I now know I'm right about little girls and the hijab.....

[PosieComeHereMyPreciousParker]

talking to a beautiful Somali lady today(they all have hollywood smiles don't they, bloody genetic miracles!!) and she confirmed that whilst her 5 & 7 year old dds don't cover their heads she gets harassed and pressured by men at the mosque that her dds should cover. She said that whilst she doesn't because she loves her dds hair, other women do cover their very young dds. She said the men also say that unless they do it from very young they will not do it when they are the right age!

So it's not only about copying Mummy, just like the rise of the burka it's a renewed stick to beat women with.

Another Mumsnet trick. Say it, but subtly, so when challenged the other person looks aggressive and a bit mad.

The MSc is in psychology if I recall. It may help temper your over-reactions when people challenge your views. As you climb the academic ladder you will get plenty of people who will pick apart the smallest assertions you make and you won't be able to stamp your feet and moan "you are all ganging up on me".

Spikey,
I never said you weren't Italian if that's how you identify yourself. You could have as easily been english but that is your choice. It just sounded rude to say that you were 'insulted' to be thought english which is what started this off as it implies there is something wrong with english people. Your other arguements just didn't make sense.

spikey, nobody wants everyone to be all teh same, but at least be accurate about where you are from and what you are. you are british. you have italian ancestors. that doesn't make you italian.

so calling me thick is better than insinuating it?

Oh, bloody hell. I really do think there's an interesting, and quite nuanced discussion to be had here, but perhaps it's for another thread, after all.

I didn't say you are ganging up exactly. But there are people who jump in when the time is right. They disappear when the tide turns, which it will if this thread remains active.
Also, in Psychology, there is not just one opinion, set in stone. Things are very subjective, depending on the specific discipline. You may have knowledge of biology, etc. I'm interested in social constructionism. None of you can demean me on this thread.

well actually, if your parents are Italian and you like to be Italian rather than english - that is absolutely fine, never had a problem with that.

I think you are right Habbi. Time for a new thread perhaps?

They made sense. In the context of the other posts.
And booohyooo it is better to say it explicitly, so you can defend yourself. Would you rather I insinuated it then denied it later on?

Here we go again......my Dad is from Mars and my Mum is from Venus and i live in Uranus......am i an arsehole?..[hgrin]....yeah i probably am...[hsad]

Yes start a new thread. Seeing as it became a failed attempt to get someone to give up their identity through badgering and insinuations. Read it back tomorrow if you don't agree now.

you could deny it all you want, it is there in black and white for all to see. saying it or insinuating it is both as bad as the other.

and i just want to clarify my previous post.
i am not saying spikey is not italian. i am saying that having italian ancestors doesn't, on it's own make you italian.

Lots of Americans do define themselves in that way, though, don't they? i.e. they'll say "I'm Irish" "I'm Italian" And I've always found that interesting, as it seems at odds and yet inextricably linked with this very strong institutionalised "American" identity. I think that is partly to do with it being a "young" country, and perhaps also to being an ex-colony. England is quite different in that respect.

The very fact that you assume people are trying to "demean you" by challenging your arguments may cause you struggle with your dissertation viva.
If you expect people to demean you then you will see it everywhere. People who are confident in their views don't take dissent so much to heart.

Oh, too late for a new thread now, and better, I think, to let the dust settle here. But it is interesting.

I can't believe none of you took up my Iannucci tangent. Cultural dullards, the lot of you.

Everyone knows what they individually said. What about the overall tone?
Never mind. I need to go and dream Italian dreams.

oh please don't start another thread, i can't do this all again.

Like I said I'm not at uni now. This is mumsnet, which I use for personal reasons. I have been challenged on a few things in an academic environment actually. It was fine. Professional. Not a load of hectoring and insinuations of stupidity.

I won't be on the other thread so get on with it. You might get someone else like me though, so no guarantees there.

In my head Iannucci would be my clever gay friend. He's not gay though is he?

Identity is nebulous. Apart from my identity as a woman I don't see myself as "entirely" anything so also don't feel a sense of belonging. I don't mind this though

HAHAHA booooooooooooyhoooo....
me neither

thank god i got my bookmark facility back for this!!

What's a bookmark facility??

I might have to change disciplines. Historians will imply other historians are idiots as soon as look at you if they don't agree with your findings. It is a cut-throat academic world out there! And I swapped it all for medicine which is even more competitive and back-stabbing. That's why I come to MN; it is usually more straightforward!