Women who smoke when pregnant are selfish, irresponsible fuckwits

[MsKLo]

...and so are parents who smoke around their babies/children. I see soooooo many parents pushing prams and smoking or driving and smoking with babies in their car seats etc.

And the number of times I have seen pregnant women having a fag...

Selfish, irresponsible fuckwits

And for the record, I am an ex smoker. I LOVED smoking but stopped before I starte trying for a baby as it was, and is not, fair to inflict my selfish habit on my babies.

Agreed leonie

Thank you for making a stand :)

Leonie. How about you read what has been said. We all get that smoking is harmful. BUT - and here's the newsflash - it's highly addictive, and it's a complex addiction. Plenty of people here have shown they don't understand the first thing about addiction. If it was that fucking easy no one would smoke at all.

And 'I'm an ex-smoker, if I can quit anyone can' is not actually an argument.

Well, you're not right to say that it harms all babies, as there's is plenty of babies born to mothers who smoked during pregnancy who grow into healthy adults. It does increase the risk of low birth weight etc etc, I totally agree. I would say that there is a difference between a pg woman who has a few a day and then never smokes in the house/around the children and one that has a packet a day and then smokes in the house.

The doctors I mentioned- one in NYC, one in Paris-not sure the names would help you believe them more, really-but both working for v.good hospitals and estimed in their field.

Don't do it then Leonie. Keep your judgemental beak out of everyone else's faces. yes? Anything else is sheer fuckwittery

I think you'll find that you're wrong about moderate drinking in pregnancy. Do read some actual research.

Oh dear. This thread is going to end up very nasty I think.

You need to be very careful about the sweeping generalisations you make to women who have had stillborn babies. While smoking may be a proven risk factor, implying cause and effect in any way does not help. I acknowledge at the same time that 'children are stillborn to non smokers too' is no argument against trying to help pregnant women stop smoking.

MumsMunchkin, I am sorry, truly. And if you choose to smoke and feel no guilt and nobody else has to suffer because of it, then that's your choice. Whilst I might disagree with the sense behind it, I accept it's your decision. It is disgusting and filthy though. Not to you maybe but it arouses disgust in millions of people, pollutes, stains and causes illness. You have the right to do it, I have the right to see it a certain way.

Oh dear you really are not a very nice person are you MsKLo? You like the word irony don't you?

But let me correct you - you judged everybody else by starting this thread

You probably can't see that though through your rose tinted glasses.

There is nothing wrong with a healthy debate on MN but when you resort to ranting, name calling and judging people without knowing any facts I am afraid you leave yourself wide open to be judged in return.

Glad you like my name

And both my children were big at birth.And still are much taller than average. Also both almost never get sick. DS wasn't sick once in the last 5-6 years. DD just had her first cold couple of weeks ago at almost 2yo. I smoked 3-5 cigaretes a day. But that's all anecdotal evidence, same as yours, really.

"its wrong for everyone to smoke, not just select folks."

Which begs the question, why is it still legal?

More than once on this thread, it has been implied that smokers lack moral fibre and that being a non-smoker is a morally superior choice. I wonder then why there is no orchestrated campaign to have smoking banned? Perhaps there is one?

This is what makes it so difficult- it is a completely legal activity. Why?

Leonie- look, I really need to get on with writing my essay now, but I can assure you that studies have been done that prove that moderate drinking is fine. I'll try to find them for you later, ok?

Last I heard, from the Master of one of Irelands largest maternity hospitals (on the radio, not in person!) is that he would have no issue with an expectant mother drinking 1 or 2 units, once or twice a week after 13 weeks.

Why is anything harmful still legal though? Transfats, pesticides.
The banned substances seem to be the ones that alter your cognitive function, apart from alcohol of course.
Bad and all as smoking is, you're not rendered mentally incapable after one to many.

(thought this all looked a bit familiar)

MsKalo / MsKlo does seem to like to start a little ruck every now and then and it's that time again, - check out this

Enormous

I don't know Leonie. I'd imagine the prohibition of smoking would be more effective than the prohibition of drugs.

Taking the current generation of smokers out of the equation for now, what we need to do is eliminate the take up. Why do young people smoke? You don't get a buzz from them, they don't make music sound better or sex feel better. The relaxing qualties only kick in after you're addicted. If nobody got a chance to become addicted maybe the current generation would be the last.

Prohibition wouldn't work for alcohol and other drugs as there is a very strong compelling motivation to take them, to get off your head.

and here comes the ff rant .......