To want DSD to have an abortion?

[TessoftheDamned]

Heavy going stuff but really doubting myself on this.

DSD is 14 and we thought was a straight-laced girl, very into her studies, hardly ever goes out, etc. Anyway, has fallen pregnant and just had the nerve to tell us (lives with us full-time, her mother is not in the picture). The guy is 'long gone' as she says, refuses to tell us his name or where she met him. To be honest I'm a bit worried there was some pressure and perhaps even date rape thing going on, but I haven't pushed it as she's very vulnerable at the moment (as one might expect).

She is adamant she is keeping her baby. Although I'm sure it will end up looking to us as parents and her as a sister, we don't want another baby and don't want to look after hers. She's not an adult but it is her body, I'm so torn. I feel like she's doing herself and everyone else a great disservice bringing this heartache, but of course a baby is normally a source of joy...

DH is flabbergasted and shocked, he's still trying to find out who the boy is (she told us 3 days ago). She clams up when we suggest anything other than keeping the baby and refuses to speak to us.

AIBU?

Sorry Tess I am probably harsh and this is the last thing you need to hear, she is a child, you cannot allow her the benefit of adult decisions, she is NOT an adult. She has not behaved like an adult, and she isnt one. The fact that she is capable of getting pregnant, does not mean she is capable of being a mother.

GivesHeadlessHorseMan speaks a lot of sense.

I honestly don't think there is anything to discuss with her. You book her the appointment, you take her to the clinic, much like you would take her to the dentist to have a tooth out.

She cannot blame you for any ill feelings in the future, it is not your fault that she became pregnant. She may not hate you in the future for taking this adult decision out of her incapable hands and off her mind, she may in fact thank you for it.

Lucky escape.

You should not dilly dally over this, but be firm and take the adult decision hard as it is.

I was, I think, the first to say that if one of my DDs were in this position they would be told that they can have the baby by all means... but not in my house (and yes, I do mean it and would stand by that view, to whoever questioned whether those of us who said it would really go ahead with it). Nothing I have read since has changed my mind. In fact, I'm with droves and think that the OP's DH is taking the piss and treating her with zero respect.

This isn't just about the OP having to do the childcare or being woken by a screaming child... this is about the intrusion of a babysitter in her home if she doesn't provide childcare, about crayon on her newly painted walls, having to place everything out of reach... little things, all of which she has made a conscious decision to put behind her forever. Little things which all add up, things which will affect her every waking moment, change her environment and her life, to say nothing of the effect they and the baby and it's consequent reduction of her time and energy will have on her relationship with her own young children.

This is, as WetAugust said, a childcentric society gone mad. A 14 year old should not have the right to make life changing decisions for adults or for their siblings, particularly when those decisons are likely to be so damaging.

Hear, hear for the three above.

I'm agreeing with scottishmummy, I'm pretty sure that at 14, unless there is some reason to doubt her capacity for consent, it's the 14 year olds decision anyway.

It isn't all about the OP. The OP has choices, about how she supports the DSD, and how she handles this in her marriage. She doesn't have to stay if she doesn't want to look after the baby whatsoever. She too, has choices, as an adult.

A 14 year old cannot have the decision made for her. You are talking about permanently destroying the baby that is inside her. Not 'shelving it for later' or 'postponing' it. That baby will be gone.

For some people that is an acceptable choice. Some, even many, people would say that is the 'right' choice. But it is an irreversible one, and it is the DSD that will carry that for the rest of her life.

It is not child-centredness gone mad to allow her to make a decision. It is acknowledging that her life has already changed - she is now pregnant.

The relationship difficulties between Tess and her DH, his expectations of her, are not the fault of her DSD. If she fancied helping and assisting with the baby, how would that change the decision making process for the DSD? Are you all saying that the baby's life should depend on the willingness of Tess to help out?

If the DSD wants this baby, then she will have to organise the baby's care. The government will pay £160 per week for childcare. Tess can claim Child tax credits for the baby and Child benefit. It isn't as simple as 'it will cost the family money'.

"Lucky escape."

You would call aborting the life of a developing baby a 'lucky escape', QuintessentialShadows? I don't.

My son had a child at 15 girlfirend 14, for many years we brought her up during the week, with no help apart from finance's from DS stupidly I felt that they both (although they were not together when DGD was born)

DGD either spent all week with me going home to other granparents where Mum lived at that time till she was 18, or Friday - Monday with me going home in the week.

This went on till she was 10.

She has no real relationship with her mother in fact it is terrible although they love each other, there is a lot of resentment on both sides.

She has no real relationship with her father, more a brother/sister relationship, although he is now taking more responsibility than ever has before, and wants custody.

DGD is totally off the rails in the last year, she has no idea, who she is, or what she is.

My biggest concerns for her are all coming true.

She has just been put in LA care.

14 is to young to have a child.

Hi Tess, hope your talk went ok.

Just to follow on from Mellowtoday's very good suggestion of 23:31 about writing out everything that needs doing, hour by hour - when I was first pregnant with DS (at 30, he's now 10months) someone suggested I get the Gina Ford book. I looked at the newborn routine and was a little shocked by the amount of stuff that needed doing, and that from 7am - 7pm, pretty much all of your time was taken up, then all the stuff in the night to start with. Not saying you should make her follow the routine, but just as a reality check of what needs doing, roughly how long each change/feed will take etc it might be a good guide that can't just be seen as "my step-Mum exaggerating to make me have an abortion".

