to hate breastfeeding my baby

[FeelLikeTweedleDee]

It's supposed to be nurturing and an amazing bonding experience. But I despise breastfeeding. I'm one of those malcontent mothers who breastfeed out of duty alone. When I read about mothers who enjoy breastfeeding and who feel sad when their child self-weans I feel like sectioning them.

10 Things I Hate About Breastfeeding:

1. THE PAIN. They say "if it hurts you're doing it wrong". That's one of the many breastfeeding bluffs you'll hear at antenatal classes (don't want to scare off all the new expectant mothers do we?) Well it hurts me and I've had my latch checked by a thousand professionals. Also I've had thrush. Also I have a very strong let-down reflex. Considering the let-down reflex is normal, and indeed essential, then it's safe to say that breastfeeding hurts and I'm doing it RIGHT.

1. YOUR BODY IS OWNED BY OTHERS. All through your pregnancy you console yourself by saying "I can't wait to give birth, then I can have my body back to myself". WRONG. As a breastfeeding mother, your baby continues to have dibs on your body.

1. THE HUMILIATION. Aside from imprisoning themselves in their home for 2 years, breastfeeding mothers have to face the humiliation of breastfeeding in public. Every Tom, Dick and Harry can get a view of your baps. Some may even decide to comment as you sit there and flop an udder out. So not only does your body belong to your baby, it also belongs to the general public too. You may as well sign on the dotted line because ownership ain't yours anymore.

1. LIMITED WARDROBE. Because someone else owns your body, that means that you have to dress to their tastes. Chest access is key. Say goodbye to that inseason lacy bodysuit you've had your eye on. Say goodbye to most dresses actually. Say hello to Primark vest tops and masculine shirts. Joy.

1. FORMULA CULTURE. Most people give up breastfeeding after a few weeks. Thus we live in a formula culture. Bottles are everywhere. On Congratulations cards, in soaps, in children's books, on babygros. The result is that most people (your close family included) think that by breasstfeeding you have changed into a strange earth-mother type, and maybe even slightly pervy. And of course you're the only BFing mother at your babygroup.

1. MRS MARTYR. As a breastfeeding mother you are soley responsible for your baby's continued existence on the plannet. Only you can feed baby. (It's understandable why a lot of new dad's support breastfeeding these days!) Welcome to the world of lonely midnight feeds. Welcome to your partner going for drinks down the pub whilst you stay at home, udders at the ready. But what about expressing I hear you say? For most women the breastpump extracts 3oz. As baby grows she'll want more than that. You make an appointment with your doc but she won't prescribe anything to increase your supply. Time to pop to Holland and Barrett to get some Fenugreek herbs. As a result you end up smelling of curry. Your FFing friends at the babygroup avoid your side of the mat.

1. SO-CALLED "PROFESSIONALS". Health visitors, midwives, GPs, breastfeeding counsellors - they don't know shit about breastfeeding. But they will love to mindfuck you with conflicting info. "Your breasts have dried up because the pump isn't getting much out". "Just top up with formula, it's fine". "Don't bother feeding past 6 months". Because this is your first time breastfeeding you don't know any better. You trust these professionals. As time passes you notice that a lot of what they have instructed you to do has actually sabotaged your BFing efforts. You swear that you'll learn from these mistakes for your next child. But what about your poor first child - the breastfeeding guinea pig.

1. GROWTH SPURTS. Every month or so you're going to hit one of these bad boys. You'll be constantly feeing every 1-2 hours. No sooner have you clipped your bra cup back up then your baby demands its next meal. If you were on formula you would simply increase the volume of feed and hand it over to dad/grandma/sister in law/the dog. Also because baby is feeding so frequently you worry that your milk is not enough, and you can't see exactily how much milk your baby is getting. Are you STARVING your baby? Dark throughts creep into the back of your mind. The old lady in the post office gives you evils as your baby screams the place down. "Baby needs her bottle" the old lady comments, tutting and shaking her head. You begin to wonder if she's right.

1. MONITORED INTAKE. Really looking forward to several double vodkas after giving birth weren't you? After 9 months of t-totalism, a big blow out was just what you needed. Well tough titties. And that medication for your acne? Say goodbye to it and hello to a face that resembles those Cath Kidston pokerdotted handbags.

