do try not to put a teacher in that position again. 30 mins is unacceptable. As a one off, emergency, well it happens. But you don't seem to care much about punctuality, OP.

Both unreasonable.

JaneS · 20/02/2011 14:11

I do see it's a fast moving thread and hard to keep up. Your English comes across as absolutely fine, though.

If you do have time, can you tell us a bit more about the lying issue? I do really hope there's an easy explanation for it.

I can imagine an adult lying to a child in that situation in order to try not to worry her, and maybe your DD picked up on the lie but not the motive behind it.

Laquitar · 20/02/2011 14:19

OP, is any possibility that the teacher told them to stay inside (where other teachers were teaching in the next room) and the children sneaked out in the payground, then you arrived, you looked furious at this, the children paniced a bit and tried to blame the teacher?

It is very odd for the teacher to tell the children to lie-she would have to be really stupid to do this.

Original poster
lividbeyondbelief · 20/02/2011 14:21

The lying part explained -

After all the pupils were collected, bar these 2, the teacher went out the school grounds telling her students she needed to go buy her lunch. She then proceded to tell them that if in the meantime their parents showed up to just say she was in the classroom next door. No one was in that classroom, no other pupils or adults around until the following class one hour later.

This primary school has only an estate around it and the nearest shops are a few roads down.

She arrived before we did so we never had a clue she had been left without adult supervision. Am totally shocked by it. Its hardly an area that inspires reckless freedom.

OP posts:
BaronSamedi · 20/02/2011 14:22

I don't think that anybody would call you unreasonable if you were concerned and wanted to get to the bottom of what had happend OP.

But jumping straight to 'get the teacher sacked' from one accusation from your daughter seems completely the wrong way to go about this - especially when there seems like there's so much potential for misunderstanding.

Obviously your daughter is upset, which has to be your priority, but surely you'd be able to reassure her better if you made sure she'd not got confused about what was going on.

Make your concern known to the school, and try to get to the bottom of what happened, is of course entirely reasonable thing to do. Jumping straight into some hunt for retribution seems unreasonable and the wrong approach for everybody involved.

(sorry. bit of a lurker but never posted before. I avoided all the YBUAY stuff - worried I might get it the wrong way round!)

JaneS · 20/02/2011 14:24

But that isn't a lie? Confused

We've already covered this haven't we?

'Tell your parents I'll be in the classroom' surely just means that's where she expected to be when you showed up.

It'd only be her telling your DD to lie if she'd said 'I will actually be going away but you must tell your mummy I was here the whole time, understand?'

If she did that, I would be pretty stroppy too, but it just doesn't sound as if her intention was to make your DD lie to you. I think your DD is just (perfectly naturally at age 7), thinking very literally and not quite grasping adults' speech.

JaneS · 20/02/2011 14:25

I reckon it might be good to go to the teacher and tell her how upset your DD was and how she felt she'd been asked to lie - the teacher should learn that she did something unkind. It does sound, in general, as if this teacher is not very au fait with small children, tba.

OutOutLetItAllOut · 20/02/2011 14:29

To be honest, for all you know the teachers car was parked outside the gates, she may have turned up for work before the card park was open. She might have just gone to her car to get her lunch.

frasersmummy · 20/02/2011 14:35

Clearly our culture is more lax with timekeeping than the english

op I was totally on your side till you came up with this gem ....

I ran brownies for many many years and yes parents get held up and yes parents mix up arrangments - when you call them 15 mins later you hear .. oh god i forgot my wife was going x and i was to pick dd up - it happens.. they apologise you move on.
I have been known in mix up cases to give the child a lift home

But if a parent even hinted it wasnt in their culture to be on time then I would be saying sorry but dd cant be left then

and what exactly is this culture that doesnt see the need to be on time for their kids pick up.. I've never come accross it

skybluepearl · 20/02/2011 14:36

i think you are both in the wrong. you should have phoned - not text and the teacher should not have left a child unsupervised.

caughtinanet · 20/02/2011 14:47

We don't know if the teacher is asking the children to lie but surely she'd have to be pretty stupid to say what the OP thinks she did.

The lie makes no sense - either she would have still been away when the parents returned and they would have seen this when they looked in the room for her (ie it would be obvious she had lied) or she would have returned and there would be no need for a lie.