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Original poster

Thread 23 Starmer - Reflux Remedy

988 replies

DuncinToffee · 06/05/2025 20:44

Previous thread
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5319797-thread-22-starmer-running-up-to-local-elections?page=40&reply=144097823

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71
bombastix · 12/05/2025 17:38

PickAChew · 12/05/2025 17:16

And yet in the 2019 general election we got the first real indication that the working classes were losing faith in labour when most of the red wall north east constituencies turned blue. They voted for the very people who had decimated local industry in the past and now allowed their current working conditions and security to be eroded as well as seeing to it that sure starts and libraries closed, moving them off tax credits onto UC and so on. The rhetoric at the time was still one of austerity and that labour would waste money.

Even when labour got those constituencies back, last year, Reform came a solid second. Even in the City of Durham which has been immune to the effects of these swings, due to a different overall demographic, Reform were still second.

Labour had plenty of warning that they had lost the formerly unquestioning loyalty of their core voters.

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I totally agree! The first break was Johnson and his sunlit uplands. Labour should have realised their vote was going soft. It may yet totally melt.

Brexit is in part about the failure to give good living standards to UK citizens. Lack of investment, poverty, decline of towns and aspiration. The cheap line is to blame foreigners. It’s a crock

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 17:40

Sadly it is a line that works

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bombastix · 12/05/2025 18:02

I think really Labour need to be more clever; this kind of ding dong politics suits Farage. It’s good copy.

i despair a bit re Clive Lewis et al. Labour will always scratch itself in public as my mother used to say. Also drives Farage etc and his creepy narrative.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 18:05

Farage is about channel crossings, nothing else

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cardibach · 12/05/2025 18:07

Fuck’s sake.
Where is this country going?
That was in response to Duncin’s comment about the Tories

BIossomtoes · 12/05/2025 18:15

DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 17:32

The Tories are saying that Labour is not going far enough as they propose to have an annual cap in immigration, and to exclude immigration cases from the Human Rights Act.

The cap Cameron set went so well. What do they think has changed, I wonder?

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 18:18

Lib Dems and Greens are attacking on the rhetoric used but not on the white paper.

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bombastix · 12/05/2025 18:23

BIossomtoes · 12/05/2025 18:15

The cap Cameron set went so well. What do they think has changed, I wonder?

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This is bollocks. The cap doesn’t work as a political risk (note Farage won’t give one either) and Article 8 (while a qualified right) can’t properly be legislated out of an entire group as it would clearly be discriminatory on the basis of Article 14 ECHR.

The above is why Reform want rid of the ECHR. Once you get rid of it then all discriminatory law goes out of the window.

There is a way to qualify Article 8 which is lawful and it looks like Labour will legislate to prevent “exceptional circumstances” being used as it has been. That’s okay with me

itsgettingweird · 12/05/2025 19:08

bombastix · 12/05/2025 16:57

You mean those Tory donors like Clearsprings who made a mint from renting out their hotels to the Home Office. Nice work for them and no incentive to speed matters up. All good money from the taxpayers extracted to private business.

Yes. And then they start blaming those said asylum seekers for being there.

but people just hear the words - they don’t bother with the actual truth.

They did it because it benefited them to do it.

itsgettingweird · 12/05/2025 19:10

DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 18:05

Farage is about channel crossings, nothing else

Sad but true.

If reform get in what exactly will they do other than puncture a few dingies?

Karistyleaftea · 12/05/2025 19:20

I still believe in Sir Keir Starmer, he is our very best option - by far.
Farage and co won't save us.
The Tories have shown what they can do for us over the last 14 years.

The media will never give Labour a break so they need to just crack on with it and save their counter attack for the next GE when I honestly believe the UK will be in a very much better position for having had Labour in government.
In my opinion.

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 19:33

The rhetoric Starmer used is awful though, especially if you are an immigrant or related to them.

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cardibach · 12/05/2025 19:48

I think it’s being taken a bit out of context, in fairness. It’s coming across poorly but he wasn’t saying immigrants are ‘strangers’. He was talking about a shared plan. “In a diverse nation like ours, and I celebrate that, these rules become even more important. Without them, we risk becoming an island of strangers, not a nation that walks forward together.”

LittleBowSheep · 12/05/2025 20:22

PandoraSocks · 12/05/2025 16:12

Similar thoughts here, Cardi.

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Likewise @PandoraSocks and @Cardibach.

I am a Plaid voter and I think hell would freeze over before Reform were elected in the part of north Wales where I live, thankfully.

But I am very concerned about which way the Senedd elections will go. I'm still hoping that enough people will see how useless Reform are by the time the election comes round.

Evenstar · 12/05/2025 20:28

This is beyond belief, Ann Widdecombe thinks they have gone too far 🤯

Thread 23 Starmer - Reflux Remedy
Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 20:35

Has she told Tice?

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BIossomtoes · 12/05/2025 20:39

Jesus wept. Is this Wonderland?

bombastix · 12/05/2025 21:16

Apparently the Reform complaint is now that Starmer’s changes will only get migration down to pre Brexit levels. FFS clown people with their clown ideas

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 21:20

They are admitting then that their Brexit increased immigration?

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BIossomtoes · 12/05/2025 21:26

That’s certainly the implication. What an own goal.

bombastix · 12/05/2025 21:48

Pre Brexit- 210k
Post Brexit -720k
2022 - 870k
2023 - 905k
2024 - 728k
2025 - ?

Screw the Tories. Look at these numbers. Functional addiction to cheap labour and not investing in our own people.

But look at the small boats over here. Bunch of grubby hustlers

Original poster
DuncinToffee · 12/05/2025 22:10

cardibach · 12/05/2025 19:48

I think it’s being taken a bit out of context, in fairness. It’s coming across poorly but he wasn’t saying immigrants are ‘strangers’. He was talking about a shared plan. “In a diverse nation like ours, and I celebrate that, these rules become even more important. Without them, we risk becoming an island of strangers, not a nation that walks forward together.”

I have read that again now it has calmed down a bit and the 'a nation that walks forward together' was something I missed.

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Original poster
DuncinToffee · 13/05/2025 08:18

Worrying news

Counter-terrorism police have arrested a 21-year-old man on suspicion of arson at the home of UK PM Sir Keir Starmer.

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Alexandra2001 · 13/05/2025 08:20

bombastix · 12/05/2025 21:48

Pre Brexit- 210k
Post Brexit -720k
2022 - 870k
2023 - 905k
2024 - 728k
2025 - ?

Screw the Tories. Look at these numbers. Functional addiction to cheap labour and not investing in our own people.

But look at the small boats over here. Bunch of grubby hustlers

I'm surprised Labour isn't making more of this....

Farage helped give us Brexit, the Tories implemented this disasterous policy.