Sigh. Pope Leo’s first sermon…

[CurlewKate]

“"A lack of faith is often tragically accompanied by the loss of meaning in life, the neglect of mercy, appalling violations of human dignity, the crisis of the family and so many other wounds that afflict our society,"

I don’t know why I expected anything different. Maybe because he likes Wordle?

All over this thread people are trying to explain to you why the Pope’s speech is’ important. The political, financial and cultural position of the Catholic Church is the context. You are asking me what the impact of ONE speech has. What do you want me to say? It will change the course of Catholicism? You quite clearly thinks it doesn’t matter what the Pope says, which I think is really bizarre as his words are always widely published. Sometimes the Pope says things I agree with. I think the last Pope delivered some good sermons actually.

It was reported on the BBC as the second lead article.

And you seem to be ignoring the Vatican's intepretation.

For some reason

No one is forcing anyone to click on any articles...

And I'm not sure why I should care what the Vatican have written about it? I don't value their interpretation more highly than my own ability to read what was written.

I'm saying that this sermon was standard pope stuff and no one is going to change what they are doing because of it.

People can say 'ooh the church and the pope are very influential' all they like, but if this speech doesn't actually do or say anything different to normal, what influence is it going to have exactly?

I opened this thread expecting the pope to have said something controversial or interesting.

Interesting.

I mean the Vatican press would put their spin on it to get the message out about the Pope's thoughts.

The official line, so to take.

And other people clearly have a similar interpretation of what the Pope said in that sermon.

How confident are you in your interpretation of his sermon?

Here's the thing - I don't care either way.

I mean, you can say the same about what Starmer, Trump, the King… say too and then choose not to engage and that’s your prerogative. Idk why you are so invested in this thread if you do not care or just put your own spin on things.

I might try to put my own spin on what Trump says for my own sanity 😂

Why am I so invested in this thread?

Because it's an embarrassment to atheists, tbh.

Well that's good to hear.

So I guess you won't be feeling the need to respond to someone else's interpretation if you don't care either way.....

Clearly you do care then....

I don't care what the pope thinks about atheists, I'm pretty sure he thinks they should be Catholics. He probably think they are going to hell.

But someone going 'oh the pope was insulting atheists how terrible' in a speech that was basically just a normal pope speech that suggested that being a Catholic is better than the alternatives is just mad. Certainly not speaking for me.

glitch double post

@noblegiraffeBut that wasn’t what the pope was doing. Of course he thinks Catholics are the best and thinks everyone should be a Catholic. That is, as you say , basic Pope stuff. He was explicitly saying that people who don’t have faith are likely to commit evil acts, to damage society and be morally inferior.

Noblegiraffe puts her own spin on it remember, so who knows what she thinks the Pope said

Group 1
Even today, there are many settings in which the Christian faith is considered absurd, meant for the weak and unintelligent. Settings where other securities are preferred, like technology, money, success, power, or pleasure.
These are contexts where it is not easy to preach the Gospel and bear witness to its truth, where believers are mocked, opposed, despised or at best tolerated and pitied. Yet, precisely for this reason, they are the places where our missionary outreach is desperately needed. A lack of faith is often tragically accompanied by the loss of meaning in life, the neglect of mercy, appalling violations of human dignity, the crisis of the family and so many other wounds that afflict our society.

Group 2
Today, too, there are many settings in which Jesus, although appreciated as a man, is reduced to a kind of charismatic leader or superman. This is true not only among non-believers but also among many baptized Christians, who thus end up living, at this level, in a state of practical atheism.

If you're an atheist in group 2 - one of the non believers who think Jesus was a good guy but not the actual son of God, and not one of the atheists in group 1 who mocks and despises religion and instead worships money and power, why are you taking taking offence about what he says about the atheists in group 1?

And if you are an atheist in group 1 who mocks and despises Christianity and worships money, why exactly should the pope be thinking kindly of you?

You really do care about this.

I’m always up for an argument…

So how confident are you in your interpretation of the Pope's sermon then?
Given that there's some new evidence on the thread from a respected source, which is the Vatican, who appear to have a different interpretation?

Atheists really shouldn’t hold much truck with appeals to authority. Particularly the authority of religious institutions.

You could try arguing with my interpretation.

I'm not religious in the slightest and am much more moral and kind than all the religious people I know.

More to the point, when I AM kind and do the right thing, I don't do it to appease some imaginary friend in the sky.

Gosh if you are "kind" yet dismiss other people's faith as an "imaginary friend in the sky" , I'd dread to meet your friends who are less kind than you!!

I think I might have argued with your interpretation on this thread.

I am reasonably confident in my interpretation, especially as the Vatican seem to be going along a similar pattern.

Of course, the only way to check the interpretation would be to ask the Pope what he meant in that sermon.

Do you think you fall into Group 1 or Group 2?

You are missing a group.

Why not try posting what you think the positions are of people on this thread?

I would do but I am busy having tea at the moment

Agree you are missing a group.