Help me not to tell DP it's his own stupid fault

[Kingfisherfly]

And offer words of encouragement.

First I'll say I don't have a perfect driving record and have points on my licemce, from doing 27 in a 20 limit without realising it wasn't 30.

DP has done similar, although this time it was 72 in a 50 (not 70) limit. He was pulled over by a police officer on a motorbike, who he felt enjoyed his job a little too much, and is incensed that he was only going at the speed of the traffic, why him etc (yes, I know I'm taking that with a pinch of salt).

Beyond that he's worried about what it will mean re points and/or a ban, mainly because of how it will affect work.

He wasn't given any paperwork at the time, and hasn't received any yet. At what point does he tell his insurance company?

And what will likely happen next?

Yes third off for guilty plea. Income can be determined on weekly, monthly or yearly income. We pop the numbers into a fine calculator and it works it all out for us.

Sorry, I should've proofread my post. Include your licence DETAILS. You'd be surprised how many people don't fill that bit in properly.

Very occasionally the prosecuting force may ask for the physical licence to be returned with the form so it's always worth checking.

Those guidelines are a “starting point” and are irrespective of any love past convictions

Accepting guilt if you’re guilty and expressing contrition should be sufficient and I would hope our legal system reflects that fact.

The guidelines give a range but you can't go outside the range.

Previous driving convictions are relevant and can aggravate the seriousness of the offence meaning the sentence would be towards the upper limit of the range.

Why say staring point if you can’t exceed

more to the point… doesn’t consider past live convictions

Out of interest. My employment is only 7 hours per week and I live off investment income and savings. Would they use my salary or my combined income figure?

Either way, if it were me, I'd get a relatively low fine...which doesn't seem very fair as I'm certainly not hard up.

You've got this bit between your teeth, but everything I've read (quite a lot over the last couple of days) says previous convictions have no effect unless via totting up.

Fab. So you seem to have calmed down and no longer tempted to call out for DP for being stupid

so…. Enjoy the sun! That’s where I’m heading now (after unfortunately having to get in car to pick up teen 2)

I'm sorry, I don't understand your point about 'doesn't consider past live convictions'. Happy to address it if you want to reword the question.

The starting point is if there are no other aggravating factors. So if it's just a standalone speeding offence and it's the first offence, you use the starting point of the guidelines.

If there are aggravating factors to the offence that increase the seriousness, you move from the starting point and go up the range to the higher sentencing.

Aggravating factors are things like being under the influence of drugs or alcohol, speeding at a time of day where there are likely to be more pedestrians around, speeding near a school, previous driving convictions for similar offences, speeding with passengers in the car, for example.

You can't go beyond the top end of the guideline range.

More simply, the bottom end of the range for the OP's DP's offence is:
Fine = to 100% of monthly income (minus a third for guilty plea).
4 points on licence.

The most severe penalty available at the top end would be:
Fine = to 150% of monthly income (minus a third for guilty plea)
28 days disqualification from date of conviction.

In between those two options would be a various combination of fine amounts, points amounts and number of days of disqualification.

Yes, it's really weird how the fines work like that.

That's why you occasionally hear in the news that some famous footballer was given a £20,000 fine for speeding. Which makes it seem really serious, but in fact was probably a percentage based on his weekly income!

Best not to lie about your income though, because if you get found out you could get into a different load of bother with the courts.

What did the police officer say to him, as in what was going to happen next? I got caught on camera doing just over 40 on a 40mph road. I was offered an online Driver Awareness course as it was my first time being stopped. If he's got previous that will probably be points and a fine. But with no paperwork or communication I guess he just sits and waits.

Previous convictions are relevant but it depends whether they paint a picture of a pattern of offending or are coincidental, and also on the length of time between previous offence and current offence.

In your DP's case I doubt having 3 points already would bear any weight.

If the speed over the speed limit exceeds 10% + 9mph, then the offence is considered so severe it can't be dealt with by a fixed penalty and can only be dealt with via SJP.

10% + 9mph is usually where fixed penalties START. Below that is speed awareness course territory.

Speed awareness is offered as part of a fixed penalty. 10% + 9mph is where SJP starts.

Nope. Fixed penalties start 10% + 9mph (obv lower if SAC not appropriate or Scotland). As per NPCC guidance which most forces follow.

I don-t think so. Usually if you're offered speed awareness it's that or take 3 points, so must be part of the fixed penalty process?

When did he commit the offence?
The police have 14 days to issue a notice of prosecution. It doesn’t have to arrive within 14 days but must be posted by police in a time frame that it would be expected to arrive at the address of the registered owner within 14 days

Where are you getting that from?

Fixed penalties start at 10% + 2mph.

SJP start at 10% + 9mph.

10% + 9mph of 20 is 31. At 31mph in a 20, you're into Band B territory which will trigger an SJP.

It can vary a little between forces but I'm basing that on what I know from the way the Met does it.

From the NPCC guidelines which is what the majority of forces follow. The Met actively state that they follow the NPCC guidelines. Obviously officers have some discretion, but assuming no aggravating circumstances that’s what they should be doing.

Not true if he was stopped and spoken to at the time of the offence.

What? I'm not understanding what you're saying at all. The NPCC thresholds say that FPN starts at 10% + 2 where SAC is inappropriate. SJP is generally 10% + 9 give or take, depending on force. The NPCC matrix puts the SJP trigger at 35 in a 20, but the Met tend to trigger it at 31/2 in my experience.

According to the guidelines FPN start at 10% + 2mph where SAC not appropriate. Where SACs are appropriate they can be given up to and including 10% + 9mph. SJP boundaries vary from 10% + 13mph in a 20mph limit to 10% + 19mph in a 70 mph limit.

As I said, officers have discretion but for an uncomplicated speeding offence in a force which subscribes to the guidelines then I’d expect the situation in the OP to result in a FPN as SJP should commence at 76mph in a 50mph limit.

I would be really surprised if they dealt with a 72 in a 50 by way of a FPN. I've seen people summonsed for less.

Maybe he'll get lucky.

At 72 mph in a 50 mph zone it’s unlikely he’ll qualify for a speed awareness course. In the UK it falls under Band B sentencing. He can expect 4 to 6 penalty points or a 7 to 28-day driving ban, plus a fine of roughly 75% to 125% of his weekly income
I can’t advise on notifying the insurance company , I think he needs to check his policy wording , not all require it .

Wow you’ve done a 180 since starting the thread!

Anyway seems like you’re almost certain what the outcome will be - so you can reassure him that all will be just fine.

Not sure I could be with someone who thinks police doing their job is power hungry