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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be sat open mouthed at the Idiocy of Dave Camerons latest headline grabber

755 replies

penelopestitsdropped · 05/02/2011 11:59

Multiculturalism has failed

Now whilst i believe the debate itself has merit ( though think that DC has put a rather disturbing anti islamic slant on it)
I do not think it the wisest day to do so given that there is a planned march by the English Defence League (think BNP with more hair) today

march in Luton

OP posts:
gordyslovesheep · 06/02/2011 16:39

ha GIN gosh that was a slip up Grin

dobiegirl · 06/02/2011 16:40

I should hope you do like her Gordy, spending so much time with her as you do!!

chibi · 06/02/2011 16:40

capitol emoticon gordy

lashings of Gin all round

dobiegirl · 06/02/2011 16:41

ha GIN gosh that was a slip up - yeah but not as much as the 'leetle' mistake you 'both' made lol!!!

giveitago · 06/02/2011 16:44

There was never a serious or intelligent debate on here. The level was like when I was 16 in the mid '80's saying that everything was the fault of 'capitalist society'.

White society in britain is the fault of all things now. Gotta laugh. And I'm mixed race. But I still laugh.

I'd rather the experiences of starlight (and I don't have her experiences of islam, quite the reverse) or my own parents than that of majority of people on here.

gordyslovesheep · 06/02/2011 16:46

two people on a web site use the same silly spelling of leeetle shocker - well obviously we must be the same it's the ONLY explanation there is Grin

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 16:48

Agree, giveitago.

chibi · 06/02/2011 16:51

who said that white society is the fault of all things?

i have been trying to offer a perspective from the other side, such as it is, bearing in mind that my own experiences as an immigrant are very different from someone who comes from a poor/uneducated background, or who comes as a refugee

i thought my perspective was unique and worth hearing, because i am here as an immigrant, and i am the child of immigrants in another country, where this whole debate happens under very different terms - simply put immigrants and immigration are perceived very differently

if my posts have led anyone to think that 'white society' is to blame, then i really have not been expressing my opinion clearly, and i apologise for any offense i may have caused

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 16:57

Your posts haven't offended me at all Chibi, and please, don't apologise. You're entitled to your opinion and to share your experience as much as anyone else.

OTheHugeManatee · 06/02/2011 17:04

'White society in britain is the fault of all things now. Gotta laugh. And I'm mixed race. But I still laugh.

I'd rather the experiences of starlight (and I don't have her experiences of islam, quite the reverse) or my own parents than that of majority of people on here.'

Can you say more? Srsly, not in a 'Please explain yourself' way but I'm interested. It's easy to polarise a debate about race/culture/immigration between the 'send 'em home' position and a 'fuck you we're not integrating' one. And obviously the views of mixed heritage people get left out. Would be nice to hear more of that point of view.

giveitago · 06/02/2011 17:11

yes and starlight I couldn't help but notice but the hatemongers (anti british and the pc lot)initially gave you a hard time based on assumptions that you stated that you were british and therefore they thought you were white (when you clearly stated your BRITISH background which was mixed). You have to LOL. but since then it's been made clear to me that your views are not particularly needed and I find really fecking offensive. It's almost like you have you to choose which side you're on. You're on YOUR side of course.

I find that my views on mn are rarely heard because I present as neither one nor the other.

And increasingly so in this climate.

LDNmummy · 06/02/2011 17:13

OK, had to go do stuff so could only skim read whats been said since I left, I beg your pardon then if anything I say now has already been said.

As for the pensioners in Spain, it is not just pensioners but most English immigrants in Spain who have completely alienated themselves off from the native people by staying firmly within ex-pat circles. Not just this but many do not bother to learn Spanish beyond the basics and expect the Spanish to speak English. Not only that, but they are also racist to the Spanish natives, even spitting on them in the streets in some cases. There is ample proof that this is happening in Spain and I believe a documentary was made about it some years ago when it came to light. So not dissimilar to the problems the English are complaining about here. This is funny for a little joke about the failure of the English to fully integrate in Spain:

As for immigrants coming and taking jobs, immigrants do not get this luxury at all. I went to a very multicultural school in n/e London and remember one boy who's parent's had been surgeons in his native country who were cleaners over here. Next time you go to a hospital or public place, look around at the people doing the menial jobs, I doubt a high percentage of them will be English.

