DS school refusal is driving me mad

[VerityUnreasonble]

I'll start this I guess by saying I'm not expecting any magic solutions, I'm mostly just having a moan.

DS is in year 7, we've had issues with him refusing school for the last 3 years. His attendance hovers around 85% which was much the same in year 6, it was slightly better in year 5.

DS has a diagnosis of ASD, he is academically very able, socially not so much but he's not upset by this.

Reasons he currently refuses to go in are:

He's tired (probably true - he is under sleep clinic and prescribed melatonin, also slightly defiencient in vitamin D and B12 which he is being treated for)

He doesn't feel well (sort of true - usually means he has a slight cold)

He has to go too much / there are too many days in a school year (this is his major reason at the moment, he doesn't want to go because he doesn't like it and feels he has to be there too often)

It starts too early (he will occasionally go in slightly later or for the afternoon)

There are various lessons / things he dislikes (sports/ presentations etc. - contributes to some days being worse than others)

Have tried both carrot and stick approach, the only thing he's really fussed about is access to his tech but even using that as a bribe / punishment isn't effective. Have tried reasoning and talking, he can explain very eloquently the reasons he should go, and even wants to go, he just still doesn't.

I'm missing bits of work, being late, having to rearrange things. I'm stressed about it all the time. School have requested a meeting in a couple of weeks to discuss "how to improve things" but honestly I have no idea.

I just have no idea how things are going to get better!

Do you honestly think removing screens makes a child's home life miserable? That's really interesting.
There are so many amazing lovely fun things you can do at home that aren't on screens?!
I didn't say make a child suffer?
What about drawing, playing board games, doing therapeutic arts and crafts, making music, building construction toys, playing outdoors, learning a new skills like woodworking?

@Sunnysideup4eva posters on this thread have explained very clearly how screens can be used to manage autistic meltdowns by providing a safe and contained mental space.

I don’t know how old your children are, but it is basically impossible to not use screens in secondary education, to do any kind of teenage socialising without them, to exist in a family without them. Do you separate an isolated child further by not letting them sit down to a family film or text a friend?

You talk as if it’s an interesting thought experiment where there are unlikely to be downsides, but there are a lot of psychological downsides to the overwhelmed tween/teen in question.

It's seriously dangerous and stupid. What do they think happens to a children longterm when they aren't allowed peace from their anxieties?

It doesn't make them go to school. It makes them want to leave this life.

learning a new skills like woodworking

Hahaha, oh, you must be on the wind up now.

The WFH parent gets on with their work, happy in the knowledge that their mentally overwhelmed teenager… is shut away in their bedroom with some bits of wood and some sharp tools. That’s your plan?

So wait, now parents (who are trying to hold on to their jobs) need to do lots of lovely activities with their child - and that is going to help them go back to school?
That seems a bit different to your earlier approach?

Do you honestly think that an anxious stressed teen would be helped by a bit of woodworking?

Or doing ‘fun?’ Like ‘playing outdoors’ or ‘building construction toys?’

Does your average 15 year old ‘play outdoors?’

Home education. Parenting class?? To make your teen ho to school. Bs of the century. The kid loathes being there, he loves his mother

Right so you replace the screens with building lego. Now what? How does that make them go back to school? If you believe their obsessive interest in screens is making them refuse school, then surely their obsessive interest in lego will make them refuse school too. Or how does it differ in your mind? Because anyone who knows anything about autism will know that a special interest is a special interest and its presence has nothing to do with why children don't go to school.

My heart goes out to you OP, you really do sound at the end of your tether. I thankfully haven’t experienced this with my
own children, but I’m a secondary teacher, and I would say that there is at least one school refuser in every class I teach this year.
Anyway, I think you’ve had some great advice re. eHCP, pursue that like a dog with a bone.
Strategies that have been put in place for kids I teach would be: time out cards, reduced timetable, scheduled time in the sensory room (usually during a lesson they are anxious about), modified uniform pass, 1-2-1 meeting at the front door each morning.
I had one girl a few years ago who would be dropped off in her jammies, her TA met her each morning with her clean uniform. For whatever reason that worked for her and enabled her to get in the building and to some lessons.
I Hope the school are supportive in your meeting. 85% is not ideal attendance but is also pretty bloody good when you lay out what you’re up against - they need to help him sustain that and should be bringing ideas and not just criticism. Best of luck xx

Because anyone who knows anything about autism will know that a special interest is a special interest and its presence has nothing to do with why children don't go to school

A-blinking-men

@Sunnysideup4eva

Your posts on here are the equivalent of me going onto a forum for parents of blind or physically disabled young people and trying to tell them where they are going wrong and how to parent their children. I would not do this of course as I would have no idea what it's like to parent these children.

