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Has the US crossed the Rubicon? - Trump thread #142

1000 replies

Spandauer · 15/04/2025 18:42

Here be dragons.

Previous thread:
www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5307874-are-we-feeling-liberated-yet-trump-thread-141

Has the US crossed the Rubicon? - Trump thread #142
OP posts:
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133
Jaichangecentfoisdenom · 18/04/2025 11:01

Best I could do this morning.

Has the US crossed the Rubicon? - Trump thread #142
PerkingFaintly · 18/04/2025 11:05

Jaichangecentfoisdenom · 18/04/2025 09:21

I can't answer you, but your post raises another question I keep wondering about. HOW has he managed to ride roughshod over everyone and actually re-write the rules without any opposition or consequences?
I have found this, from 2020, which I think is still true. Screenshots from FB.

Yep, sounds about right. I grew up in an environmment with the same hatred of weakness, combined with a vicious inverted snobbery.

Being the UK, it wasn't cast as "owning the Libs", but it was the same sort of driving hatred against perceived other groups.

PerkingFaintly · 18/04/2025 11:18

DuncinToffee · 18/04/2025 10:30

Trump is ready to give up on ending the war in Ukraine.

Rubio: 'We're not going to continue with this endeavour for weeks and months on end. So we need to determine very quickly now, and I'm talking about a matter of days...If it is, we're in. If it's not, then we have other priorities to focus on as well."' https://kyivindependent.com/us-ready-to-abandon-russia-ukraine-ceasefire-efforts-rubio-says/

We-ell, as the Trump administration's idea of a "peace deal" is for Ukraine to give the US all its minerals and stop resisting the Russian invasion, I'm not sure that's a bad thing.

Spurious talks to divert its enemies is what Russia does, all day long.

The Trump administration seems to have been playing on Russia's team, and is now saying they're going to give up? Great, Ukraine no longer has to waste energy dealing with them.

Also, sorry can't remember if it was referenced on this thread or the Ukraine one, but the shift from the Trumpies complaining that "We gave you weapons for free" to "No, you can't buy weapons from us for money"; and from "Europe should be looking after its own military defence" to their reported rage that European countries are still defending and supplying Ukraine, tells us what the Trump administration is really after – and has been all along.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

logicisall · 18/04/2025 12:31

Whether the US continues to seek a Ukraine capitulation peace deal or not, Ukraine is screwed.
Politically and economically.
Sky news

On the tariff front, I was always suspicious of Italy and thought Meloni probably believes her looks/sex gave her an in with Trump. This is not a general misogynist thought, but specific to her.

Ukraine war latest: Kremlin responds after US threatens to 'move on' if no progress in peace talks

The Kremlin has responded after the US said it could abandon its Ukraine war peace efforts within days unless there's progress. Meanwhile, a minerals deal between the US and Ukraine looks likely to be made official next week. Follow the latest below.

https://news.sky.com/story/ukraine-war-trump-putin-zelenskyy-rubio-russia-moscow-kyiv-latest-12541713?postid=9454511#liveblog-body

tobee · 18/04/2025 14:37

So is it back to Trump Gaza? Or Greenland? Or Canada? Or the Panama Canal?

AcrossthePond55 · 18/04/2025 15:02

tobee · 18/04/2025 14:37

So is it back to Trump Gaza? Or Greenland? Or Canada? Or the Panama Canal?

Like every toddler, it's back to whichever shiny tiny bawbee, new or old, next catches his beady little eye.

In this case 'bawbee' is defined as 'whatever I think makes me look smart and powerful and pisses off the Democrats'. Or possibly 'whatever shiny toy Elon dangles in front of my massive ego'.

MrsTerryPratchett · 18/04/2025 16:12

Spandauer · 18/04/2025 09:24

The basis of their 'evidence' is an interaction Abrego Garcia had with the police in March 2019. Judge Xinis has said evidence is not sufficient or reliable enough to prove that Abrego Garcia is a gang member.

