Is this neglect ?

[Rainbowfish1]

I'm really worried about my niece , age. 4, and don't know if I'm overthinking.
My brother got her mum pregnant after a short relationship, they split shortly after niece was born, he pays maintenance regularly via the CMS but apart from that has little day to day involvement, ( yes I know, DB' s a dick). He's 45 and nieces mum is 25.

-My niece is meant to go to nursery 1-6, 2 afternoons a week during term time, ( nursery stretches funding so this includes holidays). My friend works there and says she's always absent , misses at least one session a fortnight, often more, ( obviously nursery can't enforce attendance as nursery is not legally compulsory). When she is in , session starts at 13:00, but frequently not dropped till 13.30/ 13.45 etc.

• When she's not at nursery, ( and she rarely is !) they go nowhere. Literally nowhere. Nursery is Tuesday and Friday, and between they don't go out at all. Absolutely lovely shared garden and play area in their block of flats but don't go there. They don't leave the house for days on end. Sister in law is addicted to gaming etc and basically happy to stay in.
• Sister-in-law doesn't brush her teeth as "niece doesn't like it ", what 4 year old likes having their teeth brushed...
• Niece is only dressed on nursery days, ( where she does seem to dress her appropriately), she stays in her PJs for days on end otherwise. Whenever I visit on a non nursery day , niece is in her pyjamas, even at 2/3pm. Sister-in-law says what's the point in dressing niece if they are not going out.
• Sister in law is very overweight, basically live off take aways each night, ( only healthy meal she gets is the dinner 2 x a week at nursery).
• The flat is filthy. Five cats in a two bed flat , stinks of cat urine whenever I go round, litter trays always overflowing. Extremely cluttered and no space for niece to play.
• Sister-in-law smokes weed daily, ( she says only when niece is in bed ), but the whole flat stinks of it.

I know the simple answer is to report to soical, but I'm worried they won't do anything and it will just end up withe and my parents being cut off
Does this cross the line to reportable neglect?

You have misunderstood my point.

Report. Remain anonymous. Deny it was you until the grave.

@Youlittlenightmare I don't know. Maybe she does need instruction/ pressure re all the cats. It's unrealistic that she can care and clean up after so many. I can only imagine how unsanitary it is.

OP cannot give support, doesn't work when someone is so far gone. Many different issues. Not OPs job to be a social worker even if she wanted to be.

OP needs to report and deny forever any knowledge of it as people who neglect children and animals are already aware they are doing the wrong thing and will lash out at anyone who reports them.

@Youlittlenightmare yes, no sorry I might not have expressed what I meant clearly as I'm a bit tired. Was saying I might actually agree with you as I've been thinking about the little girl and all the cats and feeling bad for her living like that. The cats as well. Also the weed smell and not cleaning her teeth it's quite concerning

Your brother is shameful.

He should take responsibility for his own child.

Yes, it's a lot. The child needs intervention. OP needs to report, I believe that is her duty.

OP. You don’t have to have proof to report your SIL.

We don’t have the qualifications to assess what is and isn’t acceptable as everyone conducts their life to different standards. However, making a report to social services or the NSPCC enables people who are qualified to make an assessment of your SIL’a parenting skills. 100% report your concerns. One of the big things that often comes out when children are neglected, is that many different people had suspicions, both no one joined up the dots.

If your friend at the nursery has suspicions then they should be reporting it to the nurseries safeguarding lead, not gasbagging to you. But equally, if the nursery has noted concerns and you also raise concerns then social services are able to make a better assessment of your nieces situation.

Report. The nursery have probably done it already.

This man needs to step up and try and get custody of this child and use condoms.

He is as bad as the mother.

I was raised just not brushing my teeth at all as a child. It's hard to wrap my head around how I could be so consistently neglected on such a basic level as hygiene.

From late teens/ early adulthood I have done so but a lot of damage was done structurally and to my enamel. I'm just about to get some more really expensive treatment done.

It's really affected my confidence my whole life, and I do think, how could the school, friend's mum's, my childhood dentist just turn a blind eye ? But I suppose it was different in the 90's

Sorry but why don't you and your parents stage an intervention with your brother. And cut him off if he doesn't step up. You are enabling this.

