Continuing support group for those affected by someone else's drinking

[pointythings]

Our current thread is nearly full, and it's too valuable to lose in the mists of time, so this is thread 2. Come here if you are struggling with a loved one's drinking - partner, parent, child, friend, there's support for you here no matter which person in your life is struggling with the drink and having an adverse impact on you. The women on here have all been there or are still going through it. We support and advise each other, we don't judge, we listen.

Original thread here to refer back to: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/4581221-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking

Thank you @ Userccjlnhibibljn8 and @pointythings. I know realise its all about my self worth. I just feel like I was duped as he ticked all the boxes when I met him (had zero idea about issues with alcohol) as he would have one or two glasses of wine when we were out and didn't 'seem' drunk.

I came out of a messy break up 4 years prior and I was reluctant to get into a new relationship but he convinced me he was perfect for me and we got on so well etc.etc.

He told me there were 'issues' with drinking 5 months in but really minimised it.

I'm such an idiot.

@Morry15 I'm sorry, but consider this a very gentle, kindly delivered slap round the chops.

You are not an idiot.

You are a women with a big heart, a caring disposition and much love to give. This man sold himself to you as something he was not - he has been lying to you from day one, he knew he was an alcoholic and yet he entered into a relationship with you. That is 100% on him.

I hope you find your anger.

@pointythings thank you for the virtual slap. It's what I need.

That's the thing, I can't find my anger. I actually feel sorry for him and am trying to empathise with the demons he must have in his head to get to this point.

I am also upset as one of his family members said to him I must be a trigger as his drinking got worse since he met me (I drink one glass of wine maybe per month and since I found out about his issues, I haven't touched a drop).

He really has this tendency to always want to please his family so he kind of agreed with their trigger comment.

I'm no expert but I actually think they enable him.

On a bender, let's cook him a nice meal.
Not cleaning up his apartment, let's go in and clean it up for him.
Sent home from work due to drinking, let's call his boss to see if we can explain.
Went to in-house rehab, family paid for all of it.
Doesn't want to be home alone, his mother said he can move in until he gets his act together.
Needs a lift somewhere, they drive him. I suspect this is more to monitor him

They put a tracker on his phone (he is unaware)

They call all his friends to keep an eye on him (he is unaware).

He pulls out the 'I'm worthless, nobody will love me, please don't hate me, I'll do better, maybe the world will be a better place without me in it' speech and they all swoop in to save him.

They keep saying they'll cut contact disown him but then say they'd feel alot of guilt if anything happened to him

I know I not that invested but I really thought this relationship could go distance.

Thanks for reading.

You are quite correct to say his family are enabling him. The thing to do now is not fall into the trap of joining them there. You can't save him - nobody can, he is the only one who can. If you stay in his life, you are letting yourself in for years of misery, stress and fear. I know, because I made that mistake.

Guilt tripping and emotional blackmail are part of the addict's arsenal of manipulation and are part of his disease. A lot of the time, they are tactics that work. It takes real strength to step away and not allow them to work on you.

I think you know what you need to do. However, nobody on here is going to push you one way or another. You have to make your decision in your own time, using what you know and not until you are ready. Meanwhile stay on here and keep thinking.

Thank you for replying @pointythings. I don't mean to pry or upset you by bringing up the past but what was your breaking point to leave? Was there one moment.

I don't mind at all. You mentioned the lying in your first post on this thread - it won't surprise you to learn that it was the lying that made me decide to act.

We had a long history of talking about his drinking, and with hindsight I should have acted when he told me straight out that he was comfortable with being dependent on alcohol. I didn't because I (wrongly) felt that divorce would damage our two DC more than staying would. He made me a promise that he would no longer drink secretly and that what I saw him drink would be it. When I found an empty spirits bottle in our bedroom, I knew he had been lying about that, probably from day 1. So I told him he had a choice: rehab or divorce. I gave him the summer to think about it and on day 2 of our family holiday in Devon, he expressed the desire to leave because I wouldn't drive to the nearest shop to get him more booze (he had downed the best part of two full bottles of whisky since arrival). Instead of caving in, I bought him a train ticket, and the DC and I did the rest of the holiday together. It was a revelation - we had peace, we had fun, were were calm and happy.

