To Think The Ex Wife Is In The Wrong Here?

[midori1999]

DSD turned 18 a few months back. DSS is 14. DH has been paying over-the-odds maintenance since the split. DSD is not DH's birth child, but he has brought her up as his and treats her exactly the same as his DS, we both do. DSD does not know DH is not her birth father. (DH and I do nto agree with this, but that's another thread)

Anyway, DH had always assumed that maintenance for DSD would end once she was 18. It seems ex wife expected it to end when she finished full time education. Due to this discrepancy, DH and I decided we would reduce the maintenance paid to the ex wife and then give DSD an allowance, and leave the ex wife to take housekeeping from DSD if she wished.

DSD has two part time jobs and takes home approx. £75 per week from these. We agreed with DSD we'd give her £50 a month allowance. We did tell DSD upon agreeing the allowance that her Mum might decide to take the whole £50 in maintenance and that she should respect and adhere to her Mum's decision.

So, DSD recently complained to DH that her Mum wanted £75 a month from her. Tonight, the ex on the phone has told DH that DSD is 'in debt' now as she refuses to pay the maintanance and she wanted DH to agree there and then to stop giving the money to DSD and give it to ex wife each month instead. I don't think DH should do this, especially without speaking to DSD first. The ex also said that DSD had applied for an overdraft and been refused. (probably just as well)

The ex never allows DH any part in decisions made in their children's lives, but always comes to him if there is some problem. She has a very poor relationship with her daughter and I feel DSD's current behaviour (as well as some past behaviour) is a symptom of that. I also feel that DSD has few adults she can trust in her life and DH and I have worked hard to show DSD we think of her as an adult now and make her feel like she can talk to us. I think it would be wrong to now take the allowance from DSD.

Who is in BU here and what would be the best way to deal with this situation?

OP you won't get unbiased views on here as people have their own experiences to draw from

I think you should pay all the money to the mother until DSD goes to university and then support DSD through university.

But OP why make the decision to reduce payments when the child is so close to becoming an adult and new arrangements will have to be made?

The mother does sound awful to be honest, but we are being dripped information now.

altinkum, sorry, DSS is my DH's bio child. DSD was a year old when DH met his ex.

If the DSS is your biological son and he is being abused have you been to social services. I would be working my arse off to improve the home situation or get residency

I agree with vespasian.

Seems like your DH is putting your DSD through a lot of upset for no good reason.

My last post referred to vespasian's post of 14:38:03

Unfortunately with every story there is your version, their version and the truth

i find it hard to believe that your partners ex is all the things you say she is
i believe that there is probably more to it than that
however if she is and if her children are having as hard a time with her as you say why are making you making it more difficult for them?
why rock the boat?

also
why constantly talk about going halves on school trips as though it is something out of the ordinary
most parents i know pay extra on top of their ordinary budget for school trips and it isn't included in csa calculations...it's when and if the children want and need it and crucially they can afford it and are happy to give

midori - I also agree with vespasian's last post - if your DHs ex treats her DCs so badly why do you not intervene?

All you appear to have done is antagonise his ex over money and your DSD is stuck in the middle.

Your DSS and DSD are being abused. Why not put some energy into doing something about that rather than get into arguments over one year's worth of maintenance?

vespasian, how the ex behaves doesn't have any bearing at all on maintenance payments, it's being 'drip fed' because it was too much to post in the OP and not relevant to the OP. However, it seems that several people refuse to believe that DH and I had anything other than the worst motives here and the birth mother is some sort of saint who we are trying to make out to be dreadful to her DD. That is not the case and hence I felt the need to add the additional info.

DH and I had both thought maintenance ended when DSD was 18, neither of us having experience of older children and absent parents. When DH spoke to his ex around 6 months before DSD's 18th birthday about this, to give her prior notice, it became apparent this wasn't usually the case. However we were expecting twins at the time and had partly planned the pregnancy at that time do to the fact we expected to be in a slightly better position finacially. I do realise that us having a baby is nothing to do with maintenance for DSC btw, but when we realised maintenance would have to continue, plus that DSD was being expected to pay rent and would have to pay for her car to be taxed/MOT'ed etc when she hadn't even used it yet, it just seemed at the time that this arrangement would provide DSD with some extra cash and also enable DH to have some extra money put by to hopefully see his DC more often, especially since the arrival of our twins migh tmake things a little difficult for them and seeing them as often as possible might help that.

Does the possible solution I have posted seem reasonable to you? (eg. continue to give the £50 to DSD but also give an extra £50 per month to the ex on top of the maintenance she is now getting?)

I accept that midori and I am sorry. I suppose it is relevant to people suspecting the mother may not have her dd's best interests in heart.

I think you should just keep the previous arrangement until she finsishes her a levels.

we have tried to do something about the situation with the DSC. My DH has spoken to his ex wife's mother who hates her boyfriend with a passion and feels he is unfair to the DSC. She also feels there is nothing she can do about it. We have considered contacting SS in the past but the ex wife would suspect it was us and would then make it very difficult for the DSC to see DH at all. So, we have instead made it clear that if they ever wanted to live/stay here, they'd be welcome and if they ever wanted to talk to us about anything then they could do so, in confidence if they'd prefer (eg. we wouldn't take it up with their mother unless they asked us to do so)

Another example of what the ex is like is that she smokes heavily in the house, despite DSS having asthma and refuses to smoke outside. When he was a toddler he was in hospital on a regular basis and DH had to stay with him in hospital as his ex didn't want to as she had to go outside to smoke there. (this came from her mother, not DH)

Midori - I don't think you are doing this because of the bahaviour of the mother, and you genuinely did not realise the implications of reducing maintenence on hwer 18th birthday. Though maybe you should have realised yourself?

