Can we give up one of our children?

[pinkstargaze]

I don’t know where else to turn, this is about my 8 year old.
We have 3 Children the eldest and youngest are lovely but the middle child is making life so hard with her violence towards us.

She comes home from school and shouts and screams and hits me and her siblings, she calls me names, swears at me and won’t listen to a word I say just says shut up and covers her ears if I speak to her.
Her siblings are frightened of her, I’m frightened of her I know as soon as I say anything I will be hurt, she hits me in the back and it takes my breath away, she kicks me and tells me to kill myself, slams doors throws things, screams at the top of her voice by which time the other children are crying and I just can’t do this anymore.

I don’t want this for my other children who are so well behaved, we don’t swear or raise voices, we are just a nice family who all get along and respect each other apart from her, she makes everyone miserable, destroys our home and everyone’s belongings.
It is embarrassing, friends won’t have her around their children and even our own family don’t want her near her cousins because it always ends in tears.
I don’t want to live in a home where I’m scared to tell my child off because she’ll hit me, I don’t want to share my home with someone who laughs and points at me with delight when anything goes wrong, or revels in her siblings misfortune and I don’t want to be called names and be sworn at in my own home or have my things ruined by someone who doesn’t care about me or my things.
I don’t want this to be my life and I definitely don’t want it for her siblings.
I feel strongly that for sake of the family’s safety she needs to go into care but I don’t want to lose all my children.
Is it even a thing to put one child into foster care and not the others?

She is waiting to be assessed but the waiting time is long, the school doesn’t see this as she’s masking all day until she gets home but it’s every day.
I have a lovely family, a lovely husband and we have 2 other children who are lovely but she is making our lives hell and our home uncomfortable and I know I just don’t have what it takes to live with her, I am burnt out and feel so guilty to the other children.
Dh does his best when he’s home but we are all so worn down and miserable, we just can’t carry on like this.
It has broken us both and the others are suffering. I genuinely can’t do this but I so love being a mum to the others who I carry on for.

100% recommend Casey / at peace parents - IG that @VoltaireMittyDream mentioned. Has helped me so much

I would be banging on doors, on the phone, absolutely insisting on some help from somewhere. It’s not fair on your other children or yourself and husband. Video your child’s behaviour whenever possible. My heart goes out to you.

I've heard but I have no idea if it's true or not, that often ss will say they'll take the other children as well...maybe as a deterrent to parents doing this.

As I said, I have no idea if it's true.

I don’t agree with the use of cameras to be so obvious I think if you want to document her behaviour it has to be done very quietly

I would at first try therapists, psychiatrist, psychologist. I had an issue with my daughter and took her to a psychiatrist and I made sure that they were proper and on the correct lists and things.

You can go to your GP for support you can go to your health advisor for support. You can go to the social workers for support. Go to the school for support. I will try and exhaust these avenues before you possibly think about giving her up.

Can you reach out to school again? Do they have a pastoral team/or the SENDCo? Is she fine at school really? How is her academic achievement? Is she keeping up with others? Does she have friends? Any possiblity of being bullied? Sorry, many questions, I work in a special school... Does she have a consistent routine once home? Is it demands she is fighting back against? The kids I work with (autism/some audhd) really respond to a quite structured, predictable environment, lots of visual timetables, just visuals everywhere! Sensory supports etc. Has she told you anything which is upsetting her?

Can you start recording her meltdowns and bring it into school ? This may be a starting point especially if she is masking it at school and doesn’t want t them to know about her behaviour?

Potentially neurodivergent

@pinkstargaze no they will not take any of your children. You are doing the best you can in a difficult situation to keep everyone safe.

When your child comes home from school, can you let them have time to decompress, alone with a snack? Do they have any sensory equipment, something they may find calming?

Being a parent to a child with SEN is not easy, and the best support and advise you will find is from other parents who have been through the same. Have a look for local meetings for parents of children with ASD, read up on PDA, and trial different parenting techniques.
It can often go against how you thought you would parent, but I know the standard parenting techniques would not work with my child.

