Am I being unreasonable to not smack my son when he throws a tantrum and lashes out at me?

[teaandcakeplease]

I am a mumsnet regular, however I've never started a topic in AIBU, so please be gentle with me but I genuinely need to know if I am being unreasonable.

Bit of background: I have 2 children aged almost 3 and 18 months. My husband left me for a 21 yr old in October 2009 (short version of this, long one in relationships somewhere ). So I am a single parent bringing up 2 DCs on my own.

I do not have stairs as I live in a flat, so rather than a naughty step, my DD gets sent to stand by the front door when she behaves appallingly. This seems to work quite well for her and then after a few minutes I have a chat with her about why she shouldn't have done X and go and say sorry to Y. If she does something even more horrendous I take her favourite toy away for a set period of time after a warning. Anyway this works well for her at the moment and her behaviour is improving lately. I know there is still room for improvement in how I deal with things and am swatting up on books at the moment though.

My son has recently begun to throw tantrums when I say "no" to something. This usually involves flinging himself backwards and screaming and kicking his legs. He usually calms down after a few minutes. Distraction often works as well I find, as he is so small and tricky to reason with. In fact my son is very tenacious and goes back to things over and over again, that he knows he shouldn't do. So I try to arrange my flat to be child proofed to the best of my ability, to avoid these constant battles and the ones I cannot avoid I try to be consistent on. However when he is very tired sometimes his tantrums become more extreme and he may hit out at me. I usually say a firm "no" and he stops.

Anyway (sorry for the long explanation) today at my parents he kept repeatedly trying to do something, I'd tried saying "no", tried distraction, tried taking elsewhere etc and eventually he got very frustrated and very cross and hit out at me, I said a firm "no" and he stopped. He was very tired, it had been a long day and I was leaving theirs soon. My Dad at that point told me I should have smacked him and I said "surely when I'm trying to teach him that lashing out isn't acceptable, it makes no sense to smack him, to teach him to stop smacking me?" He walked off out of the room at that point cross with me. In fact several previous times at my parents, they have taken it upon themselves to smack my children on their wrist, when they're doing something they do not agree with. Which I've found tricky, they do not warn them first and sometimes it seems extremely minor the reason they've chosen. I suspect some of their reasoning is that now I'm a single parent, they think I need some help to bring the children up My mum also told me today that if I do not come down hard on him and then at school they're not allowed to challenge childrens behaviour properely anymore either, that basically he'll become a tear away as a teenager. I said he's not going to become a tear away, I do not give in to him and remain consistent when he throws tantrums and I said he is only 18 months and his sister was tricky at this age as well.

I know my parents have a problem with the fact that smacking is something I am not keen on, I have been known in the heat of the moment to do it and have felt awful afterwards but I know that it is not the best option and I try very hard to use other methods. But am I being unreasonable to not smack my son when he throws a tantrum and lashes out at me? Is he going to turn into a tear away if I do not discipline him more harshly at 18 months? I'm so tired of feeling like I'm not a good enough parent, my parents smacked me so much as a child though and I do not want it to be the first resort with my children

Sorry it's so long. So what do you think ladies (or gents)?

Thank you ladies, already feeling a bit better and realising I am doing OK as a parent. Agree with Firawla that that is probably exactly what they think.

I've tried talking to them Wurzel, I did this at my previous visit. They didn't discipline them for me this time (I suppose that's progress?), they just chose instead this time to tell me that I should smack him only

There is a generation thing going on here I agree, my dad is 69 yrs old and does believe smacking is the way forward

Tea you are doing a fab job! Don't let 'em get you down. You know you are right!

mummy knows best.... you sound like you are doing a bloody brilliant job. consistency is key and you obviously know this.

i'd maybe speak to your parents and tell them you don't approve of the wrist slapping and that it stops now.

Tea, you are a fantastic Mum and doing a great job.

No ifs or buts about it, you are right and they are wrong.

Its totally normal for little ones to have tantrums at this stage - dd can tantrum for England when she gets going. You are handling it perfectly by being consistent, redirecting and making sure you stick to firm boundaries.

It is a generational problem, parenting has changed a lot since our parent's day, but then again, they don't have the right to tell you how to raise your children.