10. YOU HAVE NO CHOICE. A large part of motherhood is about making the right choices for your family. Stay at home - go to work, co-sleeping or seperate rooms, dummy or no dummy. And breastfeeding or formula feeding is one of those choices right? WRONG. you have no choice. From the moment of conception we are bombarded with "breast is best". The scientists and the government have made your choice for you. Afterall, you want to do what's best for your child, right? (How can you answer no to that question and not live with guilt).

Yay! Now I can say I've been a slut on a train, plane and in the backseat of an automobile. I've even done it in the library.

I am a dirty, dirty bfing slut .

I was a slut in front of my whole extended family the other day, including my 94 yr old Granny , in the middle of a restaurant. Oooh you bad girl.

"are the strident pro-BF'ers who force "facts and figures" at her"

Damn their eyes!

They should take a lesson from the baby milk companies.

Formula manufacturers NEVER promote their product through huge, glossy marketing campaigns covering the majority of advertising pages in pregnancy magazines and on prime time television. God forbid they would EVER try to manipulate women's feelings about how they feed their baby with clever marketing tactics.

Oh hang on a second.....

FACTS? People are quoting FACTS? How fucking dare they? Bloody irresponsible, people mentioning true things and knowing stuff. Bastards.

colditz, 'slut' means the same in the U.S. as it does here. Mystified as to why Josie picked that word, but now I can say I was a total slut in Tesco!

yes it is good 2 get stuff off your chest :) I breastfed for 8 weeks. Ruined boobs :( even though I have stopped for over a year, some milk still comes out, does anyone else get this? or have I just got weird boobs?

Friend was sluttish not for bfeeding but sluttish in not doing anything else eg housework, cooking, even showering.

It was amazing, imv, that she could be so relaxed and happy doing nothing. MrsC2010 above lists all that she achieves in a day, walk dog for 2 hours, cook delic meal, springclean and bfeed. That was me except bfeeding took so long that none of the others could be fitted in and it freaked me out. These are the iniial weeks/months btw not 9 months in.

Having been brought up to strive for a fulfilling career, attractive home etc etc to suddenly be expected to stay home alone with teeny baby bfeeding most of the day was a real shock - no internet in those days or much daytime tv, very lonely if you aren't near family.

So I can empathise fully with FLTD some days were definitely like that.

Oooh, the secondcoming! A double-edged slut! I somehow wish I could say the same about the library..

JosieZ, I think you make a valid point about the shock that many women experience relating to just how much teeny tiny babies feed.

I think it's a bit sad, though, that it isn't made clear to people that this stage is so, so short. It really has nothing to do with what you were brought up to do: if you injured your spine or had a major operation, you would accept the need to give in and recuperate, but somehow the time spent recovering from birth and feeding a small baby is seen as "wasted time". For the sake of a few short weeks or months, women turn themselves inside out with concern about this "waste", leading to the "happy mummy = happy baby" stuff that's so familiar.

I think that maybe a few more mummies would be happier if it were made clear how self-limiting the time sat under a baby really is in the context of a whole lifetime. It also seems to me that there might be "happier mummies" if breastfeeding wasn't used as a particular point of focus for babyshock so that many women who make the switch to formula because of how "unhappy" bfing makes them don't look back on the early days and blame breastfeeding for their emotional reaction to the magnitude of
being a parent and having to give up some of what was normal before for the sake of this tiny person.

I had tremendous difficulties feeding my son - tongue-tie, slow weight gain, having to feed every 2 hours around the clock then express and refeed, syringe feeding that would make him gag, thrush, mastitis. Y'know, the works. My sister came to visit from Ireland to find me sitting on my bed naked from the waist up, bawling my eyes out with a baby on one boob and a pump on the other and my dh trying to massage both to stimulate my supply. I'm sure I looked like a train wreck. I was not a happy mummy!

We did have to give formula in the end as the little man's weight plummeted, but I am still feeding now.. and the good thing about that is that I can look back on that image of myself and realise that at least part of it had nothing to do with feeding at all.. it was just the enormity of not having a blinding clue what the chuff I was supposed to do with a small, screaming baby!

arses - good post.

I many women simply have a problem with the intensity and intimacy of breastfeeding - it's a cultural thing: partly to do with our body obsessions and how we sexualise breasts, and partly to do with our protestant work ethic - feeling like we have to be productive in one sphere or another all the time to justify our existence. Also the issue of mothers spending a lot of time on their own with tiny babies - not good in my opinion. New mums need nurturing.