In the end he chose rehab, he did it and for a while it felt like I was getting him back. But 2 weeks after coming out of rehab, the DC and I had a night away in London and when we came back, he had been drinking, with a bottle stashed in his backpack. It was so obvious he was drunk, but again he lied about it. And that was my breaking point. I started divorce proceedings that week.

If you want to read the whole saga, pm me and I'll pop the links to my threads in for you. I still read them back every so often when I get a sense of doubting my past decisions.

@Morry15 Whatever you decide, don't feel a moment's guilt. His family will all rally round, making excuses for him, blaming you and ensuring he never has to face the consequences of his drinking. Do consider that if you stay, you'll have his family in your life too and it won't be long before you'll be doubting your sanity. Of course you're not the trigger for his drinking. He had an alcohol problem when you met and will continue to have one if and when you leave.

Good morning to everyone, but especially to my fellow daughters of alcoholics. (Oh, and pointythings, for just being a star.)

I've been reading Claudia Black's It Will Never Happen to Me. It's a bit dated (ok very dated in places) but god, I wish I had this book as a child. Or, even better, that an adult in my life had it. More of the confusion is lifting.

I read a lot, lots of non-fiction. Yet I had never thought or wanted to seek out anything about alcoholism until she died. I find that weird, and maybe part of the denial? I just kept my head down and trudged through life.

My update: carrying on, feeling mostly peaceful. Still a bit numb after her death. Three and a half months later, it's not on my mind all the time. Still waiting on most of the death admin/inquest stuff. I am still really keen(?) to read the full post mortem report and the mental health service submission, and I will hopefully be able to get a full history of her mental health and addiction treatment going back decades. I don't remember much of my childhood and hope to be able to get a clearer picture of what and when.

Hope you're all doing ok.

@amlie8 you are a star. I have so much admiration for the way you have responded to the death of your mother. You are so clear sighted, seems like it’s an opportunity for you to learn what was really going on, incorporate that, and move forwards. I get a bit pissed off when people attribute my resilience to past difficulties, like it’s just luck and not a choice, to keep going, so I hope you dont think I’m making light of the work you’ve done to get to this point. I know!

@amlie8 why would you want to read about something you were living at the time? The mind has its ways of protecting itself - my choice of shield was trashy romance novels, I didn't go back to reading anything more substantial until I was well into my freedom years. These days I do read up because I have to be my most knowledgeable self in order to support others.

I second @Zebracat - the clarity with which you have approached the end of your mother's life and the aftermath, and the clarity with which you write about it, are both incredibly empowering to the people on these threads. With hindsight, everything I learned from losing my husband helped me when I then went through it all again with my mum.

The wisdom of mumsnet has kept me strong and helped put perspective in place for me over the hardest time in my life. I know when I post I am so grateful that people like @pointythings @CharlotteByrde and others I am sorry not to be able to name, are there almost instantly to give answers/wisdom and at times a stern talking to….xxx

@pointythings @Zebracat I was very touched by what you said. I'd love to take all the credit and say well, yes I am just fantastic, haha. Honestly, I think it's a mix of being used to crises, an inherited sense of calm practicality from my dad's side and the fact I have a relatively peaceful everyday life, with time to think.

I've been thinking a lot about my grandpa's alcoholism. I had never really considered the effect it had on the family, on each individual. I just didn't have the headspace or the empathy for it, before. (I know you'll all understand that.) I think they were, and are, still deep in denial. They look for other reasons – oh, well he was clearly autistic, she was obviously a narcissist, or well, she was bipolar. I'm no psychiatrist, but there is/was a clear unwillingness to connect any of it to alcoholism. It goes on. I can see that the alcoholism continues, in others who are still here. It feels good to be free of denial. I can't expect to understand everything but I reckon I'm seeing things pretty clearly now.