Thanks Moose and Pisces and 120 (and more I've missed) I'm still a little teary but it's more relief tbh now

Tea, YANBU at all. You are doing wonderfully! Times have changed (thankfully). I likely wouldn't have been as kind as you were in responding, and if one of the GPs actually smacked my DS in any way they'd get smacked back from me immediately!

My boys hit out. I don't smack.

I'm no angel, I have smacked on the odd occassion, but I try not to.

We are supposed to be teaching them anger and violence have to be curtailed. Smacking is not acceptable. A friend told me her husband always tells their children when they are going to be smacked. Gets down to their level and says x I am going to smack you now as you have done this. Apparently this stops the parent form smacking out of anger.

I dunno, I think smacking should only be used in extreme circumstances and not as a regular punishment. I would try to only use it if the child is acting out to the extent that they are putting themself in danger.

I know with my kids, they copy everything, so if I smacked them, they would then start smacking each other. A receipe for disaster.

I don't think a lack of smacking will create a tearaway. If they see respect in the home they will benefit.

Oh don't worry. MIL gives crap advice. DS (2.4) bites, and she says that I should bite him back .

I tend to make light of the advice and say something like, 'ah, well, they didn't have social services when DP and BIL were young, but smacking and biting your kids kind of doesn't go down well anymore...'

Repeat like a mantra: This is a phase. This is a phase.

Just in response to your mum saying they are not allowed to challenge behaviour in schools properly these days - I'm assuming that "properly" means we don't hit them in school either! Because teachers (like parents) have learned more civilised, effective ways to manage children's behaviour (thank god).

ilove am that you get such constructive unbelievable advice. I couldn't imagine inflicting such pain on DS. Good on you for dealing with it so well.

Btw, I've often thought Id love to copy that advert where the mother throws a tantrum in the supermarket just to see if it actually works

You don't smack your children, but your parents do?

And they want you to smack an 18 month old?

They sound nuts (and horrible). YANBU

YANBU.

And you know it, but today you're tired and ground down and it's getting to you. Poor you. You have normal children doing normal stuff.

DD2 has started to hit out a bit. I either hold her so she can't, or put her down and wander off [if we are home] It annoys her sooooo much. She generally potters back to me when she is feeling in need of a dummy cuddle.

The idea of a toddlers tantrums being linked to tearaways is hysterical. Gawd bless 'em. I guess some people do hit/smack/beat/tap their kids. You don't, and that's your style, and that's the law. Simples

I find that you must never put yourself on the back foot in these situations. SO in response to your dad's attempt to gain ground and assign blame and make you submissive, you sidestep it and put yourself 'above' him

Dad: 'if you don't start laying down the law he'll turn into a wrong 'un'
You: Oh dad, does the noise get to you? you never had any patience did you? I have lots, I never get worked up by this toddler stuff. Arent the kids lucky?

I love devious psychology Ideally you'd have your head tilted to one side and a sympathetic smile...

My MIL says things to her dh like 'if you do I'll clatter you' in jest. Makes me shudder as I see the dd listening. I wonder how long before I hear she has said that to some child at school and I get the dreaded 'Can I have a word...' from the teacher?

Thanks Tree

Bit about your MIL saying that in DD's earshot. Gawd bless these PIL/ parents at times

teaandcake, just wanted to add, My parents had girls, so did I, then I had a little boy, oh my goodness, he really is different! Where the girls would go on the naughty step and contemplate their transgressions my DS would back arch, tantrum scream, drool, roll his eyes, sometimes he would outward breath-hold, to the point of me needing to ressusitate him

Its taken me a while to work out the best way to deal with him, I've had lots of very conflicting advice, but I have found a way of dealing with the problem of his tantrums to the extent that I can still go out ( i'm not frightened to take him out anymore IYSWIM?)I know exactly how I'm going to deal with him if he kicks off becase I've decided well in advance exactly what I'm going to do.

My method is to be sad at his behaviour, no shouting, dissapointment only, normally at that point he will say sorry and have a big cuddle.

