Taxes to rise to fund PIP

[Viviennemary]

I just read this, Don't agree with this at all. PIP needs to be reformed. But not by introducing this two tier system. Sick of Labour already. Might have know they would revert to type. With all the infighting and disagreement so nothing ever gets done except back peddling, increased taxes and prices rises.

Correct. People with valid reasons are awarded. No one hands out £20 a week for nothing.

Based on your post, you do have a problem with people claiming PIP. Write to your MP.

They don't trust you and do ask for evidence whivh they then ignore

I have a problem because I have stated some facts! I don't want to write to my MP thanks, just think facts are useful is a discussion.

My children had started school before this system was introduced, but I gather it creates a situation where someone earning £120K a year has an effective tax rate of more than 100% due to loss of the tax free allowance and loss of subsidised childcare. There’s an effective income cap of £100K a year, which makes us uncompetitive and is contributing towards a brain drain. I’d far rather high earners contributed towards their pension than left the U.K.

💯

I remember the other day an OP was saying how the tesco delivery driver was unable to carry the shopping up to her floor because he had leaky leg ulcers.

You mean the kind of celebrities who indulge in tax avoidance schemes, move abroad to become non tax resident in the uk but become tax resident in Switzerland or the Cayman Island, or who carefully arrange their World tours to avoid being "resident" for tax in any country for the year, or the Olympic athletes who refused to partake in the London Olympics unless they got a special dispensation not to be taxed on their income whilst in the UK?

Yeah it’s all just tax, all goes in the same pot.

Penioners cost the state the most at this stage in their life, it doesn’t make a great deal of sense that they pay lower tax than a worker with a higher income.

We pay too much tax as it it, with not exactly a lot in return. Sick to death of being squeezed all the time

I feel like I’m being turned upside down and shook to get my change

Its just this constant theme of people being more than happy to share their outrage from the sofa, but never actually do anything constructive about it 🤷‍♀️

Yeah they do ignore it 🙈 they write in the report their is no evidence of that then you have to re explain at mandatory reconsideration that you ask to be recorded as you realise what liars they are that 3 different consultants have explained to you why I can't do that so what do you mean their is no evidence

If it was about having paid the maximum contribution to the state pension, it would cut off when you hit the right number of years - not at 67.

It all goes in the same pot. And it’s paid out of current taxation.

There is no justification for pensioners having a lower tax rate than a worker on the same wage - particularly given the cost of funding health and social care for this age group.

I’m not able to “host” a thread but this would be a great one. Really good question!

There are no doctors doing PIP assessments. And the assessors who carry out the examinations have medical evidence in front of them provided by the claimant, which gives an indication of what the claimant may be able/unable to do by reason of their condition. Lots of assessors are physiotherapists and OT’s - well placed to judge what’s reasonable and what’s not. They also use the fact that a claimant can do one activity to prove that they can do another, if they are similar in the faculties needed to carry them out. They ask if the claimant can drive, and if so they will use the skills needed to drive to prove things like movement of limbs, head and neck movement, coordination and cognitive skills. Even the fact that you can self propel a wheelchair can be used to prove you can do another activity needing the same motor skills.

And you are watched from the moment you arrive for examination - including how far you walk for car park, or to the examination room etc. Your movements while sitting down are observed - how you move, how easily you shift position, whether you need help getting up etc. They ask you to flex limbs to gauge bending and stretching angles, and they also test grip where appropriate. Even pain and breathlessness is observed and quantified and if you say you’re in pain, the levels will to some extent be gauged by what, and how many painkillers are prescribed. It’s also a fact that if you need walking aids such as crutches, sticks or wheelchairs , they can’t be privately sourced. - they have to be NHS prescribed so there is record as to why they are needed. It’s all evidence, and nothing is left to ‘good faith’. At all.

My DS is disabled. We claim DLA for him because his needs are very profound. I also have a disability but don’t claim PIP because I muddle through. Am I happy to contribute through taxes to other people’s PIP? Absolutely. An adult on the highest rate gets less than £10k a year. It’s not finding foreign holidays and flat screen tvs. It’s not instead of people earning a wage themselves. It’s a contribution towards the higher cost of accommodations that disability necessitates. It pays for aids, carers, PAs.

People who are angry at the recipients of PIP and see it as them getting “free money” are angry about the wrong thing. The rate of abuse of disability benefits is less than 1%.

I do, however, resent paying my taxes whilst the biggest corporations and highest earners are able to dodge theirs.

I really would be against any further tax rises. I own a small business and employ 15 people.

Last year my corporation tax bill went up £20,000 purely due to the increase in tax rate.

This year my employer's NI bill is £20,000 higher due to the changes implemented in the budget.

This is not encouraging me to grow my business. We've had two members of staff hand their notice in recently and they will not be replaced. My business partner and I were only saying the other day that we could probably dispense with all our staff, give up our office and just work for ourselves and earn the same amount of money personally as we currently do running a larger business.

My sister is in receipt of PIP. They have to go through the rigmarole of reviews, etc, which are ridiculous. She has a severe learning difficulty and is comparable to an 18 month old. She'll never walk, talk or have the ability to live by herself or work. Why do they have to review it? She's clearly exceptionally high needs and just should automatically have the highest level of PIP without the need for a review.

She lives in a care home, of which there are many all around the country. All of these people are unnecessarily having reviews. How much time is spent on these? Cutting down such unnecessary reviews would save the government so much time and money.

You said: The benefits system needs reform urgently. I was pleased Labour (who have some humanity) were going to tackle it. But now they’ve backed down. More people need to work

How were the PIP reforms going to get more people into work?

If everyone on PIP got a job tomorrow, they would still get PIP.

The government hasn't really backed down. It has made a concession which makes the system even more unfair and which will do nothing to get people into work.

Who else? Well for a start, those with "passive" income like property letting, interest, pensions, etc who pay less on the same income because they're exempt from NIC. Then there are those with high wealth in investments, pension funds, second properties, buy to let properties, investment portfolios etc who could be "tapped" for higher capital gains tax or wealth taxes. Lots of non workers are actually very wealth off, either in terms of income or assets, yet it's the workers who are proportionally taxed more!

This is completely correct. I know that if you can and do drive regularly then you have the grip, body movement and strength to put on a seatbelt, for example. That then feeds into whether you can complete the PIP activities satisfactorily.

Only thing I would note is I have had reports sent from Doctors. They’re not the most common Assessors but there are definitely a handful of them doing it.

You've misunderstood me. I know what PIP is and I know it has nothing to do with employment. Its for people that need extra help to manage their disabilities. The reason they are trying to reform it and remove bits of it is because there's no money for it - a situation that would be alleviated by getting some of the lazy arses off UC, the ones that don't want to work when they can, and diverting funds from there.

This. The only reason reforming PIP will make a difference to whether people work or not, is that if it’s withdrawn they won’t be able to make ends meets so will be forced into work whether they’re capable or not. It will also lead to people losing vital PIP support enabling them to work in the first place - something the government clearly either hasn’t factored in, or doesn’t care about.

Actually it's a once every ten years thing not a one off. It's to reward those what work full time on a low wage and pay tax. The NHS gets awarded far too much money and waste so much on non essentials. Some trusts pay almost twice as much for toilet rolls as other trusts just as an example. Far too much money spent on diversity czars and senior management and not enough spent on nurses.

How does this work with video assessments?

So where is the justification for cutting it ? Why not just concentrate on getting those capable of work back into work and divert those funds as you’ve just suggested.