Re: honesty about breastfeeding. Yes, but we need honesty and better education about all aspects of caring for a tiny baby. I think that there are plenty of ff women who are struggling with babies who are unsettled/pukey/constipated on formula or who simply don't feed well, and this needs to be acknowledged as well. Thing is we don't blame the problems on the method of feeding when it's an artificially fed baby - we think, this is just what having a baby is like.

Great post secondcoming, couldn't agree more-although can't agree about the amount of time it takes to establish BF as a matter of course.

I was really really lucky (only now realising just how lucky..) and my baby BF immediately, six days of soreness, and then was easy peasy.

Don't even remember growth sprurts being an issue. Only problem I had was too damn much milk and having big wet patches on my front every day!

However, if I had found it even half as difficult as you say you did I wouldn't have done it.
And I probably would have been made to feel like a failure and a bad mother by countless HV'S and doctors etc.

I do remember right after I gave birth, as I was sitting there with my baby guzzling away six hours into his first day, a woman in the next cubicle just crying and crying because she had been trying to feed for two days and couldn't. Her baby was crying too, the woman was so distressed because her baby was hungy and she couldn't feed her.
The woman asked for some formula and the midvives acted as though she had asked for strichnine.
They told her that if she really wanted that, she would have to go to the shop and get some, because " we don't keep it in here!"
I just wanted to slap the bitches around the head and scream "let this woman feed her fucking baby!!"

Anyway, I get the whole thing about breast milk being better, and yeah, it is, but don't forget, this OP has already BF for months. Why drive yourself nuts and be miserable? I bet a mothers unhappiness has a way of getting in the milk (stress hormones?-come someone-on find me a study!)

Should have said that DD is 10 wks now, and so far touch wood BF has been quite trouble free. As such it doesn't take as long, and I have BF'd in all sorts of odd places! It wasn't ever thus. And of course the dinner might not have actually been delicious!

"8.. If you were on formula you would simply increase the volume of feed and hand it over to dad/grandma/sister in law/the dog.."

I've got to get me one of those dogs.

Re 'artificial feeding'. It's a technical term, used often in textbooks. It's not a term, I think, that should be used between mothers or to mothers - 'artificial', by an accident of language, has judgey overtones in English (I heard a discussion of 'artificial flowers' on the radio and the woman flogging them was calling them 'faux flowers' - anything to get away from 'artificial'. Not that I think 'faux feeding' would be any better )

northernrock - you are describing very poor postnatal care. No one in that amount of distress over feeding needs a shocked response to a request for formula. They are also lying to her. All maternity units keep formula or else they could get it from the stores or the paediatric ward. Women in that situation need TLC plus some practical help - she could have been supported to express colostrum for a start; she could have been given help to attach the baby...and of course if she made a choice to give formula, that should have been 'allowed' with no fuss or scolding.

No one can 'make' someone else 'feel' a failure. If a doctor or HV makes a stupid remark (and actually, these remarks are far more likely to be critical of bf, not ff!) then they cannot 'make' someone feel bad - they can 'make' them feel angry and irritated, for sure! Or they can 'make' them feel 'this person thinks I am a failure'....but you don't have to agree.

Taking a long time to establish bf is not inevitable. There is a huge range of normal. Mothers need to be prepared to give time and space to their new babies, and our society does not really enable them to do this. But it is not always a terrible chore or painful or exhausting.

secondcoming - you use the phrase 'milk is just milk' in various ways many times. It makes no sense to me. It sounds as if all milk is the same and it doesn't matter at all what sort you give your baby. That can't be what you mean, is it?

I completely agree with arses about the babyshock and how this could be confused with BF issues. As BF issues occur when the baby is tiny to a few weeks old, and are (usually/hopefully) resolved or the mother switches to formula. I realise now, that I was very lucky as I found BF to be easy, and more or less pain-free after the first few days. However I did feel frustrated and somewhat depressed that I wasn't keeping on top of the housework, washing etc, even when everyone around me was telling me to REST and ENJOY MY BABY. How I wish I had. I will never have that time again, and I just want to turn the clock back and sit on the sofa, feeding my baby and not wishing the time away so that i can put another washing load on (no reason in the world why the washing couldn't have waited until DH came home - it should have).

If I'd had problems BF I'm sure I could have onflated my state of mind and the BF difficulties. In fact having a tiny baby is hard and disorienting, a first one especially so, and it is a real shame that we don't have more extended family/friends support - I did for a couple of weeks, but probably needed it for more like 5 or 6 weeks when the fog lifted.