As for cash in hand work, there is obviously a supply and demand situation going on as even people on this thread have admitted using foreign and cheap labour. So look no further for the enablers of this crooked practice than in the mirror. Also, a lot of labourers who work for cheaper are the workers keeping the economy afloat. Many small business's admit using cheap labour because employing Brit's means less productivity for the same wage and their business's would not survive. These are legally employed workers I am talking about BTW. In essence what these employers are saying is that Brit's expect to do very little work for a wage whereas foreign workers are harder working.

As for the ?shag our women? idea, I do not think that is their main agenda when settling in the UK but yes, I have friends who work on building sites with EU migrants and hear a lot of banter about the easy English they get to cop off with. But if the girl?s are doing it then I hardly think it is the migrant person?s fault, although I hate the idea that a woman who has sex is somehow free and easy, very misogynistic.

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 17:17

I know. It's like banging my head against a brick wall!

LDNmummy · 06/02/2011 17:18

Oh and I have other actually serious points to make but too pregnancy tired to do so now. Will return after a looong nap Smile

gordyslovesheep · 06/02/2011 17:21

how are people hatemongers? what a vicious little title to give people

I never assumed anything about Starlight - despite being accued of living in a nice white area by some people and massive assumptions being made about other posters (you are still doing it) do you know, for example, what my racial background is? Do you know if I am white?

You are assuming a lot and being rather bitchy about it

Being mixed race doesn;t preclude you from being ignorant or bigoted though - as has been stated repeatedly you don;y have to be white to be racist :)

dobiegirl · 06/02/2011 17:25

Many small business's admit using cheap labour because employing Brit's means less productivity for the same wage and their business's would not survive.

No sweeping generalisations or racism there then!!! Hmm

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 17:25

Read back and see what you wrote-

I am white British but I wouldn;t intergrate with all white british people

dobiegirl · 06/02/2011 17:27

Gordy I reckon your Chinese !! Am I right, am I right (jumps up and down excitedly)

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 17:27

And I'm not ignorant or bigoted in the slightest. Not once have I said I hate xxxxx because of their skin colour.

And you have self confessed to being a bleeding heart liberal.

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 17:28

No she's white, she said so herself about 6-7 pages or so back!

dobiegirl · 06/02/2011 17:28

Oh ok Princess, damn, missed that!!

dobiegirl · 06/02/2011 17:29

She's probably lying anyhow!!

bringnbuy · 06/02/2011 17:29

afternoon, re economical migrants (eastern europeans). i thought initially this was great. got to meet all sort of people from many different countries from the east but i definately think there should have been some kind of visa cap as there are just too many. things aren't always as they appear on paper. i know of many different situations that spin off how we are told things are. i can with no effort think of at least two places in london when very early in the morning there are a good 100/150 easter europeans who wait by the road to be picked up by builders for cash in hand work. i know of two builders, one of which is my cousin who lives in luton, who has lost 50% of his work (my friends partner similar), both claim for the same reasons - my cousins has more times than he can remember told me how his van (builder advertised on the side) gets followed by an eastern european builder who go and knock on the door and undercut him with work. he knows this for a fact as he has been told this by the person he was trying to get work from when he has called them later. the other reason is that he says people he had done work for for years is honest and tells him (he has had this from more than one previous supplier) that he can pay alot less to the eastern europeans thus he doesn't employ him anymore. these things are not my opinion, they are things that i know are going on and need to be addressed. i think that eu workers have contributed fantastically however there is not enough work to go round and the wages in some areas have become so low that it has made it hard for some english people to either be chosen to be employed or be able to manage on the small wage. asylum seekers is totally different to economical migrants as asylum seekers are needing a safe haven and need to be looked after. a work colleague of mine has a friend who has a flat he rents out. he said the other week he had to help his friend with paper work for an extended roma (roumanian) family who were being given the flat by the council and that the paper work which he looked at said that they were getting family tax credit and cb. i have no idea how they get this, nor did he and if he had not seen the paper work he would not have believed it. he said the benefits had all been set up by another family member before they had even come into the country. i only mention this as someone posted earlier that eu migrants were not entitled to benefits. i have NO IDEA how this works but it would appear that there are all sorts or loopholes and ways to fiddle the system.

StarlightPrincess · 06/02/2011 17:29

I just quoted what she said ^^^

gordyslovesheep · 06/02/2011 17:31

I am white and British but my family is not British :)

Dobie you seem very paranoid dear :)

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