are you all scared of being called racists?

[SalvadorDalek]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/
I am suprised nobody has posted this story
Why are we suprised,this has been going on for years

Also ethnicity is not defined genetically. Their is no genetic difference between the Hutus and Tutsis for example.

Race also is mainly cultural, and people don't really form discrete genetic groups.

Don't mean to labour, but is civic identity identity simply domicile then?

Well I don't agree with you DG, because you don't seem to understand that the English as an ethnic group includes many people who are not white.

I have to go - WG. Will come back later!

And that the UK is home to many ethnic groups, not just the English, Welsh etc.

MillyR yes sorry I meant genetic and cultural inheritance.

That's right blinder but other ethnic groups are acknowledged, only tonight usedtobeyoung said 'the English, an ethnic group LMAO' - how can a group of people just be dismissed like that, like we don't exsist, this has been goin on too long.

Well, Englishness is not dismissed really. I think it is the terminology that Usedtobeyoung is debating. I doubt she is claiming that people in England are generally not immersed in a culture of Englishness. I have no real knowledge of Welsh music groups, or novelists, youth cultures, fashion styles, architecture and so on. I am sure the Welsh have a rich culture but it is not the culture taught in English schools or that the English are hugely exposed to.

The only large change to that is the influence of US culture on England, which has little to do with thread.

And ultimately that is a choice - people choose to consume US culture. It isn't imposed through Government institutions.

On the current subject under discussion, I look forward to the day when we in this country all proudly refer to ourselves as British...in the same way that those " over the pond" are happy to be called, "American", regardless of whence they hail.

On the original subject, I think there are far worse things to be called than, "racist"..."paedophile", "murderer", "robber", "criminal", "fraudster", "thief" etc etc, for example.

I disagree pascoe, Scottish heritage is different from English, both different, both fascinating, to lose that under the umbrella of 'Britishness' would be a loss, we have to remember we are 4 different countries!!!

DG - fair enough.

Exactly MillyR. I was not dismissing any group of people, merely your definition Dobiegirl.

Then you are just pedantic for arguements sake!!

Not at all Dobiegirl, I?m actually very interested in how people and groups are defined but find it difficult to have a serious debate with someone who spouts such vile and incorrect ideas. The thing is there are very few people who see race and ethnicity in the way that you do left, thank god.

Anyway I have things to do now, and quite honestly you disgust me, and are not worth the effort.

Nah you got it wrong and someone a lot more intelligent than you got you out of hot water

My definition was of the English being an ethnic group - you laughed it off, as you couldn't comprehend such a strange and stupid idea, now you find I'm not incorrect at all, and you were!! the only course of action left, therefore, is to try and insult me and flounce off away from the subject.

You've made yourself look shallow and unintelligent. You are also wrong about there are few people left who see race and ethnicity the way I do. There are many people who see English as an ethnic group, not a race (don't get where your coming from on that one)but then you just probably don't know what you're saying, which seems to be the case with most of what you type.

Happy to be vile and disgusting if it offends you so!!

Over the pond, in The United States, no one really refers to themselves as 'American'; its African-American, Chinese-American, Puerto Rican-American, Japanese-American, Mexican-American, Italian-American, Irish-American, even Canadian-American and Anglo-Saxon-American. There is most definitely a reference to race or country that the individual or their family originates. Same with in Canada.

I've read that serial killers are always white, but I suppose, really, maybe there's some that haven't been caught. And Native-Americans differ greatly to the ills of alcoholism then any other race. White men have 20% larger lung capacity then any other race, which baffles me as it seems you never see a white guy winning many marathons or running races.

White men do not have a 20% larger lung capacity than any other race. It doesn't make much sense to attempt to find a correlation between skin pigmentation and lung capacity because lung capacity is connected to other factors such as altitude in the environment of adaptation. There is a huge difference between the lung capacity of the population in parts of East Africa and parts of West Africa, but very little difference in skin pigmentation between the two groups.

Race doesn't exist except as a social construct and a proxy for skin colour. Nationality is a based on administrative units. Ethnicity is partly to do with history and cultural traditions and partly to do with making up stuff to pretend that one group of people us different to another group of people. None of these things exist independently of the meanings we make up for them.

Gotart I just call myself American. :)

No, I'm not afraid of being called racist, because I'm not. But it is odd how some things just seem off limits to say...this summer there was a group of yound guys playing basketball at the park. They were all white except one, and two little girls were talking about them. One girl said "I know him, that's Robert. The one with the...um, green shorts and black shoes." She so obviously didn't want to say "Robert, the black guy," and I understand that, but at the same time if only one of the boys had been white, she would have said "Robert, the white guy.

I don't think there's anything wrong with using it as a descriptive term. The only reason it would be is if the term black, or white, or Pakistani, meant something negative in your mind, and it doesn't in mine.

Humans...what funny creatures we are, really. :)

on that last point you might be incorrect, I remember when I was about 10 struggling to describe a guy in a photo one time and took ages, then someone said oh... the black guy! I said 'NO! the guy ON THE LEFT! and everyone laughed and I couldn't understand why.
What was weird was that when I said the guy on the left, they all thought I couldn't mean 'the black guy' so they chose guys around him and even guys on the right of the photo rather than the one on the left of the photo.. I supppose because he was black??

Sometimes our worry of not offending can have the opposite effect...I know of many black/gay/whatever people that HATE the way we try to skirt around the words! It is even more insulting to say "he's....erm" than saying the black one! The more people think about it the worse it is...! Say what you mean...and stop patronising with words!

Mill I don't actually know, but that's what my friend learned while at medical school.