But now you do realise the implications, can you not keep it going until she goes into higher ed? Then there would be no issue.

And what are you going to do about the treatment your DSCs are getting at the hands of their SF and their mother?

Thanks vespasian. I do appreciate that however well intentioned we do seem to have messed this up rather badly, leading to problems for DSD.

I just feel awful stopping the money that she expected to have now.

rannaldini, as far as I was aware, if the CSA calculated maintenance, DH would not then be liable for any extra on top of that. I agree that arrangements for school trips should be as you have said, only the ex wife expcts it and if we say we cannot afford it, she then gets the DSC to ask us.

who in the world ends or changes maintence payments without serious discussion with all those involved?
who then plans a family around these unverified plans?

i wonder if that was the order the decisions were made in

please more evil birth mother stories
it's almost Halloween

Just to add, every time DH tries to discuss with his ex wife things the DSC have said about things that happen/have happened, she hangs up and refuses to speak to him for weeks. When DH decided to take DSS to our own GP regarding the enuresis as it was apparent the ex hadn't, despite what she said, she went mental and refused to answer the phone or let DH speak to the DSC for a month.

When DH suggested it might be easier to make access arrangements directly with DSD now she is 18 and working part time so that she can't visit at the same times as DSS, she accused him of 'going behind her back' even though he hadn't even discussed it with DSD yet. Prior to that she had told DH that the DSC didn't want to visit here, only that turned out to be a complete lie.

rannaldini, you can believe what you like. Obviously we didn't discuss our family planning with the ex and we had mistakenly assumed when maintenance ended. That was a mistake on our part. As it happens it doesn't matter now anyway as we lost our twins at 24 weeks and it seems I have a condition that means it is unlikely I can have any more DC. (another issue the ex was a total bitch about)

sorry to be flippant but i don't think you have been terribly straightforward
telling us a welter of negative stories about his ex w will not change the mess you both have created

if you can't afford something a no will suffice this is not the same as an arranged relied upon monthly payment and cannot be taken into consideration as maintenance

i'm sorry to hear about your twins

Midori- I think what you and your dh have discussed and are now consdering doing is more than fair.

Another point when everyone is having a go at you. If you were going through the CSA the amount your DH has to pay would have been reduced as soon as your twins were born as you also had them to pay for.

And Rannaldini - the OP has said several times that they discussed the changes to the maintenance with the ex way in advance of the DSD's 18th birthday.

And paying half for school trips can be something out of the ordinary - such as when you never get told about them until they are about to happen even though you have said verbally and in writing that you are more than willing to pay your share if it is discussed with you first. Just as it would be if the parents are still together.

Oh no sorry that doesn't happen does it. As the mums are always perfect and the dads and stepmums the opposite (hmm):o

sorry xposted. Sorry Midori

Thankyou, I shouldn't have mentioned that really, it's not especially relevant.

This woman has made our lives extremely difficult and, IMO, completely messed up her daughters head. I do find it very difficult to be objective about her and I do feel she has been deliberately difficult at every turn, including over this. Assuming the DSC were both DH's birth children, and to all intents and purposes, they both are, then she has had very generous maintenance over the years, even discounting trips, extra money for things etc.

As I have said, we made a genuine mistake in when the maintenance should have ended and when we realised that we tried to make the best of the situation to benefit the DSC most. Things have changed slightly and we can afford to pay the ex wife the extra £50 a month and DSD, hence I suggested that.

This is turning into a terribly stormy thread!

I think the ex-wife is a complete cow to be charging her child rent when she's still at school doing her A levels. I know some parents who do this and in my opinion it sucks. Do they want their kids to leave school at 16 and get a job to make ends meet? It's so short-sighted.

Very sorry about your twins, OP.

I do agree that with hindsight, the maintenance should have stayed the same until DSD left school. However, you sound like you're trying to address that with your new plan.

One thing you may not have thought of re uni support - while I recognise that not all parents can afford to support their kids through university, the government does expect them to if they can (at least in Scotland - no idea what the case is in other parts of the UK!). I feel strongly about this because of a situation with my dad and step-mum at the time, which basically involved him changing his mind every 5 minutes about what he had agreed to pay. He is a lovely man, but it caused a lot of grief and stress at the time. However, the fact remains that cost of living grants etc are based on the parents' income, with no provision made for the situation where parents can afford to pay (in the government's opinion) but don't. Yes, there are always student loans, but that's a huge millstone round a young adult's neck - better for them to owe you money (assuming there is no interest charged!) than that.

The whole situation with not telling the poor girl about her biological father sounds fraught with disaster. Good luck, no matter how that pans out!

Midori - I can see that you have had the best of intentions but have got into a bit of a mess with this. Is there any way you can carry on the same level of maintenance to the ex until your DSD starts in higher ed? On condition that the ex does not demand any rent from DSD?

DSD then has her earnings from part time jobs to herself so will not really need an extra allowance from you.

How old is your DSS though? I am very worried about him as it sounds as if he is not old enough to go against your DHs ex and decide to live with you even though he may desperately want to. It would also be very difficult for your DSD to make this decision as it sounds like she is very browbeaten by her mother

Midori - I think your intentions are good, however perhaps you should revert back to your previous arrangements (ie full payment going to BM not stepdaughter) until she finishes sixth form.

I know you meant well, but changing tack seems to have caused real problems.