A good job there aren't many men on MN

[Truckulent]

I think men would be shocked at the level of resentment leveled at them on MN. Almost a seething mass of contempt at times.

I'm a man, been on here for years. And I was surprised by it.

AIBU to think it's a good job there aren't many men on here, or would more men posting help men and women understand each other better?

And what bit of the bibble babble did you disagree with SM?

The bit where it says that the only thing that the only way a man can overcome his abusiveness is by dealing with his abusiveness?

Is there another way then?

the quacky language.over simplification of complex issue.s

alcohol/substances not wholly causal but cannot be overlooked and brushed aside either

dv is an appalling social problem with horrific ramifications and i dont think there is a definitive answer

Seems straightforward to me.

Drinking does not make someone violent, if the propensity to be violent was not already there.

Ergo, a non abuser man does not turn into an abuser just because he's had a drink. The abuser mentality, the sense of entitlement are already there.

Drinks is the excuse.

Nothing quacky about that.

I'm not sure it's that complex actually.

You either beleive you have the right to hit your parnter or you don't.

Millions of men get pissed out of their heads and never hit anyone. Millions of men stay stone cold sober and feel entitled to hit the women and children in their lives.

It really is just about entitlement. Of course there are triggers - stress, alcohol, unemployment, depression, arguments etc. But the difference between people who are triggered to violence, is about their attitudes IMO, not their substance abuse.

Scottish Mummy - I don't think that 'bibble babble' is a very fair assessment based on one paragraph that I've quoted out of context! There are about 400 pages of which I quoted a small section. It's easy to read and easy to understand and is written for women who have been in or who are currently in abusive relationships.

Lundy Bancroft runs programmes for abusers in the US.

If you haven't read it, I'd highly recommend it. He talks about common myths around domestic abuse and why men abuse, and talks about how men can turn into abusers. It's a very good book.

Yes, StaceySolomon, absolutely. Agree with your post 100%.

is it american reads v quacky oprah i have a book and clinic- based on that passage

Lundy Bancroft restores my faith in men.

He's one of the only men out there who seriously addresses male violence, and doesn't try to minimize the wrongness with 'bibble babble' excuses.

Have never read LB

I should do really, it seems like a bit of an MN bible

as a woman, when you read it, your first thoughts are, "but everything he's saying is obvious, yes I've noticed that myself, etc"

Then you realise nobody else has written about these "obvious" things, certainly not a man. And in the current system, only those things that men write are taken seriously. Then you realise Bancroft is a lone voice in the wilderness it makes you realize how much of a problem male violence really is and how rarely it is every addressed in a serious way.
Also, he has written the book as a practical manual for women, not to pontificate or teach.

How long has it been published (approx)

And why hasn't it triggered similar writing ?

Perhaps it has, I dunno

Am not well read on this kinda stuff

"How long has it been published (approx)"

Not sure. Two days ago I gave my copy to a friend, who left her husband two weeks ago and fled went to a women's shelter with her 5 yr old. Her husband was a drunk (I knew that) but I didn't know he hit her. I'd asked her once, but she'd denied it.
I've given her the book because now she has to go start going through the divorce process and he's already told her that he wants to commit suicide and blah blah. Everything she's going to need is covered in the book.

"And why hasn't it triggered similar writing ?"

WHo knows? Blame the patriarchy? Have you heard about that woman who was raped by her husband and was put in jail herself. Well she's been released but he's got custody of her children and is not handing them over.

I heard, sakura. I have no words left about that particular travesty

Again, 'Feminism: the radical notion that women are people.'

'It's a good job there aren't many men on MN Dicussions'.

Well, no shit, it's called Mumsnet.

Bad women, wanting it all their way.

Sort of like some men then . . .

Oooo, scary stuff.

published in 2002

I know

My post just reminded me of something. Although my friend's husband is a drunk, he was stone cold sober when he told her he was going to commit suicide because she was leaving him. That is abusive behaviour in itself, and shows that he doesn't feel remorse. He is even lying about her, calling my husband and spreading lies.

So, it's obvious that while alcohol is sometimes connected in DV, that's never the whole story.

LOL @ DD1. She is 7 and she is 4ft., 6in tall now. Her legs like giraffes.

For some reason, boys are always all over her, probably because she doesn't give a shit.

I had to tell her about the royal wedding.

She couldn't have been less interested, the girl already scouted by Wilhemena Kids and Storm for children.

She shrugs her shoulders, turns her back to it all, and walks off.

Do unto others as you'd have them do to you.

I'd never treat my spouse in a way I would not wish to be treated.

Not sure if this is relevent but, Bob Herbert is a feminst, he writes for the new york times. he wrote an article called punished for being female it's old but it's good to know someones on our side

I bought the Lundy Bancroft after seeing dittany recommend it. (That'll surprise her! ) I read it through, nodding in recognition, passed it to my friend who's been in a couple of abusive relationships, she actually laughed out loud when we located her last... then she passed it to her daughter, who promptly ditched the fuckwit she was with at the time. I'm taking it up to another friend next month, whose partner is verbally and emotionally abusive, I'll be underlining bits before then.

It really is a brilliant book, so thanks, dittany. :)

If I'd never been to MN I would never have heard about these DV issues, or other issues that are discussed here. Don't shoot me but if I'd been asked pre MN I'd have naively thought sexual equality had been achieved.

They don't come up in discussions in my RL. That was part of the point of the OP, if men don't come to MN they won't hear about any of these problems.

(whether they'd believe it or not would be another matter)

I have a boy and a girl so only by reading and contributing to sites like MN can I hope to raise them equally.