Year 1 child excluded - help please

[ncforschoolhelp]

Hi all

I have a previous thread about my year 1 child's behavioural issues almost exclusively at school. He has now been temporarily excluded and I am really hoping for advice from any parents of young children who have been through similar, any teachers who could give any advice and any governors who might be able to shed some light on any appropriate next steps for me or from the school.

The reason given today was his level of disruption wasn't feasible for him to stay in the building and he wasn't calming down with the usual interventions the school give.

Happy to answer any q's and apologies for lack of insight so far.

That doesn't mean that there aren't any issues just that the school haven't found any yet.

My son had problems at school from year 2, was excluded numerous times. I was told it was my parenting etc and wasn't believed when I said we didn't have any problems at home. Years of assessments by Ed. Psyche, Specialist Teaching Services etc finally gave him a diagnosis of Aspergers at age 11.

That's not necessarily, my friends son was temporarily excluded in year 1. No SEN, no trauma just no discipline at home. He was allowed to hit, kick, punch and swear at home and out and about as well as she thought that was the way to let him express himself. As soon as he was in a structured environment where those things are unacceptable he was getting disciplined (obviously) but because it was allowed at home he continued.
Thankfully as he got older he learnt boundaries himself and stopped doing those things at home as well (his younger siblings are still allowed to run riot) he's currently in year 10 and sitting his non compulsory exams early so next year he can concentrate on English, maths and science.

Actually my autistic DD was worse at school than at home because home didn't have the same stressors, or at least not to the same extent. At home she didn't have to deal with the noise of 30 children, frequently getting brushed against or squashed in busy corridors, smells from toilets (at infants age a good few don't remember to flush).

Touch some grass.

This sounds like my son, we think and his therpaist it is autism pda with adhd.
The school can put in place things before diognosis, we got a referall from the school to camhs and also various other supports.
Private diognosis also helps if tou can afford it.
Also speak to ss and say you are not s3nding him to school unless there is an echp in place, this worked for someone I know, the echp soon got rushed through quickly.

My dd was suspended 3 times last year and I'm governor who sits on panels. I can't and won't go into into the cases but we look at the school, LA and national policy, leave everything at the door and just check we followed policy which is as it should be. We are not there to defend the HT or the child. Just to check everything was done right. I'm not convinced that a lot of schools would close ranks. We always feel very deeply for the family.

It was hideous when my dd was suspended. Hideous. She has made a massive come back. My advice is you need to ask your LA to assess him for a EHCP. This triggers the Ed psychologist. If the LA refuse you appeal. If you have a couple of grand down the sofa you can go privately BUT my LA ignore private reports. I appealed to get the private report into dds ehcp.

Appealing to SENDIST takes an entire year so it's not ideal but better than waiting for the senco forever.

I'd gather evidence to give yourself the best chance the LA will just assess.

You could self refer to early help.

You could try to contact your LA EP team yourself directly. I have done this myself twice. Once I got the EP in to assess my son within a week.

Is he an only child? How often is he the first to do things at home, or win?

And no I'm not blaming you but if this is all that's causing the outbursts it might not be a SEN issue at all not all behaviour problems at school are.

We had this when my son started school and what helped before his siblings came along was to make him wait for things, by this I mean the natural instinct for parents is to put their child first. They get the choice of flavour of crisps in a multibag, they get their dinner served first, they get to win at games etc. It was a really hard thing to do but once we started not letting him always get first choice, not letting him always win, serving the other adults dinner first sometimes his behaviour at school got so much better around not always winning etc.

Also this is a really really short ½ term with loads needing to be crammed in, school routines changing due to SATs, the weather has been hot then cold then hot again etc.

Just a note before you go rushing down the PDA route, it is possible but other things present similarly in young children. In my daughter's case, the doctor who diagnosed her (with autism) said she was so overwhelmed with attending school with no support that she was permanently in fight or flight mode. I believe her as once she got more support, her behaviour improved and while she's still anxious it's better than back then. Before this we tried PDA strategies, some were helpful, but she does need more structure than they provide.
Another alternative I've heard is that if a child has autism and ADHD, the conflict between them can often look like PDA.