The Justice Department released documents for a March 2019 encounter Abrego Garcia had with local police at a Home Depot in Hyattsville, Maryland, just outside of Washington, D.C. At the time, Abrego Garcia’s lawyers said he was seeking work as a day laborer.
^^
The case set off a chain of events that culminated in him being turned over to Immigration and Customs Enforcement and accused of being MS-13.
^^
According to the redacted Gang Field Interview Sheet, Prince George’s County Police officers responded to the Home Depot and found four men loitering in the parking lot and detained them for questioning. Abrego Garcia was among them.
^^
Police said they arrested two men identified as active MS-13 members and found two small plastic bottles with marijuana.
Abrego Garcia, police said, wore a Chicago Bulls hat and hoodie with rolls of money “covering the eyes, ears and mouth of the presidents on the separate denominations,” which they said indicated his gang allegiance.
^^
The report also relied on a confidential informant who indicated Abrego Garcia was an active member of MS-13 under the moniker “Chele” as part of the Westerns clique. His attorneys have said in filings that the Westerns clique — according to the Justice Department and the Suffolk County District Attorney's Office — is based on Long Island, New York, a state where Abrego Garcia has never lived.
^^
According to the report, police took about four hours to respond to the incident, detain Abrego Garcia and the other men, and file the Gang Field Interview Sheet tying Abrego Garcia to MS-13, as his lawyers have said.
At the time, his attorneys said they tried to obtain more information on the allegations, including contacting the Prince George’s County Police detective who authored the report. Ivan Mendez, the former detective who made the report, was suspended from the police department days after Abrego Garcia's arrest.
^^
After Mendez pleaded guilty to misconduct, local prosecutors placed him on a "Do not call" list because they deemed him an unreliable witness, as USA TODAY found in court records.
eu.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2025/04/17/white-house-gang-domestic-violence-abrego-garcia/83142208007/

I used to work in South London with baby pretend ganstas. They were in reality, sweet young Black men, living in a really rough area. They were polite, affectionate, kind and respectful. Most of the staff were older Black women and they treated them (and by extension younger, white me) as mothers and grandmothers. They helped out, they had never been gang-involved (I have worked with gang-involved young people so I know the difference) but…

When they left the home, their hand went down their pants, they limpy-walked, they used language and actions and tried very hard to look as if they were gang-involved. It protected them. They were minnows trying to look like sharks to protect themselves. Old ladies would cross the road. :( But they weren’t gang members.

That is why you need due process. Yes, people may look and sound like gang members. They may have tattoos, gang signs, whatever. But unless you have evidence, you don’t lock them up. I see MAGAs thinking, ‘tattooed Latino?, who cares if he’s guilty?’ And that makes me very worried for America.

They came for the Latinos, I was not a Latino so I did not speak out…

Talkinpeace · 18/04/2025 16:49

I've seen reports of ICE agents boarding trains to challenge ALL passengers

who will stop ICE (who are clearly loving the power)

TulipTiptoer · 18/04/2025 16:51

Talkinpeace · 18/04/2025 16:49

I've seen reports of ICE agents boarding trains to challenge ALL passengers

who will stop ICE (who are clearly loving the power)

My god, it's like the Indiana Jones films, or The Great Escape... nazi officers demanding identity papers on trains.

TulipTiptoer · 18/04/2025 16:58

Just musing.... with all that is happening with Border Control, ICE, etc... how on earth are the World Cup and Olympics going to be held in the US without huge misgivings by many athletes?

World Cup 2026, Olympics 2028.

Talkinpeace · 18/04/2025 17:01

TulipTiptoer · 18/04/2025 16:58

Just musing.... with all that is happening with Border Control, ICE, etc... how on earth are the World Cup and Olympics going to be held in the US without huge misgivings by many athletes?

World Cup 2026, Olympics 2028.

AND with easy movement between the World Cup stadiums that are in three countries
https://www.olympics.com/en/news/fifa-world-cup-2026-full-list-stadiums-mexico-canada-usa

FIFA World Cup 2026: Full list of stadiums for the men's event in Canada, Mexico, and the United States

The 23rd edition of the FIFA World Cup will take place across Canada, Mexico, and the USA, including at Olympic venues. Here's the full list of the 16 stadiums hosting the world’s biggest football event in 2026.

https://www.olympics.com/en/news/fifa-world-cup-2026-full-list-stadiums-mexico-canada-usa

TulipTiptoer · 18/04/2025 17:06

My gosh, yes. I bet FIFA are having kittens.