*conflated

"No one can 'make' someone else 'feel' a failure" Tiktok?
Come one! A new mother is about one of the most vulnerable human beings alive. EVERYTHING can make her feel like a failure.

And yes, you are right. Apalling post natal care. (Whitington hospital-named and shamed) and lots COULD have been done. But wasn't. And in my limited experience almost nothing I was promised by the hospital brochures or the primary HC wotsit were delivered.

Anyway, I am just reporting what actually happened, and the fact that, even though i had no probs whatsoever BFing I am heartily sick of the bloody piousness of BFing advocates.

"you are never,ever going to make every woman want to bf-no matter how emotive the language is to describe the alternative,not matter how much science and research and FACT you throw at people- some people just don't want to and never will,and you can chuck as much money and education at these people and they still wont want to".

Well - state the obvious why dont'cha! On the other hand 98% of women leave Norway' maternity hospitals breastfeeding, and 90% are still breastfeeding at 3 to 4 months. Is there any reason why they can achieve this and we can't? Their breastfeeding rates were as poor as ours a couple of decades ago.

Even in the days when not breastfeeding was a death sentence for babies there were some women who couldn't bring themselves to do it.

"it's not your responsibility to feel sorry for these people or their children".

Responsibility? What's that got to do with it? It's not my 'responsibility' to feel sorry for anyone, for anything! But I do feel sorry for women who miss out on the satisfaction of breastfeeding and for children who miss out on the pleasure and the health benefits. I don't feel that way because I think I ought to. It's involuntary. As are most feelings.

Oh

"If they feel that they can't go on with bf or don't want to start or if there is a physical reason then they should not be made to feel 'bad' by the emotive use language and the borderline obsessive nature of many pro bf'ers"

So you think a situation where 90% of women are currently stopping breastfeeding before they intended to - mainly because of poor advice and support, isn't something to get animated about? Women in the UK who've not been brought up in a breastfeeding culture do not have the opportunity to make a truly free choice to breastfeed their child because they are up against powerful cultural pressures that make normal, happy breastfeeding really hard for them.

You may think this status quo is acceptable. I don't.

I think it leads to a lot of frustration and unhappiness that women are having such bad experiences of breastfeeding or being denied the opportunity to breastfeed in the first place because of cultural pressure.

There is clear evidence that many people in this country often don't understand what the important differences between breast and formula feeding are, or the research on which our understanding about baby feeding is based - as evidenced by some of the posts on this board.

"milk is just milk,it's not the biggest deal in the world"

Breastfeeding is very different from bottle feeding and it's what most mothers want to do, and how the majority of babies would want to be fed if they had a voice. And the experience of feeding is a big part of your developing relationship with your baby in the first few months of life. It's certainly their main preoccupation as well. It's not an incidental. It matters too much for us to allow it to carry on being fucked up in the way that it is right now.

i am bf my third child now,my first 2 were as different as chalk and cheese to bf. i can hand on heart say that i feel sad that my 2nd child didn't get the best of me as i was so fraught about feeding her i didn't actually properly enjoy her-and yes i sought support,regularly,and yes i really wanted to feed and yes i persevered until she self weaned at 9mths upon which she thrived,that's anecdotal yes,but true.

"apologies for length of this,i did the ll peer supporter training but don't provide support as the other women i did the training with were really really scarily into breastfeeding and to be honest i didn't want to be allied with a bunch of crack pots!"

So anyone who cares a lot about breastfeeding (I suppose you include midwife specialists, breastfeeding counsellors, HV's in this group) are 'crackpots'. Because according to you how you feed a baby doesn't actually matter very much. Lovely. God knows why you even bothered to start a peer supporter course. So much easier just to tell anyone with feeding problems that it doesn't really matter and they can just bottlefeed instead! Ta da! Problems solved!

Yes Titty, yes.
Obviously the HC system here lets a lot of people down.

And obviously things really need to change on a nationwide level. BUT the people bearing the brunt of the ferocity of BF advocates beleifs seem to be(inmho)the mothers themselves.

I am sure you would agree this is not right, but it is the way women who have a really hard time BFing are bullied (yes I said it) by certain HC proffessionals and thread like this.

So go ahead.
Change the system . Lobby for change. But when another mother feels like chucking the baby out of the window because she can't take it anymore, have some flexibility and accept it.

Sorry - meant to add, you need to put some context to the points you're making secondcoming.