And of course thinking about my mum a lot. Her priority (obviously!) was to continue drinking in peace. But she also wanted love and understanding. And she finally has that. Maybe not quite as she would have wanted, but it's still there. I'm sad that I couldn't give her that in life, but again, you all understand why.

@pointythings I like your phrase 'freedom years'. I get that! I'm quietly excited for the future.

@amlie8 I think relatives as well as the alcoholic get lost in the stigma that still surrounds addiction and alcohol addiction in particular. In a world where drinking is considered normal, where you're thought of as weird if you do not drink, where not drinking is associated with not being a fun person, it's actually very hard to admit that you cannot drink because you cannot control it. Far easier to blame other things.

And please don't minimise the calm wisdom that you bring to this thread, you're a powerful voice!

I hope it is Ok for me to join you. I'm worried about my husband's drinking. Mainly wine. I will have a read. Kind thoughts to all.

Welcome, @Orangesandlemons77 . By all means have a read of this thread and its predecessor (linked in the OP) - a lot of people have shared a lot of wisdom and support on here.

And when you're done reading, ask any question you need to ask. We're here for you.

Hello @Orangesandlemons77 , this is a wonderfully helpful and supportive thread, and a safe place to rant and wonder. X

Hi @Orangesandlemons77 glad you have found us.

I'm worried about Christmas as it can get worse then. Have some relatives who sometimes send e.g. a box of wine as well.

I have stopped drinking myself, maybe about 6 months ago? I don't think I really had a problem though, more in the hope he might stop as well, that has not happened though.

Is it common for them to blame you for it? he will get drunk them go on and on about how I am the problem, it is due to e.g. me getting ill a few years ago, for example or that I am ignoring him and e.g. reading on the internet instead. It is all about everybody else.

Is it common for them to blame you for it? he will get drunk them go on and on about how I am the problem

Yes, this is the alcoholic's playbook. It has to be your fault. If it isn't, then they would have to admit that they have a problem, and their addiction will not let them do that.

It sounds as if you are in quite a serious situation. I would advise you to seek out some real life support - SMART Family&Friends will help you find coping strategies and work out what your boundaries are. There's also Al-Anon, but they are very focused on not breaking up relationships, even in situations when that is arguably the best thing.

Do you have children? If you do, they should figure heavily in your decision making because living with an alcoholic parent puts them at risk of addiction themselves.

I have two teens 19 and 16, neither drink, another thing I am dealing with is wider family, shutting me down, for example his sister usually sends a box of wine for e.g. Christmas and birthdays, I mentioned to his mum maybe this is not the best idea and maybe we should say to the sister not to do this.

I got told not to worry her, what would Dh think, it would be betraying him etc. made me feel worse. It is not what is needed boxes of wine right now. Feel like I said the wrong thing. His mum said I would talk to DH about it, but I told her he just gets cross if I say anything about it. So, family is not helping either

Why is it such a bad thing for the sister to be worried? I am worried. There does seem to be form for minimising / not talking about issues in this family.

Minimising and denial is common sadly and it sounds as if his mum isn't going to be much of a support to you. You could contact his sister directly but to be honest it won't solve the problem or make any difference whatsoever long term. He will buy the drink if he doesn't receive it as a gift and nothing you say or do will stop that happening. As you've already discovered, he will deflect and blame and carry on drinking regardless.

Yes, I think I am focusing on doing what I can to stop enabling it, but there are limits he needs to help himself. I think he does know as he was also saying about his drinking and he 'might as well drink himself to death' so I guess there is an awareness there.

You can't control his drinking -not by tipping bottles down the sink, hiding his bank cards or car keys, asking local shopkeepers not to sell it to him -believe me I've been there! He is the only person who can change this - I can't stress that enough as you will drive yourself crazy trying to out-sneak an alcoholic.

The self-pitying 'might as well drink myself to death' comment isn't so much awareness as just another way of allowing himself to keep drinking. Alcoholics lurch between blaming others and trying to emotionally blackmail them.