If me being upset isn't enough to calm him down and he escalates then I sit him on my lap in a cradle hold and ignore him until he calms down ( if i'm not holding him he will bang his head etc) then I tell him how sad I am at what he did and he will say sorry, sometimes it can take 20 mins of him sitting on my lap, but if I let him go he will back arch and bang his head.

DS is 2.5 and in the last 2 months things have improved loads by using this method. If I was to shout, or be agressive in any way he would escalate beyond belief. Smacking him would not work at all.

I do know his behaviour has really frightened my parents in the past, its out of their spectrum if understanding and they have made all sorts of suggestions. I have now told them exactly how he is to be managed, and things are really going well now.

Now that they can see its working I don't get unhelpful suggestions.

I don't know if any of that helps you, it was longer than I intended! sorry!

YANBU

You are doing a great job. I can't believe it's been 9 months already - does it seem to have gone quickly for you or does it seem like a long time? I guess it's like most things, a bit of both

I can understand why your parents want to step in to help you out now that you are on your own, it's only natural. However, you need to explain to them that it's only helpful if they work within your boundaries - if they are working outside them (ie smacking) they are hindering not helping and it's upsetting and stressful. Acknowledge they did it differently and you turned out just fine, but explain that it's now your choice how yours are brought up and that they will not be smacked - by anyone.
Tell them that you understand they think you aren't doing it 'the right way', but it's yr choice and that's that.

FWIW though - I was smacked occasionally as a child and it didn't do me any harm either. I don't think that the occasional smack is a terrible thing. It does not teach kids that violence and hitting are the answer - it teaches them that you will do what you have said you will do, that behaviour has a consequence - just like any other discipline/punishment. I think it has it's place alongside other methods. However, 18 months is tooooo young for smacking.

Thanks KickArseQueen that's interesting.

ChippingIn - I didn't start my thread in relationships until February, which is probably why it doesn't feel like long ago (as it isn't ). H left me in Oct but I didn't realise I needed to move on until Feb/ March time, with you lovely ladies encouraging me.

Yeah I've already had one chat with my parents but I'll have another I think.

It's a generation thing. Your parents are simply telling you what they were told. But they're still wrong. Your DS is 18 months old. He's just frustrated and tired and lashes out. I have a 2 year old who does the same.

I've become adept at catching his little hand as it swings towards me and turning it away. He's learnt that it just doesn't work so he's gradually giving up.

You're right and doing brilliantly. Stick to your guns and ignore your mother. She probably has no experience of single parenting and has been reading too many tabloid horror stories about homes without a male role model.

I also think that the occasional smack can be OK.

But 18 months?
No way!

As long as they aren´t getting their own way as a result of the tantrum.

And I do think that smacking one so young because they have lashed out at you would be confusing for them.

He's just a baby.
I've smacked in the past and wish i hadn't but equally my child isn't very aggressive and she doesn't hit out, so i conclude that whatever you do smacking or not doesn't really have any long term effect at all so it's nicer not to hit them for your own benefit (guilt trips) as much as anything.

hi tea

u r doing a great job i disagree with smacking too!!

it must be hard on your own

For what its worth (I only have one baby!) I think you sound fantastic in the way you deal with tantrums. I hope I manage the same sort of calm control when I get to that stage!

My 2YO is a biter and hitter, if I smack I'm going down to his level. Although when he pulls my hair I have to swallow my .

YANBU

No point smacking for a tantrum, will just wind him and you up more.

I think the main thing with tantrums is that they never ever work, not once, not even half.

DS gave up on them pretty quick when he realised that chucking a wobbly would just piss me off and most importantly wouldn't get him what he wanted.

YADNBU tea , you are a great mum . Ds is just doing what all toddlers his age do - completely normal . The next time one of your parents advise you to smack just gently explain & maybe teach them by showing them that there are other ways to deal with the children, if they see you in action they might change their opinion on smacking .

Toddlers have tantrums because they suddenly have all these emotions to deal with and to understand.
Smacking a child when they are in such an emotional turmoil will result in a child that is emotionally stilted and as an adult will be unable to deal with the emotional side of life. When things don't go their way, thay can't reason and act maturely. instead they lash out and use violence on their girlfriends, their wifes, their mothers, their children, that bloke in the pub that looked at him the wrong way.