I don't know if this will help but part of my job is exclusions.
Temporary exclusions are now called suspensions.
The school has to notify the local authority of suspensions.
Over 15 days in a set period of time will trigger a governors meeting.
It sounds like you need to request an EHCNA as his needs are above the norm that the school can support at 'K support' level.
Unfortunately it's becoming increasingly common for very young children to be suspended or permanently excluded, particularly when a child's additional needs are so high that the school is battling to keep them safe in school. At primary level the schools will usually try everything before moving to permanent exclusion, so suspensions tend to increase.
At the reintegration meeting, ask the senco (often the head or the deputy head in primaries) what referrals they are going to make .
For yourself, look up the EHCNA process on your local authority website and complete the form to get the process started. Contact the Fair Access team who can often signpost to other agencies and also sometimes have a small budget pot they can give to schools for a specific intervention.

IPSEA have a good website to help a parent request an assessment for EHCP and will support parents in appealing if the EHCP is refused.

Ex teacher here. If the school has stuck to their policies re behaviour and gone through the steps then this is where you are unfortunately! I'm presuming they did do this, or do you find fault with their actions other than just that you are unhappy your child has been excluded? Did noone including yourself investigate possible special needs? Sorry but this feels too little too late...what did everyone try to help him with his behaviour? Are there underlying reasons why he doesn't behave? Do you think it's learning difficulties or mental health or is your son traumatised? You could contact the schools dept with your council and maybe challenge the decision if you wish particularly if the school for example didn't follow their policy but in truth they very well may not be equipped to deal with your child's extreme behaviours.
At the end of the day, there is likely one adult dealing with thirty children and he or she needs supporting too, particularly given the high pressure Ofsted led environment school staff work in.

Going forward if you can get your child diagnosed and a statement they will have more support and more money allocated to them for resources including adult supervision. Similarly though a different facility might be better for your child, at least temporarily to.work on behaviour. From personal experience I know behaviour facilities can work wonders.
I agree he/she is very little to be excluded but you'd be surprised at the number of children in classes that age who kick off these days, biting, kicking etc, not to mention the number who are still I nappies, can't feed themselves, good a pencil etc. Schools are stretched!

When you see the “exaggerated response”, what do YOU/your DH do? How do you handle it?

I hope you get the help you need. I think some boys in particular have a very difficult time at this age. There was a boy in my son's class who kicked the teacher and was permanently excluded. He was the brightest boy I've ever met and clearly very frustrated with his surroundings.

You're getting great advice and support here OP. I don't know but I don't feel SEN is automatically jumping out here. In teaching 20years and have a onetime explosive child myself, who like yours was super bright but frustrated and emotionally not on a par with intellect - I do feel this mismatch can lead to issues with v immature behaviours. I see it in a particular child I'm working with currently. As time has gone on, the improvement is clear. Time is a disregarded intervention!

I'd wonder were there any issues in previous preschool or whatever childcare situation was in place and like others I'd wondered how these v specific behaviours are handled. It's not a global thing, but v particular times that you've described. What's your own feeling on SEN? The overwhelm of this type of setting could v well be an issue. I'm a play therapist also and find narrating and naming feelings as a pp mentioned, can really help alongside unconditional regard , he needs to be getting the clear message that be is like and valued by his school adults.its incredible how much a relational connection can help struggling children.

Is the referal for autism and adhd? Has the referal been accepted. Do you know how long the waiting list is? Cahms waiting times in our area is 4 years. You may want to consider a referal through right to choose instead but I don’t think they’re always a good.

Ed pysch will totally be about funds.

I would be asking everyone’s advice, ring the inclusion person at the LEA, contact local SENDIASS and ask their advice and gather all the info. When you have this ask for meeting with school’s SENCo and ask for adjustments, they should be treating your child as if they have asd/adhd. After the meeting email the SENCo and brief summary of what discussed for ‘your own records’ of what you asked for and their response and ask them if they agree with the summary. Ask if you think you should be applying for an ECHP. You can apply for this without the school.

