Gordon Brown and AMW

[Shadeflower]

Presumably the information GB is now presenting on AMW is stuff he had access to while he was in Governement? If so, why is he only speaking out now? Or did he try earlier and the establishment was such that even the PM couldn't be heard?

I like GB, always did, I'm curious about what it was that means he's only speaking out now.

It’s really not uncomfortable. I find your assumptions off generally tbf and in this case. I’m mostly reading thinking wtf no wonder men and male politicians get away with what they do.

If it wasn't uncomfortable, you would provide a direct answer to the question.

Anyway, it's fine. People will draw their own conclusions.

It is a direct answer. Your focus is wrong, look to the men and male politicians.

And yes I have drawn my conclusion on why some are not.

I liked Gordon Brown as well. Thinking back, he's the only one who ever gave anything to youngsters/families (Child Trust Funds, Sure Start) rather than just pensioners.
Meanwhile the Tories wreck services everywhere with unneeded austerity and they're still lauded as the best and never criticisd in the press.
It's much easier to destroy things than build them. Hence Labour tend to inherit a mess and have to spend money fixing things. So they're criticised for spending too much money.
David Cameron - married to a millionaire anyway - used that NHS free nappy service for his disabled son. Once he no longer needed it, he cut the service completely despite many other families needing it.

You did not answer the question.

Telling me that the focus of the question is wrong is not a direct answer.

You can't make this true by simply repeating it again and again.

And your protestations about centering women ring pretty hollow when you haven't even bothered to acknowledge the comments from CSA survivors on the thread.

And yours given you’ve solely attacked Kemi Badenoch who has nothing to do with Epstein or Mandelson.

It’s what I think, reading these posts, wtf are people doing prioritising Starmer, Labour and a system that hides Epstein.

I’ll take women in power any day, as imperfect as some may find them. Who knows your energies may yield results and we get another male PM, I’d prefer we don’t.

Eastern, you need to stop being so insulting to the women on this thread who are challenging you.

We, like Badenoch, have nothing to do with enabling Epstein and his ilk. That doesn't mean we can't criticise what she said yesterday.

I don’t ‘need’ to alter posting my opinion. But yes when I read these posts on PMQs with Kemi as ‘playground bully’ and not Starmer it’s just not it.

He gets that’s PMQs for you. Anyway you may well get your wish and she doesn’t do well. We’ll see who does instead at next GE.

More deflection and whataboutery.

Nobody on this thread is arguing in favour of a system that hides Epstein or others like him. Quite the contrary, many have expressed admiration for the diligence shown by Gordon Brown in investigating these matters precisely because they do need to have a light shone on them and he seems to be working hard to do just that. So please stop trying to misrepresent what others are saying...it doesn't add any weight to your opinions at all.

It is perfectly possible to care deeply about women's rights and want accountability and justice for the survivors while also finding it deeply inappropriate for the leader of the opposition to seek to exploit the situation through her flippant point scoring comments.

You didn't read my other posts, clearly.

I find it is you doing that.

It’s pretty simple I’m answering with how I feel reading the posts. They prioritise Starmer and Labour and focus on a female politician who had nothing to do with any of it. Out of all the male politicians associated with Mandelson’s appointment this is where some go.

Ik mn will be more pro Labour than generally, but the public will rightly focus on Labour, it was their call, twice. And the AMW appointment.

You're still misrepresenting what others are saying. Nobody is letting the men off the hook for what has happened. We all agree that male politicians (and others such as AMW) should be held to account for their actions, their decisions and their omissions.

That doesn't preclude us from having views on the offensive comments made by KB which appeared to trivialise the experience of CSA survivors in order to score cheap political points.

As I said earlier, it is possible for some of us to care about more than one thing at once. It seems that you cannot wrap your head around that idea, so perhaps that isn't how your brain works, but thankfully, it is the norm for most of us.

@EasternStandard
'look to the men & male policians'.
It is certainly true that the majority of CSA is committed by men (although my Mother was also directly involved, in my case, & many women enable it by looking away). It is certainly true that men are still largely the ones with power (thus the most motivation not to 'rock the boat' but also chance to change things). Neither of these things change the fact that I personally, as a CSA survivor, found Kemi Badenoch's smirking, sneering bandying of: 'Peado' at PMQ's was inappropriate to the seriousness of the crimes being discussed.

It is not a point scoring exercise. It is much more important than that.

I'm so sorry you went through all of that, I hope you’ve had good support irl. I found therapy really helpful and it's helped me build a life for myself. And the support of my DSis, who went through the same things I did.

I agree absolutely. Please remember that there are always going to be CSA survivors following threads about Epstein, and it will arouse difficult emotions.

It must be incredibly difficult for survivors with everything that is being discussed in the media and online right now.

We should all try to remember that these discussions might be incredibly triggering for those who are reading our words, and I will definitely try to keep this at the top of my mind when posting on these threads going forwards.

@LizzieW1969 Thank you x. I'm glad you've had some helpful therapy. I did too (some years ago now) but of course it's quite prominant right now watching how Society is(n't !) dealing with both the whole concept & some perpetrators.
I agree that there's likely to be survivors reading this kind of thread but I also think that politicians should be aware of discussing this in an appropriate way for everyone in society. It is so much more widespread than people think. There but for the grace of god go any of us really. I hope you & your sister are ok x

I'd really like to sit down with KB for 10 mins & explain that to her but I highly doubt she would listen. She is not alone in that of course, but her performance was particularly jarring at PMQ's this week.

Thankfully your attempts at insults mean pretty much zip and people will judge Starmer and Labour accordingly.

??

What’s your question?

Not a question. I have given up asking those as you clearly don't like to answer them.

Merely an expression of incomprehension in response to your completely nonsensical post.

Oh right more of the same then. Ok

Are you going to reply to @52andblue ?

I found it interesting that she managed a snarky response to me but completely blanked the post from @52andblue.

Yes I’d like that too, @52andblue, and not just KM; all politicians need to listen to victims more. It's very triggering and also make me despair that in essence nothing has changed since my childhood. None of our abusers faced justice, including my F.

I find that these days everyone likes to say that they care about the victims first and foremost, whether the victims of Epstein or the victims of the grooming gangs. But it mostly feels to me like it's just words and that nothing really changes. I would like to be proved wrong, though.

And I would like some kind of acknowledgement from @EasternStandard too.

I do kind of love Gordon Brown