Can we give up one of our children?

[pinkstargaze]

I don’t know where else to turn, this is about my 8 year old.
We have 3 Children the eldest and youngest are lovely but the middle child is making life so hard with her violence towards us.

She comes home from school and shouts and screams and hits me and her siblings, she calls me names, swears at me and won’t listen to a word I say just says shut up and covers her ears if I speak to her.
Her siblings are frightened of her, I’m frightened of her I know as soon as I say anything I will be hurt, she hits me in the back and it takes my breath away, she kicks me and tells me to kill myself, slams doors throws things, screams at the top of her voice by which time the other children are crying and I just can’t do this anymore.

I don’t want this for my other children who are so well behaved, we don’t swear or raise voices, we are just a nice family who all get along and respect each other apart from her, she makes everyone miserable, destroys our home and everyone’s belongings.
It is embarrassing, friends won’t have her around their children and even our own family don’t want her near her cousins because it always ends in tears.
I don’t want to live in a home where I’m scared to tell my child off because she’ll hit me, I don’t want to share my home with someone who laughs and points at me with delight when anything goes wrong, or revels in her siblings misfortune and I don’t want to be called names and be sworn at in my own home or have my things ruined by someone who doesn’t care about me or my things.
I don’t want this to be my life and I definitely don’t want it for her siblings.
I feel strongly that for sake of the family’s safety she needs to go into care but I don’t want to lose all my children.
Is it even a thing to put one child into foster care and not the others?

She is waiting to be assessed but the waiting time is long, the school doesn’t see this as she’s masking all day until she gets home but it’s every day.
I have a lovely family, a lovely husband and we have 2 other children who are lovely but she is making our lives hell and our home uncomfortable and I know I just don’t have what it takes to live with her, I am burnt out and feel so guilty to the other children.
Dh does his best when he’s home but we are all so worn down and miserable, we just can’t carry on like this.
It has broken us both and the others are suffering. I genuinely can’t do this but I so love being a mum to the others who I carry on for.

I know two families that have put one child of three into the care system. One sounds just like OP’s child where their behaviour was the issue, the other had severe physical disabilities and their care just became too much to the detriment of the other children. The disabled child died in their early 20’s, I don’t know what happened to the other one.

You sound absolutely at the end of your tether OP, I know I wouldn't be able to cope.

My friend is in a similar situation to you. Her partner has left her and taken the 2 other kids for their own safety. Friend is beaten black and blue by her.own daughter. She locked her in the house the other day and threw my friends phone out the window. No one will help her because her child is so unpredictable I so feel for her but I can't hep as she has broken things in my house and my kids are scared of her, as am I - I hate being scared of a 9 yr old!

Her child has destroyed her family BUT no one will help them they are an affulent family both lawyers so everybody thinks they can cope and social services don't need to be involved. Also her DD was diagnosed ASD/PDA?ADHD a few years ago and is on medication but it doesn't actually do much apart from her sleeping for 5 instead of the normal 2 hours so my friend gets a break between 10pm and 5am. So even if these children get diagnoses it doesn't mean they are cured overnight. The only time her DD is calm is if she is watching what she wants on her ipad and eating what she wants when she wants. Any demand or bedtime makes her violent.

She is at then of the tether and is thinking of dropping her at all school one morning and not collecting her. She wants her family back but to be able to keep her other children safe she cannot let her DD be near them.

Don't give up on her,

Please tell social services how you are feeling and that you are close to giving up custody. I bet you, at breaking point, they will step in, as it will cost them far more to house your daughter than to support you.

Sorry it has to come to this, but in this country, you've got to be on your knees before you get anything.

I have a relative who works in residential care for children just like this, although of course they have ' gone through the system' first with regards to assessments etc. Believe me these children are loved and cared for by staff and have so many privileges you need never worry about her missing out. However, staff are skilled in therapeutic management of these children, including holding them when they become disruptive, and of course they don't work 24/7. Go to your Gp, explain exactly what is happening and tell them you are in crisis, you need urgent help, not being stuck on a waiting list. Good luck, I am so sorry for you all

Most if not all local authorities have very high thresholds for access to children with disabilities social workers. In my local authority a child with no diagnosis would have no chance. Even 'just' diagnosed autism isn't enough.

Jesus it sounds awful but no, you can’t just give her away because she’s too much trouble for you! She’s not a bloody dog.

Do not wait for an NHS assessment. You need to do everything you can to get a private assessment urgently. First a psychologist, who might also recommend a psychiatric assessment, then a behaviour specialist. Whatever the cause, which needs to be determined, the sooner a behavioural programme can be started the better, alongside whatever other interventions may be needed, which will depend on thae cause/s.

No, and you know that. But it's clear you are desperate 💐.

The school don't see anything as they don't care and wouldn't know textbook female autism if it smacked them in the face. Been there and done that. I had years of violence before my teen dropped our of secondary school and hey bloody presto her violence stopped. It's that families and the children themselves have to suffer so much before anyone helps them. Be warned if you get forced to do a stupid parenting course they are also a box ticking exercise, parenting for idiots.