The mum by the sounds of it is struggling. Still doing a million times better than your brother. Shame you can't report him for neglect.

He’s actually worse, as at least she’s there. Ineffectual, but present(ish).

To be fair to the OP, she knows her brother is a dick and a shit dad.

This is so sad for both the child and the cats. Cats are clean creatures so if their litter trays are overflowing and that’s very possible with 5 of them, they are most likely peeing elsewhere out of desperation.

I’d report the situation to the RSPCA as well as local authorities.

My step cousins were raised the same. It shocked me as a child as even though we were not well off and had a far from ideal childhood one thing my mum drilled into us was brushing your teeth before bed. Last time I saw them (2008) the older of my step cousins who would be mid thirties now, had front teeth which were going black in one area. I’m sorry you grew up at such a disadvantage too.

Your niece's mum sounds depressed. Hopefully she can get some help and support. Maybe speaking kindly to her about all this and offering to support her to get support might be the first step.

Burnt out? When she sits at home gaming and smoking weed all day?

If she's got the kid on her own 24-7 she could be, especially if she's not working so never getting a break. Kids that young need constant attention

She's not with the kid 24/7; she's entitled to 20 hours of nursery time a week! For some reason she's only enrolled her for half of this (maybe low availability at the nursery?) but even so, she has 2 full afternoons a week to herself to relax, clean the house, batch cook etc. Which is a lot more than most of the mums I know.
Everyone's assuming that the mum has MH issues, is depressed etc but she may also just be lazy and self-centered, and unwilling to put in the hard work / tolerate the inconvenience that parenting entails.

That poor child, with two useless parents. PP are right though, social services will 100% not remove her for this. The threshold for removal IME (professional, not personal) is basically prolonged, ongoing violent or sexual abuse (and even then... 🙄)

Some of the stuff is unacceptable. Some of the stuff you just sound a nasty and judgmental on eg her weight. It is incredibly hard being a single parent and your brother sounds a disgrace.

Just because you have seen it, it doesn't mean that OP is making this up, exaggerating or that OP has the situation wrong. It us clear she has genuine concerns for her young niece.

Unfortunately there are neglectful parents out there and this case sounds like the child is being neglected, living in poor unhygienic conditions and it should be reported.

OP should be encouraged to report not told she is judgemental or "poor mum" it's definitely poor, vulnerable 4 year old girl!!

It is a problem, however, I would not want DN removed from her mother.
I would also never want to lose the contact.

Seek assistance for her mother. Pay for a house cleaner once a month. Offer to come over and wash windows,
Are the cats desexed? That is something your parents could offer to pay for.

Offer to have niece over regularly for one night per week.

For that day you can feed her healthy food, play in the park, dress her well, clean her teeth etc.
DN might get used to cleaning teeth and eating fruit and cheese etc.
As she gets older you can teach her some self maintenence and skills - like bike riding, dressing, doing her hair, cooking an egg, making a sandwich.

You helping could be reasoned as because your brother is such a dead beat father and the mother deserves some help.

I would also tell the young mother that her house really does smell very strongly of weed. Warn her that someone might smell it and report her. Tell her that she needs to work out a better way where DN and neighbours can not smell the weed and that it would be terrible if her daughter were removed.

Your opinion is irrelevant a poor child’s basic needs are not being met and you are defending the a mother who
lives in what can only be described as a disgusting home with the smell of cat piss and weed with no social interaction for her daughter on a daily basis and you say leave the poor mother alone shame on you ! As for being a “lawyer” I dispair!

Well of course but he’s clearly not going to is he? I don’t think the OP is under any illusions about her brother!

I too would report OP. It’s so sad for your niece.

Is this your main takeaway from all OP wrote? You have an issue with her mentioning the woman being fat, but no issue with her smoking weed around her child everyday and never taking the kid anywhere?

@Rainbowfish1 report her ass. She might be struggling or she might need educating. It sounds like she’s addicted to gaming too, it’s absolutely not normal to stay inside all those days. Poor child.