School asking for flight details after unauthorised term-time absence abroad

[PersonalData]

We went abroad mon-thu last week, ds (10) was in school the week before and went back on Friday. We let them know and obviously knew it would be unauthorised. As it was 8 sessions we don’t qualify for a fine. His attendance is usually 100%.

They asked on friday before and after for us to provide proof of the flights and other details for ‘safeguarding’ but he was back in school and clearly fine ?? We declined as this is private personal data. They replied back that we must submit the evidence by the end of tomorrow?

Is this usual ?

Also, safeguarding and child protection/social work involvement are often conflated but not the same thing. If something is described as a safeguarding risk it doesn’t mean an instant referral or that social services will pick it up. This causes no end of stress and tension between schools and social work teams.

Yeah, i do agree with you in principle.

(I suppose im thinking about when my ex had contact and announced he was taking kids away, everyman and their dog would want to see all the paperwork [and it would never have been allowed by court] so i had a scenario akin to that in my mind - perhaps school taking firm line due to similar circs in the school)

You are expected to get the parents consent for a referral and you'll get short shrift from my staff if you havent done that for CHIN and Early Help referrals. We would go back to you and expect you get the consent prior to accepting it, its not our job to chase parents for consent for a referral from another agency.

CP referrals are different.

This is true.

Schools are sadly all too used to social workers ignoring our statutory responsibilities for safeguarding. Even trying to get a social worker on the phone on a Friday afternoon is a fool’s errand, we end up calling the police more often than not.

Fuckkk
No they don't.
If he had been in hospital, the hospital would have referred to social services if there was a need to. School don't need to investigate where the child really was during his unauthorised holiday time. And if the child had been kept off school to hide bruises, they will have gone by now. What difference does it make asking for flight information now? And what if OP can't provide them - does that make her guilty of child abuse in the eyes of the law or social services? (Clue - obviously not!) So what would the school or anyone else actually DO if she doesn't 'prove' she was on holiday? Follow the logical trail...

Ain’t that the truth!

Well thats a technicality because we would expect the other agency to seek consent and provide evidence of it, because there is no point taking a referral to find no consent is in place, there wont be any assessment taking place.

Faaackin ell
It gets madder.

No, they wouldn’t ask during a holiday because they are not responsible for children during a holiday - but during term time, they have a duty to monitor attendance and therefore they need to know where the children are if they are not in school. Most of the time it’s box-ticking because most people are responsible and not abusing their children, so it seems silly. But it’s there for the times when the children might be unsafe.

Social workers are all too used to schools not really understanding what a safeguarding matter is vs CP vs CHIN and not seeking consent from parents.

If any child is missing from education for a prolonged period of time the school can ask for proof/evidence of where they have been. They have a duty of care to apply this to all children. You never know when something might be needed in the future to piece together a safeguarding concern or disprove it.

Just send the flight details, it really isn’t that deep.

Don't be silly. The medical staff would report this.

Are you or your husband African muslims OP? Does your school have a large community of African muslims and there are concerns around FGM?

They wanted proof of the wedding so they could authorise it for you! Not so you could prove you weren't actually selling her to Isis or taking her away for a week of beatings 🙄

Maybe it’s regional but surely it’s not consent to make a referral being sought from parents/carers because it’s not down to the referrer to decide what the level of intervention is likely to be. That’s decided from the CAFA/section 47? It’s best practice to let someone know you’re making a referral but that doesn’t equal consent.

If it's an emergency such that police are the appropriate service to notify you should have been doing that from the start. Social work is not an emergency response service.

You are missing the point. The school can and in this case is asking for proof of travel etc after the fact. They can absolutely do that.

Eh no
You aren't making a 'cin referral' or a 'CP referral' - that's not your decision to make as the referring agency. You make the referral (after notifying the parents and ideally discussing the referral with them, not asking their consent) and social work services decide which level it sits at.

They can still submit the fine, and then it’s up to you to prove to the council (who actually enforce the fine)

More accurate to say the police are not on call social workers, but when it’s 7pm on a Friday evening and you’ve been failing to get through to social workers for five hours and need someone “above” to say yes, it’s fine to send the child home to the dad they say had been hitting them, it’s police or bust.

A CP referral is a referral of CP. A CHIN referral is not, we do expect consent to be given otherwise there is nothing to proceed with. Its not for us to chase that. Otherwise it leads to a lot of opening of a case, liaison and dialogue to close back down as NFA because parent doesnt give consent. We find schools are loathe to actually have the discussion with the parent about what needs they might need support with or whether they want this and just dump it on social services without having had the conversation.

Its good practice to inform a parent of a CP referral (unless it would put the child at risk), but it doesnt need consent in that way.

Yes it's normal these days and it's not actually intruding on your personal data. You might have kept him off school after a good beating or left him home alone unattended. Schools can't make assumptions regardless of what they know about their families. Everyone involved
In education and services for children has to be vigilant about safeguarding. Don't take it personally.

Well no, on our portal its either a referral for support, or a Child Protection Safeguarding referral. They're different and professionals need to refer through the correct portal. If they're unsure they're to have a consultation with front door.

Did you go away for longer than 4 days, like pretended he had a doc appt or something on the Friday and they suspect this hence asking for evidence?

I can’t imagine any reason why you wouldn’t provide the flight deets other than that you lied to them about it.

I wouldn’t give them anything until they clarified in detail what they mean by safeguarding and why having this particular information would make any difference as to whether the child in question is safe or not. And from what. I’m intrigued what will happen tomorrow if they don’t get this information from you. Will the sky fall in?