There’s so much focus on the referral - it’s not a magic wand. I would be assuming dd was neurodivergent and be putting my energy in reading books full of evidence-based advice and techniques, trying different styles of parenting to get the best out of my dc. Simple changes can make a massive difference so instead of “we’re going to the shop so please can you put your shoes on” you go for “we’re going to the shop, which shoes do you want to put on?” And the act of giving a choice stupid it feeling such a demand. At 8 you can talk to them (not mid emotional outburst) and talk about what would have helped them - would they like a pillow corner or pop up tent to be able to go to when you need space from others in the family to help you make good choices about not hurting others.

those are just examples I’ve seen work, but you’ll need to read advice then make a judgement what might work for dd.

As pp have said it seems to me that having a child, who is behaving well at school, put into care, seems completely unachievable. But please don’t let any of your children know that you are even considering this.

It sounds heartbreaking for all involved. As much as you want to safeguard them, also consider the long term emotional impact of one of their siblings going into care.

As pp said having children carries this kind of risk and it sounds like a slog, but you need to keep working to give your daughter the support she needs. It won’t always be this hard.

If no one believes you then you then to record enough footage of it happening to convince them.

How do you know it won’t always be this hard? It might get an awful lot harder.

I would look for a therapist that specialises in PDA profiled children.

You have had some good advice on here.

You absolutely can rock up to social services with your child and a black sack of their stuff and dump her on their steps, I don't reccomend it for a long term solution though.

I'm so sorry that it is this hard for you. What a terrible situation. Wishing every possible support is found for you.

I do think some children are born with a nasty streak.

I grew up with a family while living abroad and the daughter was in my year (around 9 years old). A lovely family but her younger brother was what I would class as evil.

He was around 7 at the time and tried to strangle a dog by putting a piece of wood in its collar and setting fire to a treehouse. He ended up doing much worse things. I remember all the kids on the estate were scared of him.

I recently heard he became a pilot so I doubt he was ever diagnosed with autism or adhd (it was a foreign airline which I used to work for where they do not hire anyone with sen).

I would definitely explore if it could be some sort of SEN but sending hugs OP. It sounds utterly horrendous.

What you describe - fine in school, completely different at home - is called Restraint Collapse (sometimes called After School Restraint Collapse). Worth looking this up and reading through suggestions for how to manage it.

Really feel for you OP, that sounds extraordinarily difficult.

Can you set up a nanny cam to capture her behaviour? At least then you can build up some evidence?

do you give her consequences?

Potentially

Sounds a bit like one of my 3 children.
A low demand parenting approach has helped us do you know much about PDA autism?
Also diagnosis, EHCP, DLA have all helped.
It can get better - have you considered private diagnosis?

Set up some 'nanny cams' whilst she's at school.

Show school and anyone else necessary, the evidence that she is not coping well at home, and absolutely does need support, as do you all.

I wish we'd been able to do that when I was little, I think both my sister and I would have got way more help if people could have seen what was happening at home behind closed doors (both in terms of parental abuse and violent behaviour from my sister).

I would never live with myself, I think it in the middle of her meltdown and just in that moment I meant it but then it stops and she’s my little girl again and now she’s gone to bed and I am just sat here crying, I’ve not cried in years, I just think I am breaking.
She wrote me a note to say sorry and came in my bedroom to leave it on my pillow and saw me up here crying, I just needed a moment alone but then she gave me a big hug.
It’s so hard because I do love her but I can’t be the mum I need to be to the others and I know how different life could be for them.

It was SA unfortunately.... Lashing out was the only way I could cope with it. Parents never knew and I was just a 'problem' child
Not saying that OPs child is but maybe bullying at school? She feels invisible and even the bad behaviour means she's getting seen then she will take it. I know a few people I was in care with saying similar

Aside from waiting for an assessment, why arnt you researching ways to support her and teach her how to regulate herself?

So many parents sit around waiting, thinking an assessment is going to change everything. It won't. You'll still have to learn ways to support her and teach her how to regulate herself. Why arnt you starting that now? If you think she's ND, then research and find ways which work for you and her

Putting cameras around your house would be so helpful because not only would you be able to see and show the challenging behaviours but you would be able to watch back the lead up to it and potentially see things you have missed.

I second finding a therapist in the meantime. Unfortunately, good support for DC often only comes when you pay. My AuDHD DD saw an AutPlay Therapist, who was amazing, for nearly a year last year.