WHY WON'T MY CHILDREN GO TO SLEEP

[floofydoofy]

Mostly a vent post but jfc, I am so over this.

My children (4yo and 6yo) are still awake at 9pm despite being absolutely exhausted beyond words. They were so tired at 4pm my 4yo literally lay with his head on the dining table and waited there for 35 minutes for his dinner. At 7pm they were almost falling asleep on the sofa. As soon as they enter their bedroom, they go mental. Silliness, stropping, crying, shouting (waking baby sibling), being dangerous hanging over the side of the bunk bed, leaping around, etc. This has been going on for a couple of weeks and I've kept calm and consistent with them... until tonight when I absolutely lost my shit. I rarely shout at all so it was quite shocking for them, but even that hasn't deterred them (I have since been in to apologise for shouting, but re-iterated that their behaviour was not acceptable). We tried bringing their bedtimes much much earlier which made everything worse. We tried moving their bedtime later (to 9.30/10pm), which "worked" in that they fell asleep quickly, but they were like zombies during the day and were even more of a nightmare than usual to wake up at 7am for school. We've made a really effort to connect with them in the evening 1-1 once the baby is in bed to make sure they feel heard and loved. They do not watch screens during the week. They get ample time outdoors and in active free play each day. They eat a well-balanced, predominantly healthy UPF free homemade diet; they eat sugar but mostly in the form of homemade baked goods like flapjacks and muffins, not endless sweets or chocolate. They take a magnesium supplement. My 6yo's iron/ferritin levels are normal (haven't had 4yo checked as he'd lose his shit at a blood test and it didn't feel worth it). Genuinely, if they simply needed a later bedtime I'd be absolutely fine with that, BUT THEY DON'T.... THEY ARE SHATTERED.

I do not know what more I can do.

It's 10 pm and it's still light and I'll be honest I'm pretty off beam wrt my circadian rhythm myself rn.

I don't know that there's any easy answers to this. Humans weren't meant to live so far north with its crazy fluctuations.

My 3 are older now but I used to stagger the bedtimes a bit so everyone got settled.

how many kids and how many bedrooms do you have? Can you rejig at all?

All my 4 have been good sleepers we did staggered bedtimes then it was you need to be quiet because your sister is asleep. No pissing about no in and out its bedtime

We have 4 bedrooms but we have major damp issues with the back 2 so don't currently use them (in theory it should now be fixed, but I'm holding my breath before we put it back together as a bedroom). I am genuinely considering sleeping downstairs with the baby and letting DH deal with the older two upstairs.

Low sleep needs. Both of mine are like that, it’s currently 10:20 and one of mine is driving nuts making guinea pig sounds instead
of sleeping.

My nephews aged 2.5 and 7 were like this. Well the baby was like this anyway but his older brother goes to sleep 9/9.30. The baby has been struggling to go to sleep since the clocks changed, he just stays awake! I babysat him the other night and he was still wide awake at 11pm! They wake up either early or later (their parents struggle to wake them on school and nursery days) and I’m not surprised. Since clocks changed its been worse though.

Have you tried bedtime routines with warm milk/hot chocolate, warm bath, blackout blinds, lavender oil on pillow? Nightlight/Tomy box with stories, bedtime reading? Ensure bedrooms are cool but not too cool (blanket if needed). Quiet if they’re noise sensitive. Cuddly toys with them. No screens/toys/distractions near bedtime. I personally have always needed some sort of routine at bedtime since I was a young child so I was calm at bedtime. And my younger brother too.

The older boy (my nephew) wasn’t a great sleeper until 1 or 2 though, now he’s great. He used to wait up for his mum to return from work looking out of the window bless him. The baby has never been a brilliant sleeper, no idea why. He’s getting to sleep and sleeping better now recently though. But tries to refuse baths now though (a new thing), so when it’s hot his mum has to wipe him with a cold/warm cloth.

That’s exactly what my younger nephew is like. Where he gets the energy I don’t know but he still naps during the day, even at nursery.