MrsTerryPratchett · 18/04/2025 17:13

Talkinpeace · 18/04/2025 16:49

I've seen reports of ICE agents boarding trains to challenge ALL passengers

who will stop ICE (who are clearly loving the power)

Various uniform-wearing, civilian sections of American society have been power-hungry and militaristic for a while now. ICE, TSA, police, border control. They are CIVILIAN and seem to entirely forget that. The police with their tanks. ICE with their face masks and refusing to present ID. It’s terrifying.

Quasi-militaristic ‘civilian’ authorities are a feature of so many totalitarian regimes. If you want to avoid empowering the military in coups (that’s a knife that cuts both ways) empower civilian authorities to behave like military units.

Spandauer · 18/04/2025 17:13

TulipTiptoer · 18/04/2025 16:58

Just musing.... with all that is happening with Border Control, ICE, etc... how on earth are the World Cup and Olympics going to be held in the US without huge misgivings by many athletes?

World Cup 2026, Olympics 2028.

Questions that are definitely being asked by other interested parties. Some are asking for all US based games to be moved to Canada.
Mexico has had 3 presidents since the competition was awarded in 2018 but they're not in the business of detaining tourists as far as I know.

With ICE Out of Control, How Can the US Cohost the 2026 World Cup?
The country has proven itself incapable of not abducting and imprisoning people entering it—boycotting US matches avoids putting teams, their families, and fans in danger.
https://www.thenation.com/article/world/ice-fifa-world-cup-north-america/tnamp/

With ICE Out of Control, How Can the US Cohost the 2026 World Cup?

https://www.thenation.com/article/world/ice-fifa-world-cup-north-america/tnamp/

OP posts:
RosaMoline · 18/04/2025 17:23

..So is this September state visit confirmed, or is it just a load of BS uttered by DT from his ugly, flapping duck lips?
If he dares to come here, who’s going to be protesting? I am!
I hate that we have to pander this absolute prick and his colossal ego.

TulipTiptoer · 18/04/2025 17:25

RosaMoline · 18/04/2025 17:23

..So is this September state visit confirmed, or is it just a load of BS uttered by DT from his ugly, flapping duck lips?
If he dares to come here, who’s going to be protesting? I am!
I hate that we have to pander this absolute prick and his colossal ego.

I protested in London with my DD last time. It was huge march, and friendly with hilarious placards.

SerendipityJane · 18/04/2025 17:38

RosaMoline · 18/04/2025 17:23

..So is this September state visit confirmed, or is it just a load of BS uttered by DT from his ugly, flapping duck lips?
If he dares to come here, who’s going to be protesting? I am!
I hate that we have to pander this absolute prick and his colossal ego.

I can easily see the Whitehouse demanding the UK silence any protests on pain of tariff.

"For every placard I see, I'll add another 10% to your tariffs"

which would be an excuse for uniformed Reform thugs to "police" the procession. After, why buy a blackshirt if you're not going to wear it ?

Also I can see Team Trump insisting on meeting Stephen Yaxley-Lennon to make sure he's being treated in accordance with international law.

countrygirl99 · 18/04/2025 17:46

If he dpes come in September I hope it doesn't clash with my trip to Portugal. I would hate to miss that demo.

Talkinpeace · 18/04/2025 17:46

Also I can see Team Trump insisting on meeting Stephen Yaxley-Lennon to make sure he's being treated in accordance with international law.

I am WELL up for that.
Make it a closed and locked door meeting at Stephen's current residence

Eyesopenwideawake · 18/04/2025 17:47

It won't happen but wouldn't it be wonderful if no one turned up? No protesters, no fans, nothing. Just the police with their backs turned to him.

When the date is announced there should be a concerted effort to arrange events everywhere else....

Spandauer · 18/04/2025 17:58

Apparently WH posted this on X.

Has the US crossed the Rubicon? - Trump thread #142
OP posts:
logicisall · 18/04/2025 18:01

I'm hoping it's a fake post. If not, the WH has sunk to a new low and the US is being run by morons.

MrTiddlesTheCat · 18/04/2025 18:10

Eyesopenwideawake · 18/04/2025 17:47

It won't happen but wouldn't it be wonderful if no one turned up? No protesters, no fans, nothing. Just the police with their backs turned to him.

When the date is announced there should be a concerted effort to arrange events everywhere else....

Can we invite Obama to something else going on the same time. Then everyone can line the streets and cheer for him while Trump's motorcade evades the tumbleweed.

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