Yet still you insist. It's baffling.

We don't need to be told that screens are addictive (but thanks for that), or that board games and arts and crafts are great for young people to do as alternative (yes whilst we are all working full time trying not to lose our jobs)

But we are talking about young people who have a particular set of challenges. You cannot possibly apply the same rules. You have shown time and time again on here that you have no idea and have not offered any constructive advice to the OP.

It's not called school refusal, it's barriers to attendance.

I know it's already been mentioned on this thread but I'd take the PDA approach and ignore the ingrained punishments mantra you usually get from people who don't have a clue.

You might need to consider EOTAS provision, not that it’s easy to come by. There’s a lady with a fb page and who wrote a book. Your child is not broken. She seems very knowledgeable.

For those who aren’t aware, carrots and sticks don’t really work for autistic people. That’s not how their brain works. They can’t be bribed.

Ask your school/La to see a copy of their ordinarily available provision. This is the list of reasonable adjustments that could potentially be made if they are needed. These would usually be tried before an EHC needs assessment to prove that these haven’t worked and that he needs support above and beyond what school can provide without additional money.

It’s definitely worth the exploring the EHCP. It could be that he needs full time support in his current school or he might be better in a specialist provision. Specialist provisions can be hard to come by and even more so for academically able children as most are geared towards those with a learning disability as well.

Maybe take a step back and ask the school for a reduced timetable so that he can slowly build up to a full timetable. So a couple of hours a day maybe for a while then build on it.

If you can find a counsellor with experience working with autistic young people then you might be able to make headway through that approach. A friend has done this, at a cost, but has gone from their child never getting into school to being there most days after a year or so of counselling.

Do you get DLA for him? If not then it’s worth applying, although you might need some guidance about how to fill it in to get the best outcome. The DLA could help cover any costs involved in getting him back to school
such as counselling.

I’m lucky with my autistic child as although they tell me they’re not massively keen on school, they don’t like taking days off, even when ill, as they need the structure and routine. We do have challenges though around completing school work at home such as revision and homework. School have provided opportunities for after school and lunchtime clubs to manage this.

Reach out to local send support groups, your local parent carer forum, possible local branch of the National autistic society. They often run workshops for parents on these kinds of difficulties or offer support groups to meet other parents in the same position.

You can't make them but you can keep them in house with absolutely nothing to do. No tv electronics etc. obviously provide meals but no snacks or treats. Boredom will make school much more interesting

Of course not. Take them home

You think autistic children struggle to go to school because home isn't boring enough?

Interesting….

Would you leave a self harming anxious adult who was to unwell to attend work with absolutely nothing to do? Where might that lead then?🙄

Or would you let them do their favourite stuff to calm them down? Because that’s what the professional recommmed.

@Mh67

So you are advising punishing a child for something they can't do?

Exactly
I'm foreign and even don't find your education that worth it, risking my child's well being.

There are people for whom love to their kids looks different rather than the absolute cruelty some of you describe as measures

I think it’s astonishing and a bit shocking how many people on this thread are advocating abusive behaviour: physically dragging our children to school, isolating them from their friends and punishing them for trauma by taking away entertainment for months at a time, leaving them home alone when distressed.
Thank fuck these people don’t have neurodivergent children, is all I can say.

This is maybe controversial but as a teacher, if his attendance is about 85% I would probably be doing what I could to keep it there, and slowly encourage more attendance if I could. 85% is not totally disastrous, he is there far more often than not and is familiar with the routines, and will have some idea of what is being covered in each lesson. Kids with 85% attendance in Y10 and 11 usually get GCSEs, maybe not as good as the ones they could have got with 95% attendance, but it's very likely he will come out of secondary school with something, and can hopefully progress on to a next step which suits him better (I appreciate this seems miles away when he is 11/12). It might even get better when he's able to pick options and avoid certain subjects? Also when he gets to 14, some college type environments might become available, which may be a workable option?

