Taxes to rise to fund PIP

[Viviennemary]

I just read this, Don't agree with this at all. PIP needs to be reformed. But not by introducing this two tier system. Sick of Labour already. Might have know they would revert to type. With all the infighting and disagreement so nothing ever gets done except back peddling, increased taxes and prices rises.

Good for you. 5 in 6 people who get PIP don't.

Equally lots of people who ‘can’t work’ would end up dead.

A very small portion of people don't have the capacity to do anything. If we can cut the disability bill by 50% we can increase the support to those left by 10% and society will be much better off.

But also -
if you fund childcare, people can go to work and pay taxes. Keeping people in work in those years in some way is clearly beneficial (financially) for the long term for all.

Do you think it would benefit the Government if they consulted with the magical cohort of the 17% on PIP and in work, as to how they do it?

I can't work because my son is disabled. Worked full time up until then.

It would also mean having very understanding work places and very understanding co-workers. Some of the threads on here have proved that people don't want the disabled on Pip or DLA but at the same time, they'd rather not have to accommodate them at work either.

Maybe our young people need to be taught resilience. They just don’t seem to be capable of coping with life in general. - and then the MH issues rears its head. With all this talk of war, I honestly dread to think what sort of army we will be able to pull together. Most will exempt themselves. There was more reason 100 years ago for people to be depressed and anxious, yet people back then were generally so much stronger and resilient than today’s young.

Pay tax, NI and pension contributions. Well that’s the theory anyway.

Turn out the taxes and NI and pension contributions aren’t enough.

And definitely PIP should be means tested. Madness that hypothetically speaking, a millionaire could actually receive it.

Schools are teaching them they can miraculously change sex ffs. Then FE and HE and workplaces are going along with it! Madness.

Young people battling to stay alive whilst living with mental illness ARE resilient!

No, sorry, that doesn’t work here - parenthood is a choice, disability is not. And if the government were wielding the axe on the eye watering cost to government of supporting parents and children - many of whom are earning far in excess of what disabled people would be able to - then this would be a very different discussion.

And as explained upthread it depends where the thresholds are set. Wherever they are set, there are going to be those who lose out in a lot of support for the sake of a few pounds in income. There will also be those with very high disability related costs who will be expected to deplete their resources considerably before qualifying for support. How is this fair ? Wherever means testing is applied it’s always a race to the bottom. And if you look at the numerous studies that have been done into disability costs, what’s paid in disability benefits doesn’t begin to cover the reality. It’s a contribution at best. So how do you decide who gets it and who doesn’t ?

The way I try to explain it to people is to imagine you were planning something - a holiday for example & weighing up the different options. For a non disabled person you can choose where you want to spend more for a better experience & where you can pick a budget option.
For a disabled person the choices are much more limited & it's always the cheaper options that have to be ruled out - usually because flexibility & last minute are not options & more planning is required for every thing you do.

Then multiply that across everyday tasks, work, socializing etc & you find that everything ends up more expensive.

It's not the case that every disability can be solved with an 'aid or appliance' or an hours paid carer a week etc it feels more like a tax in that everything I try to do is more complicated to arrange & more expensive due to disability. Reality is PIP helps to mitigate that & gives disabled people independence & choices.

I'm not sure they coped with mental illness any better 100 years ago people were locked up in the county asylum and forgotten about

So many people are blind to this.

It depends on the severity of the disability and many other social factors, including the willingness of employers to actually employ disabled people. It’s much easier for someone who already has a job when they become disabled to retain that job, than it is for a disabled person to find work starting from scratch.

Agree. It amazes me the amount of posters who think that if you stop funding a need, that need magically disappears.

Which speaks to the fact that being a parent is a choice, disability is not.

And once more with feeling, disability benefits are nothing to do with the ability to work. They don’t assess the ability to work, they exist purely to provide support with the cost of disability.

British soldiers were prescribed cocaine to help them cope with WW1, so I'm not sure that resilience was innate.__

You said quite clearly that those with MH issues are not entitled to a car. And the fact is that if they qualify for the higher rate mobility allowance then they qualify for a car on motability.

Definitely this i have a very flexible employer who i was working at for over 10 years prior to reducing hrs and claiming pip. I would absolutely not be hired anywhere else if I lost this job and if I was i wouldn't pass the probation period as I would need time off for appointments and illness

Just over 100 years ago, young men were imprisoned if they didn't sign up. Those who did, but couldn't cope and absconded were executed.

So there was plenty of stick to make sure people complied, regardless of their mental health or "resilience". Personally I would rather we didn't do that.

Yes, workplaces need to adapt, and existing disabled people are experts on what they require and need.

Additionally, the Bradford Score system is self-defeating, not least for a country that supposedly wishes to develop a work culture that genuinely improves the employability of people with disabilities, related illnesses, and potential WFH requests.

The Government is yet to consult with disabled people’s groups on this.