Could Trump take Greenland by force?

[Greenkindness]

I would like to think he couldn’t, but could he? Would he basically invade it if he couldn’t buy it? Would the UK defend it as part of NATO?

Could he also take the Panama Canal?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c4gzn48jwz2o

I’m hoping it’s all distraction politics but I also think Trump and his cronies are stupid and dangerous people.

I think he's in danger of losing allies and making the USA into a pariah country. Maybe he doesn't care but at some point in the future, the USA will needs its allies.

China also invaded Vietnam in 1979

Not to mention Korea during the Korean war, to save North Korea from total defeat

Given that Putin wants it too, I will be sitting on the sofa with a box of maltesers...

I’m interested in history, news and current affairs. I’m interested in US politics. If (big if) NATO got involved British troops could be involved. I appreciate it could be a distraction or disruption strategy to deflect away from other stuff, but I think it’s interesting to ruminate on these things. I like seeing other people’s viewpoints - I’m genuinely trying to find out, from people who might know more than me, what might happen.

Denmark retains control of foreign affairs and defence matters in Greenland. Denmark is a member of NATO.

Is there a protocol that applies if a NATO member invades a territory controlled militarily by another NATO member?

@Greenkindness there is very little liklihood that NATO troops would be involved here. The US is part of NATO, even though Trump is not a huge fan. Secondly, Trump isn't going to authorise a military invasion of Greenland!!!!! Thirdly, NATO is a political and military alliance for the peaceful resolution of disputes.

There are way too many hypotheticals here to be considering British troops fighting in defence of an unauthorised invasion of Greenland by the US.

No protocol and no precedent, although tensions between Greece and Turkey have raised the issue a few times.

Wrong. Tibet was never "absolutely" an independent country, as you state. It was Chinese since the 13th century, gaining autonomous status in 1720.

From the 19th century, foreign powers controlling China tried and eventually got Tibet recognised as a de facto independent entity from 1911 to 1951.

However, Tibet was never recognised as a legal country in any international organism.

There'll be no precedent if the US turns foe on allied countries in NATO.

We are entering a whole new world with Trump.

Canada if Trump gets his way apparently

Well…..

The US invasion of Grenada was pretty close but was outside the geographic area covered by the North Atlantic Treaty as per Article 6.

You are naive, not cynical. Do you really believe Trump is talking about using military force to get Canada and Greenland (allied countries) without powerful backing behind him?

Geopolitics are changing fast and frankly, I'm scared shitless.

The US invaded Korea and Vietnam, except their puppet governments apparently asked for it. Pretty similar to what's happened to Ukraine, except this time the US was the culprit in bringing the elected government down.

So was the intervention in Iraq. Their government didn't ask for it and the reason was weapons of mass destruction. Which was a lie.

Tell me what country, with something to gain, has not been military intervened since WWII. The list will be shorter than those that have been.

Obviously they didn't care about the Rwanda genocide or the Gaza one happening right now. Freedom and human rights are words the US use for populist slogans. They don't really give a fuck about human rights.

Greenland.
Canada.
Panama.
Elon wants to run Great Britain now.
8 days in.

I'd like to cancel my subscription to 2025. I've experienced the 7-day trial and I'm no longer interested.

Even with the USAs military might, they are not going to want to annex Canada, invade Greenland and seize control of the Panama Canal and all the mayhem that this would involve!

Trump loves being provocative. It is his thing. For all his tough talk last time, as far as I'm aware he didn't invade anywhere. Why would it be different this time?

I am genuinely appreciating all the insights, thanks. I just think it’s interesting.

Surely all this stuff is a way to drive more countries into the arms of China. "Be our ally and we will constantly threaten to invade you/try to overthrow your government. Ally with an adversary and we will be nice and respectful." Talk about perverse incentives.

(Not agreeing with your point that that may be the intention by the way).

China didn't invade Vietnam.

Vietnam asked for their help because their population, composed mostly of poor farmers, had to face the powerful might of a superpower investing billions in the war.

Vietnam suffered unbelievable hardship because the US expansion wanted control of the peninsula. They, and allies, placed a trade embargo to Vietnam until 1993, 20 years after the end of war.

Explain to me how Vietnam, a small country of mostly farmers, posed a security risk to the US, and why the US committed such atrocities against their civilian population.

WHY?

Trump doesn't seem to be talking about tariffs as much at present. Perhaps someone in his circle with half a brain has explained the likely outcome for the average US citizen, if massive tariffs were levied amongst so many countries. Oh., and he has also threatened the EU if they don't start buying more oil and gas from the US.

Trump threatens EU

So the current tally is; Tarriffs - Mexico, Canada, China, EU. Invasion; Canada, Mexico, Greenland, Panama Canal.

Trump's erratic behaviour is not news to any of these nations or blocs. There have been moves going on for years now to develop other trade deals, and treaties, that involve leaving the US out in the cold. The more protectionist the US becomes, ultimately the further behind they will be left from a global perspective.

The Chiefs of Staff. They tend to be very conservative with a small c . Attacking another member of NATO is a non starter surely.

China invaded Vietnam in 1979, after Vietnam invaded Cambodia to topple the China-backed (and genocidal) Khmer Rouge. The US was long gone by then.

China's support of North Vietnam during the US war is a different matter.

I have to say, it worries me that so many (British?) MNers these days are repeating Chinese and Russian narratives (eg re Ukraine and Tibet on this thread).

It's possible to condemn American imperialism and genocide without pretending that countries like Russis and China are not also guilty of both.

@Alondra when do you think Vietnam asked China for their "help"? My understanding is that the Chinese leader Deng, thought Vietnam was both ungrateful and potentially hostile after accepting Soviet aid and after Vietnam had invaded Cambodia in 1978. China invaded in 1979.

Except Trump has already flagged he wants the US to leave NATO unless countries commit 5% of their GDP to NATO defence. Something he knows is unrealistic. But this is not all.

He wants the US to control NATO while European forces are being majorly deployed, otherwise he'd leave those European countries he thinks of 'deadbeats' to the Russians to do whatever the hell they want with them (textually in his own words).

We are a looking at a pariah state, we've read about in history but never deal with this kind of politics in our lifetime.

Trump is a despot. A dictator. He doesn't follow rules, and neither his backers. We've gone through the same political upheaval scenario many times in history. The last time, in the 1930s in Europe.

@Alondra but we already have a Trump presidency to reflect on. He did a lot of aggressive grand-standing last time but remarkably little in terms of action. He neither a despot nor a dictator and doesn't hold absolute power, as he was elected and the US is still a democracy.

I'm not sure you would technically invade it.

It's a barren freezing wasteland mostly. The population there is not huge. You could probably take it with an army of about 6 people.

The political ramifications of annexing it are far more significant than the military ones.