My feeling is that there is a cliff edge, I couldn't point to exactly where it is, probably somewhere between 70-50% attendance, or when students miss a full week, and then another, and so-on, where it becomes even more difficult to get back into school and the lack of attendance starts to mean they miss whole topics and don't know what's going on, or routines have changed and they aren't familiar with them, and going back in gets almost exponentially harder.

I'm probably also quite sympathetic because I have low iron and B12, and some days I feel just exhausted- yes, I'm "tired", but it takes all my will power (and multiple coffees) to get out of bed and into work, I'm not a 12yo who doesn't especially like school... If I'd felt like this as a teenager, my attendance would definitely have been around the 90% mark. As it is there are weekends where I have a 3 hour nap in the day to help me recover.

Perhaps controversial as well, but I'd stop forcing him out the house at the weekend- maybe he genuinely needs rest, not just because of the low B12, but some autistic people really need that quiet time to decompress? I would really try to get the deficiencies under control (it'll help his immune system too). I know it's the opposite to a lot of people on this thread, but I'd take off all pressure to do anything but school, and see if it makes any difference at all.

As an exercise, could you try asking him what his dream school would be like?

I really feel for you, our eldest is a similar age, with a diagnosis of ASD.
The first thing I agree with is it is physically impossible to make them do things they do not want to, thankfully we’ve not reached the same level about secondary school yet as your son but other things that we have deemed to be important ie swimming lessons he has refused to go to, they are too big to pick up (my son is bigger than me), you can’t drag them, bribing has never worked and whatever consequence you say will happen for not going/doing something doesn’t matter to them.
It’s almost like they back themselves into a corner and can’t see a way to get back. We had more issues with school at primary level because of the struggle socially, having to go every day and being tired.
I would ask the school in your meeting about flexible schooling, although it is more common in primary schools than secondary.
My sons school have been great, he has scheduled into his timetable regular breaks with the MH support team, he has a classroom break card that he just needs to show and he can go out of class for a few minutes to walk, stretch get some fresh air.
We don’t allow any screen time after 9pm, it all automatically turns off, and he has a savoury breakfast each morning because his consultant recommended stopping cereal etc as it gives a sugar high and then makes them crash mid morning.
No real words of wisdom but just wanted you to know that many of us know how exhausting negotiating what should be just ‘normal’ stuff can be x

Google 'mapping the landscape'. It's a well known tool used in Education to help a child share what they find difficult about school. And also highlights the positives. It's a good way to start making adjustments that might make school less challenging for them.

For all the struggling parents here.

My DD was initially diagnosed as ASD. 18 months later after school refusal, she was also diagnosed ADHD ( inattentive and very easy to miss)

ADHD medication was the game changer with burnout.

Wishing you all the best. Someone once said this to me ‘ND step off the path for a while but get back on later’

This was my mantra and prayer during my darkest hours. I also used to tell my dd this who was desperate for an education but to exhausted and anxious to go.

She got back on. It’s been bumpy and hard and the burnout keeps flaring up and down. She’s 1/2 way through her access course and excited about university. It’s still hard work, but we’re getting there.

🙏🙏🙏🤞🏻🤞🏻🤞🏻for you all

I have no experience of parenting an ASD child but it sounds like your son is full of good intentions and can say why he needs to go to school and even wants to go but just can’t. That’s probably why ‘punishments’ don’t work. He genuinely would if he could.
That said, I do think he needs to feel the natural consequences of not going to school. If he refuses to go on a particular day, you remind him that you are having to take the day off and may eventually lose your job if you keep missing work.
Also, what is he doing when not at school?
If he refuses to go he still needs to get out of bed, have structure to his day, undertake some form of learning whether it’s reading, homework he might have from a day he was in, revision, online learning, researching a subject. He shouldn’t be using the time to game or mess around on devices. Not a punishment but a recognition that these things could be reinforcing him not going and that’s not what folk get to do who aren’t going to school.
Others have alluded to or suggested this, but would a part time or more flexible timetable work for him?
Get him to make a list of all the things he finds difficult about school and see if those things can be worked on. Doesn’t like PE at school? Perhaps he could miss that and join a gym, go swimming, go running or cycling? Could he come home for lunch? Some kids struggle with the rough and tussle of social interaction outside classes. Maybe a combination of online learning and attending school for the things he likes would work, as long as this could be made to fit around your work.
Does he have a favourite teacher or trusted person at school who could support/mentor him?
Clearly he needs a clear plan.
Good luck and i hope you find something that works x