"you are never,ever going to make every woman want to bf-no matter how emotive the language is to describe the alternative,not matter how much science and research and FACT you throw at people- some people just don't want to and never will,and you can chuck as much money and education at these people and they still wont want to."

Are you saying that public health campaigns to persuade people to breastfeed are pointless? Evidence suggests they aren't!The NHS has a duty to promote healthy behaviours, so there's a clear rationale for them promoting breastfeeding, along with other lifestyle choices which will help keep themselves and their children out of hospital.

Or are you talking about discussions here on mumsnet? Or in real life? This is a discussion board. If someone enters into a debate about the value or otherwise of breastfeeding here then isn't it completely valid to put the case for breastfeeding?

And don't midwives have a duty of care to make sure that mothers are in possession of accurate information when it comes to helping them make an informed decision about how they want to feed their baby?

"I bet a mothers unhappiness has a way of getting in the milk (stress hormones?-come someone-on find me a study!)"

There's no evidence that feeling sad or frustrated poisons your milk. There is evidence that postnatal depression (which can be triggered or made worse by difficult breastfeeding) is very bad for babies if it goes untreated. Which is why I'm all for better care for postnatal mums - so fewer of them end up with breastfeeding problems. I'm also all for the sweeping cultural changes we need to make breastfeeding a less socially isolating experience for new mums. Can't think that encouraging more bottle feeding is going to help much - 90% of babies already have a bottle by 6 months, so we've already got a near saturation situation when it comes to bottle feeding.

And there are also women who become depressed when they stop breastfeeding because they miss that aspect of their relationship with their baby. Plus also the mums of bottle fed babies (who have higher rates of PND as a group) who are missing out on the protective effect of successful breastfeeding. (when breastfeeding is successful it's linked to lower rates of PND - perhaps due to hormonal issues, or because breastfed babies as a group experience less illness so are probably easier to look after).

So none of it's cut and dried. There are no easy answers.

"And obviously things really need to change on a nationwide level. BUT the people bearing the brunt of the ferocity of BF advocates beleifs seem to be(inmho)the mothers themselves."

Sorry - again, context please!

Are you talking about the debates on this board? Are you saying that when a debate springs up about the value (or otherwise) of breastfeeding, those of use who think breastfeeding is worthwhile and important should censor ourselves and say nothing while other people post negative or inaccurate comments about it?

Or are you talking about some other situation? What? And where?

?I am sure you would agree this is not right, but it is the way women who have a really hard time BFing are bullied (yes I said it) by certain HC proffessionals and thread like this"

Sorry - who is being bullied on this thread? Is anyone being told they 'should' breastfeed? or criticised for not breastfeeding/stopping breastfeeding? And nobody's for HP telling mums they ought to breastfeed or criticising them when they don't. Or being nagged and pressured into bottle feeding for that matter, something that orobably happens just as regularly.

"But when another mother feels like chucking the baby out of the window because she can't take it anymore, have some flexibility and accept it."

Accept what? That she feels desperate? Yes - I think we ALL accept that!

But breastfeeding is a normal physiological function. I think if the OP was posting about having emotional difficulties coping with any other normal physiological function - like eating, walking, making love or going to the toilet, we'd all be encouraging her to get specialist counselling.

I strugeled to breastfeed my first two DC and this is with mixed feeding. I was in pain and when the child stoped screaming I would start- not a pleasant experience at all. So only bf for three months - mixed feed.

When I had my third child having been through that experience told myself I will try for two days. If it works will continue, if not will only bottle feed. Surprisingly I was able to do only BF till 9 months, teeth came out and bitting started- so I draw the line- and a very proud one!!

What ever people say is up to you sweethart to decide what is good for yourself and yourbaby. Make up your mind and stick with it.

northernrock - I am certain no one can 'make' someone else feel guilty....of course new mothers are vulnerable, of course they can feel criticised, isolated, unsupported, angry, disappointed, resentful, but unless they themselves also feel they are doing something wrong, no one can 'make' them feel guilty.

That's what guilt is - a belief you are doing something wrong and that you have/had the power to change it.

Yes, mothers (especially mothers) will say they feel guilty for just about anything - including things they have no control over. Some mothers feel guilty for having a miscarriage, or a pre-term birth that lands their baby in special care. But no one is 'making' them feel that way - it begins inside, and it's irrational.

OTOH, other mothers either recognise the irrationality of it, or don't feel guilty in the first place, just sad.