If you are in West Kent area, I'm happy to meet her to introduce DS, give her a straight talk about how hard the last 10 months have been, let her change a pooy nappy etc.

Lougle, yes I do. I stand by what I said, because the "host" of the embryo is a child.

Lougle Tue 26-Oct-10 08:50:43
It isn't as simple as 'it will cost the family money'.

-----

Its not about the money

Its about the time

2 years for GCSEs
2 years for A level (OP said about DSD wanting to do a particular profession earlier)
4 years for a degree

thats 8 years of imposition.

Then there is Granny has looked after you whilst I got my education, she can do it whilst I work(after all children don't like change).

The precident is already being set by DH and DSD.

And as graveyard has very clearly demonstrated, sometimes it's a lucky escape for the child, as well as the mother.

'The government will pay £160 per week for childcare. Tess can claim Child tax credits for the baby and Child benefit. It isn't as simple as 'it will cost the family money'.'

It certainly is with this government! If you think they're going to keep generously funding teen parents, guess again. Look what they are doing to lone parents in general.

What if Tess' family earn too much to qualify for CTC and CB (under the new changes coming in)?

It's not going to be so simple as, 'Teen parent, get benefits'.

This government is trying to get rid of all these benefits because they believe it encourages irresponsibility in people.

(awaits quarterly growth figures and monitors FTSE).

I haven't read all this. I wasn't going to comment, but something just made me a little concerned.

Your DSD needs counselling from someone she can trust. She needs to decide if she will keep the baby (it is her choice, would some of these comments be made if she had a mental age of 14 but was physically 25?).

But far more importantly someone needs to get to the truth of the boyfriend. Is he really off the scene? Is he really her age? I have heard very similar stories, and the father turned out to be an adult and even a married man. (Or even worse.)

Secondly why does she want to keep the baby? Is it a religious belief? Fear of future infertility? Or what?

I would suggest maybe BPAS? As they are pro-abortion I believe you would not object to their counselling but they would give good counselling advice.

My sister had an abortion at 15.

My mother pushed her into it.

That kid would've been 25 years old now.

We were at Catholic School. The pregnancy caused a massive scandal, the termination even bigger. Even I felt the shame of it (I was 13)

She's never been able to have children - the op left her messed up physically and mentally. She's bipolar and has all sorts of problems (though I believe it made worse the problems she already had)

She's always been a tricky customer (unstable) and there was no way she could care for a child (she cannot look after herself even now) and my mother would've ended up looking after the baby.

I feel sad the child didn't get a chance of life though. It didn't ask to be created.

That's how it should be, expat. Young girls need to understand the full financial impact and commitment of motherhood. (and young men as well it goes without saying.)
Their baby should always be their financial responsibility - not the states, and personally I would not fund them to stay in education. There needs to be far more disinentive for under 18s. And I personally would withdraw funding for them to stay in full-time education. They need to realise the burden and the sacrifice falls to them and them alone. The sooner they accept that the easier it will be to make the appropriate choices - and hopefully those choices will be more about birth control and less about emotive wrangles over abortion.

Of course there will always be emotionally vulnerable girls who will get pregnant no matter what, but they shouldn't be allowed to assume they can keep the baby and everyone else will take responsibility for them.

If more parents of pregnant teenagers were forced to take full financial responsibility for them then they'd soon be much less 'understanding' and about their daughter's choices.

Hi- OP - how are you this morning?

Opinions, advice, examples over and over.

Hope your day is OK today.

Thinking of you.

I am utterly chilled by Quintessential's post 'honestly don't think there is anything to discuss with her. You book her the appointment, you take her to the clinic, much like you would take her to the dentist to have a tooth out.'

I think termination may well be the 'best' thing here too - but you cannot force it on any person. That is not a caring act. It isn't like having a tooth out either - that is simply absurd.

I've just been talking to dd1 wo is 12.5 about this. She felt very strongly that it should be the girl's decision and that personally she thought adoption the best option. I cannot think of any legal or moral basis which would justify my disregrading and disrespecting that opinion.

I dreamt about this thread last night - isn't that mad.

Tess I hope you and your DSD are all right today.

I agree with HeadlessHorseman and QuintessentialShadows's posts of recently - really make a huge amount of sense, and I think brave posts on such a contentious and emotive issue. I totally agree with strongly recommending an abortion like they say. It need not be the ruination of her life, however it is likely that giving birth to the baby certainly will have a devastating effect on her.

Poor child, and poor Tess. This is a really horrible situation for the whole family.

Morning OP. Guess you've had enough advice and opinion to last a lifetime. Hope today dawns brighter than the last. Think we should leave you in peace now for a while.

Let us know how it's all going when the dust has settled. Love to you all.

See NotThere - I think QS's tooth analogy is right. I think it does need to be treated in a no-nonsense way, and not give in to all the emotion around it if at all possible. It is not a baby inside her, it is a collection of cells, the OP needs to be pragmatic in this situation as it seems she is the only one in her family who is thinking sensibly about the impact of her DSD having her baby.

I do agree with your last post, Headless.

I believe it would be unwise to plan to rely on government handouts at this point in time.

If these cuts don't show fruition in a relatively short amount of time, this government will cut more.

Of course you cannot remove the emotion frfom the situation! I agree it's not a baby now - but to pretend that this isn't a highly emotive and potentially damaging situation is just apalling. If wishing made it so.......

Altinkum I think your comments re QS are offensive, fair enough you may disagree totally but there is no reason to descend to spiteful and hurtful name calling.