It's true. Removal from the family of origin causes serious harm and is often not better than remaining in the neglectful family home.

I would definitely post this on the SEN board as the parents there will be quite knowledgeable about resources that can help you. I have found a huge amount of help there for my ND children.

I don't know about putting a child in care but I understand from social worker friends that that is the absolute last thing they'll ever do unless the child is in real danger - and even then the news would suggest that they wait too long! So, if I were in your situation I would...

Collect a body of evidence about her behaviour. You mention that she isn't great at behaving around others - friends, cousins etc - so maybe try and collect a few supporting statements. Take it to your GP, to the school SENCo and contact any local autism charities about special programs for ND kids. You have to fight tooth and nail for support.

Also reach out to any local parent groups - get yourself a support group who understands and can offer advice.

Read everything about PDA - my youngest fits the PDA profile and it has made a big different going low demand.

Have a think about anything that calms her. My son has a teepee in his room and a sensory swing. He has access to it whenever he likes, even 1am if that is what it takes. Something like that might be useful, to her support her regulation as she is clearly disregulated.

Some think this is hocum, but take a look at her diet - making dietary changes 100% helped both my ND kids. Is she having too much sugar (maybe from school lunches), for example. I would add that nasty things are hiding in all sorts of food, that you would never realise Food / diet can make a difference to ND behaviour (assuming that she is ND, which it sounds like you think too).

I would consider reducing her time at school if that is at all possible, and getting in some 121 time with her when she is not overwhelmed. School is clearly taking it out of her - maybe a period of less school would help calm her system and give you some time with her that is less stressful?

Can you afford private support? if you can, I think it would be worth contacting local mental health specialists that can support your daughter. And get on the CAHMS wait list (though it is VERY long - we are 3 years in and still waiting for our appt). There are good databases on many ND charity websites where you can start your research.

This all sounds horribly stressful - I wish you and your daughter all the luck in finding a solution and fixing your relationship.

Explain the boundary "You do NOT hit your siblings". Deliver smack.

🤣🤣🤣🤣 telling someone not to hit then hitting them is crazy

Teaching a child not to be violent by being violent to them??!

https://psychopathyis.org/screening/icu-screening/

I have now heard of PDA profile but at the time of referral I mentioned Oppositional defiance disorder known as ODD which I’d read about but now I think PDA is more fitting as there’s definitely anxiety.

It's not true. This is not how social workers operate.

I've DMd you.

Take care.

THIS. She’s not being neurodivergent on purpose. She has needs that aren’t being met. Yes, this experience is awful, and it’s hard, but OP you need to grow some backbone. Stop taking no for an answer and waiting politely. SEND parents have to fight like tigers to get our children’s needs met and that is never going to stop so the sooner you start being proactive the better.

Please do NOT listen to the PP who advised smacking. Punishment is not the answer (and never is). Anyone who advocates punishment as part of a behavioural intervention is dangerously wrong.

While waiting for assessment there is a lot more you can do; get on the internet and forums (post on the sen page on here) and get advice. Your stress is probably causing you to bury your head and fear / freeze on responsibility rather than chase like a terrier but you WILL need to chase this. The more you find out about ND and support the more strength you’ll probably have to fight for help/see her with more compassion. Another tip would be to contact an occupational therapist - they are cheap (sometimes £40) and can come to your home for assessment and can give you really good tips/practical ways to help your (likely) ND child more happily exist. Do some research on restraint collapse. Sounds like definite masking at school so reach out to the sendco from school and do not take no for an answer. Keep trying. You need help!! Sending much love in this; do it for your child, and for them all! I hope things improve and keep us updated Xxx

She said in the post that they are waiting for an assessment. There's a tone that implies you are blaming and shaming the op

It sounds like you’re not a particularly expressive person/ family which may be one of the reasons you are struggling so much with your very expressive middle daughter. Your other children will probably feel safe and comforted from seeing you care for your middle daughter, even if the situation is messy and not the way you imagined motherhood to be.

https://www.autism.org.uk/advice-and-guidance/help-and-support

Urgent Help page linked

She’s lashing out at you because your her safe space . Its not strange to mask all day and when she finally feel safe lets it go. If you imagine a can of coke being shaken all day, then when shes home and its opened it all comes out. This is my middle daughter too - we fought and got her diagnosed with adhd, autism with a pda profile and ocd traits.
I really feel for you I know how exhausting and draining it is for everyone!
i used to make a note every time she lashed out and tried to unpick what was the trigger so we could try and avoid the triggers, which is not easy but slowly we have managed to get some of her behaviour to a minimum.

• ask for the right to choose from your GP this can lower the wait.
• apply for Dla now as this can provide money for extra support such as occupational help, you don’t need a diagnosis.
• Look up PDA and see if phrasing things helps, it may or may not help but worth a try.
• ask for Early help referral from either school or social services they can help and signpost you if you get the right person (some are good, some are useless!)

I’m sorry and how your feeling is normal and understandable.