My eldest would respond really well to this. My 4yo just does not seem to understand and then gets hysterical (which in turn wakes the baby, which then makes me lose my mind). I do think I need to figure out some consistent consequences for this though as nicely nicely then yelling is clearly not working for me

I’d get another room sorted and give them each their own room. Of course some DC share and it’s fine, and with some there’s no choice, but I do think that some personalities just don’t do well sharing and if you have the choice then do own rooms. Mine can’t share either.

Solidarity. Mine don’t sleep either.. they’ve only just gone down and my eldest 8 will be up anytime between 3-5

I hope you get the damp sorted soon - that sounds a nightmare, but in the meantime I’d definately be staggering bedtimes and looking to separate them perhaps.

solidarity tho - sleep deprivation is horrendous as it quite literally drains you and it’s so hard to function.

Solidarity here.
I had to wake DD from a nap at 5.30pm, for some reason she was so tired! And only just gone down to sleep now 😫

No tv at all in the week? What do they do to wind down before bed?

So sorry - this really made me laugh. Little kids are absolutely bonkers aren’t they?! Bless them all.

My SIL and DB currently co sleep with the youngest with SIL and eldest with DB. The boys’ bedroom is currently being decorated so they can share (both want to share) and I hope and pray for both their parents sakes that this works. They do have a smaller room for the youngest (facing the street) but the eldest’s room is huge and faces the garden. They still have a gro clock (in the attic) but SIL didn’t think it worked much with the eldest (he can easily sleep to 9/9.30am even 10am, has done since he was young, this is with a bedtime of 8/8.30pm (current) which is great unless they want him to get up!). He also gets tired in the heat though and sometimes falls asleep late afternoons/early evenings recently.

I laughed at this too! How does he know the song Freed from Desire?! 🤣 never thought of it as a kids song.

I’m surprised your 4 year old wouldn’t understand this. Maybe worth a try? If your eldest would like the time to wind down and listen to the Yoto player as an incentive to go
quietly to bed and your 4 year old won’t, I think you need to do what you can to give them separate bedrooms and tackle the 4 year old in a different way. We’ve used the Yoto card incentive since our child was 2.

I’ve been thinking of and singing this song constantly the last few days. Are the aliens beaming it into our brains?

What used to work for me was: feed the baby, put him to bed in another room.
Older 2 were in the same room, and the the younger one would have a story first while the older one was drawing or doing whatever quietly, sometimes listening, but it was clear that it was the younger one's time with parent and their choice of story.
Then say goodnight to the younger one, and move over to the older one's bed, and read them a story/chapter. The younger one has had their time and theoretically dozes off whilst hearing soothing voices. The big one then gets their time with parent, and when you've read enough, put on a story tape/podcast, tell them goodnight and leave the room. You have to do it like you mean business and that your expectation is that they will go to sleep.
Sometimes I had to feed the baby while putting the others to bed, and the baby just had to listen to the story as well, but the child whose immediate bedtime it was, was the one who got the attention.

Play audio books, then hopefully even if they don't fall asleep they stay in bed and leave you alone. Works for my two.

Fuck knows. My 5yo was awake till 11.30pm last night. I thought at least she'd be exhausted and fall asleep early tonight.... Nope. 10 o clock 😭😭😭😭

This was my kids, now teenagers. I can give no advice other than to say I know how maddening it is and I feel your pain! I'd see friends with kids who'd trot up to bed without being told and be asleep by 730. Never ever in their lives were my kids asleep at that time. They're early risers too. Low sleep needs was not a phrase I'd heard until I read this thread but, up until now, this is them!

Same boat. Age 7. Every night is draining.

2 hours sometimes.

I don't know the answer either.

Xx

It is probably my fault but it’s mainly because of the World Cup. They play it in the stadiums when there’s a goal and it’s used in one of the adverts on TV so we’ve been singing it a lot. I’ve also been teaching him Sweet Caroline and Wonderwall. And then I wonder why he doesn’t go to sleep…

I was absolutely shit at sorting this out with my now adult dc. Yes they were exhausted and I tried everything. In the end I just lay on one of their beds until they fell asleep and told them not to talk. The older one read for a bit at the same time, at one stage.