This is specific to girls who tend to be high masking but always but you may want to think of them in terms of adjustments

autisticgirlsnetwork.org/reasonable-adjustments-possible-at-school/

If the school won’t organise an educational psychologist you can do this privately and ask that they assess in school. Last one I had was around £1-1.2k

Tell the school you want his assessed by an educational psychologist. My son was after being excluded at 13. Best thing ever as they see behaviour for what it is and how teachers can help instead of exclusion. ed psych got so many things put in place for him that he had a great last 2yrs of school. Also apply for an EHCP as they clearly can't cope.

Can I just ask again about the work commitments? is there any possible way you could take a year off?

He is so so very young and it seems to me that for whatever reasons the school is only making things worse for him.

If it were my child, I would want to take them out of that school. I fear he is being labelled at an early age and this could be disastrous for him. Exclusion is severe as you know.

Yes he probably needs more professional assessment, this could be done out of school?

I recently found a forest school setting for my own daughter which she goes to twice a week; it has worked amazingly for her. They take kids full time up to age 7.

I think your son needs your time and focus desperately. He is too young for this all to be solved by a school. He needs you.

Perhaps you move into a smaller house to shrink the mortgage; perhaps both parents go part time. I personally think it’s something you should seriously consider.

You come across as a wonderful parent, and I really wish you all the best x

Ed psych was around £600 for secondary school in 2020/21 my sons secondary was reluctant to pull one in for him I'm case he had covid that day and the money was wasted happily though someone else had covid on the day the came in and she saw my son instead she repeated the advice she gave in primary school and they ignored it just like in primary school until year 9 when "everyone" had school laptops and were instructed to bring them in

The joys

I'm generally in an eyeball rolling "everyone thinks they have SEN camp" but I agree with this

Even if it's just for due dilligence I have him assessed.
Separately I would try and understand exactly what's happening at school in a very specific way.

question: Does the school have any cctv ypu could watch to see if this is so out of kilter with his behaviour at home??

Honestly this doesn't sound like the right school for your child would moving to a more structured school be a possibility? I have polar opposite children my first is flexible but liked the rules at school second inflexible would never thrive in a mixed age class and rules ARE RULES end of discussion third one believes rules are guidelines seats are optional dancing in math is fine (he goes to an sen school so they can) I picked schools on there needs they have to spend a lot of time there

Ok, well regardless of diagnosis which in the current times is taking years anyway, best thing to do is pursue that route but also look into what supports he needs anyway.

whether he has SEN or not, the important thing to do is work out what is triggering the violence/disruption and then change the environment so that it isn’t there. You/the school can then work on developing his tolerance to it.

the free-flow classroom sounds tricky. Many kids in that kind of situation prefer either a much more child led environment (think forest school and no adult led activities at all) or a completely adult led environment (all kids at desks and get in with what the teacher tells you). The mix can be confusing for some kids and make them very anxious.

what was he like at pre-school/nursery? That will give you some clues.

more specifically, the EP would probably ask the teacher to fill in an ABC chart. This is a way of working out what is triggering the disruptive/violent behaviour.

so every time he is violent/dusruptive the teacher writes down:

A antecedents. What was happening before the behaviour started. In as much detail as possible.

B- behaviour. Write down what the behaviour actually was, so what happened. Again, detail is Important.

c - consequences. So this is writing down what happened after the behaviour. Not consequences as in punishment that the school or you impose but just what happened as a result of the behaviour.

so an example might be:

A - the class were lining up to go to assembly
B - the child kicked the child. Next to him and then threw a chair at the teaxher
C - the class were late for assembly and the child didn’t go in to assembly.

this sort of analysis helps understand what precisely your child is finding difficult and then support/exemptions can be put in place.

How much communication have you had from school before about his behaviour? Did you expect this or are you totally surprised?

If you can afford private Ed psych I'd do that. School probably can't afford it.

What happens at home when he loses? Obviously you cannot remove all competition from life, but if it is a non explicit competition, does he still react?

You do want to get this sorted ASAP because school may be trying to mount evidence they cannot meet his need.