Labour isn't working - Thread 24

[TheNuthatch]

A chat thread for those who don't like this Labour government. 💙* *

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

Previous thread.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5454130-labour-isnt-working-thread-23?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

Yes I remember that survey too. I did it, but can't remember much about it. Not sure if its the same survey used for this polling though.

Professor kindly posted the article today at 05.46 if you'd like to read up about it. It was a poll of 1000 adults iirc. They've also used AI to gather info from conversations I believe.

@TheNuthatch "They've also used AI to gather info from conversations I believe"

I did wonder that. I'm not sure how good an idea that is. Although I suppose it can just scan to see how much support there is. But ironically, if people are happy, they're not likely to be posting "I'm really pleased about this policy".

Yes iswym.

I'm not very tech minded, but I got the impression that AI was used to measure opinion trends on subjects such as the NHS and education within threads.
I look forward to your take on it when you've read it and formed an opinion, you're always astute with things like this.

I have screenshot some of the most recommended comments. There is a common theme to quite a few of them.
Will attempt to attach some…

A few more…

Morning

Emily Thornberry goes for it in interviews, I wonder how much she regrets that van and flag tweet, she really undermined her own career there.

Smashing, thank you.

Interestingly, many of the die-hards appear to ignore women’s rights, such is their hatred of Reform and the Tories…

Some people will rebute negative posts though, or describe things neutrally.

I wouldn't particularly trust an AI estimate of voting intentions (people don't do what they say - and it can't be verified often). But analysing how sentiment towards particular things has varied over time - that's a perfect fit for AI, and if queried and interpreted correctly is likely to be very accurate.

The AI part could be separate as it was created in 2023 and the poll has been running since 2009.

That they’re separate could have been a bit clearer in the article.

The trans issue certainly moved me rightward. It was so blatantly nutty, unfair and reckless. When women tried to speak about it there were campaigns of terror against them.

Once I saw it I couldn’t un-see it. And I saw the stopping of free speech, the coercion. Once I saw one piece of the puzzle, I recognised more and more.

For people like my husband, who aren’t affected and find it boring, they cannot wrap their heads around how consequential it has been politically.

Well done, Reeves.

Significant numbers of high-paid workers are turning down promotions, cutting hours or donating to charity to avoid the £100,000 tax trap, research conducted for The Telegraph shows.

Two in five managers (43pc) said they themselves or someone they employ had taken steps to reduce their net income below £100,000 to avoid getting hit by punitive taxes.

The Chartered Management Institute’s polling of 898 managers highlights how years of frozen tax thresholds and growing awareness of the trap are prompting widespread behavioural changes.

The tax trap refers to the fact that people earning more than £100,000 lose access to tax-free childcare worth £2,000 per child and lose entitlement to 30 hours of free childcare, worth up to £7,500 per child a year.

The trans issue was the point where I realised we do have a tolerance/free speech and institutional cowardice issue. Nothing can be debated without personal attacks or threats, it’s a bad sign.

Ah, thanks. That makes more sense. It wasn't very clear in the article.

Is this a surprise to anyone on here? Thought not.

Re the last paragraph, its crazy that we do this to working mums who earn well.

I don't know who brought in the £100,000 tax trap?

@TheNuthatch what a sweet thing to say😊 I'm not sure I'll get a chance to read it. The day is disappearing. Or I'm just super slow because of the cold. I really really hate the cold!

It's not so much who brought it in though, it's the freezing of thresholds meaning that in the time since it was introduced, more people (via pay rises / changes of job) are falling into it.

FT

The UK government will need to raise taxes again before the next election because of persistently weak growth and political pressure to top up spending plans, according to a majority of leading economists polled by the FT. After a year of damaging uncertainty over tax policy, Rachel Reeves had built a big enough buffer against her fiscal rules to avoid further tightening this year, the economists said.

But most of the 103 surveyed warned that the economy would not be strong enough for “working people” to feel better off — despite the chancellor’s vow to provide “stability and certainty” and the prospect of lower inflation and interest rates. Almost two-thirds predicted tax increases before the next general election, which must take place by the summer of 2029, irrespective of whether Sir Keir Starmer is still prime minister.

Sir John Gieve, a former Bank of England deputy governor and senior civil servant, said economic growth was “grinding along at 1-2 per cent” and that Reeves’ plans did not yet include higher spending on defence or for topping up the NHS. “Politically, the government will need also to raise spending on other core public services. So taxes will have to follow,” he added.

@NoWordForFluffy I was curious to know who brought it in because it seems so mad

Turns out it's Alistair Darling. Tories had tons of time to do something about it, but I suppose they think they would have been accused of prioritising "the rich".

@Messier61 I am mystified by Rachel Reeves and her self-imposed fiscal rules. Again, I haven't done a lot of reading on that so I'm wondering if I'm missing something.

It was only at this point that I realised that people could be willingly frogmarched to absurdity in an effort to remain ideologically loyal.

I mean, you see it historically, you can point to times and places when this has happened. But that it could happen here and now seemed shocking and really woke me up from a level of political apathy that I had comfortably sunk into over the baby years.

So, I owe that the I am Spartacus threads that circulated - almost/ over a decade ago.

That’s true too.

I assumed that Labour were planning to defer paying for all their mistakes and batshittery so it falls on the next government?
If they put Burnham or Rayner in No.10, all bets are off. It will be hold my beer time with the economy 😬

Same. This weather can bugger off. We had more snow overnight and its not going anywhere.
I'm praying for a hot flush. 🤣

I’ve just seen a clip of Yvette Cooper in the commons on the news. She was stating the government’s belief in Greenland’s right to self-determination.

Funny that. Labour won’t criticise Trump for something he has done in Venezuela, which the left elsewhere universally condemns, but feel the need to oppose something he hasn’t done. And as the idea that he’d invade Greenland is so bonkers that there is zero chance of it happening, this must be the most laughable and pointless Labour posturing yet.

@TheNuthatch what a nightmare! What's the forecast for you? I thought we were out of the woods with regards snow in Essex but apparently there's still a question hovering over the end of the week.

It's really really cold and it makes me very grumpy. And I live in a nice warm new build flat!

In other news, looking at social media makes me think it's all happening in Iran. And apparently MSM is saying nothing, except Sky are saying it's protests about the economy. I heard that from my mum but she also hides from the news these days so she may well have missed something.

Today has gone slowly, but a couple of things I saw on here really made me laugh. I'm about to sit down and watch Forsyte on channel 5. I really liked the version of Forsyte saga with Damien Lewis and Gina McKee - is that from the 90s, yikes, not sure though

I have a feeling I'm not going to like this one so much, but will give it a try.

@DenizenOfAisleOfShame crossposted

I've been hearing that about Greenland since Trump was elected - but there is so much TDS around, it makes it very hard to get a handle on what's real and what's not.

On here, the moment he was elected, there was talk of never having an election again, the midterms being cancelled, etc etc.