Thread 14 Starmer - The Starmeristas Strike Back

[DuncinToffee]

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Quite right. Without reversing some of the Brexit harms we are going to struggle to get people investing in the UK.

They’ve tied themselves into a right knot on the not increasing taxes thing too. Pretty daft to have increased a tax that makes employing people more expensive rather than just increasing employee NI and income tax. UK corporation tax is comparatively low IIRC so there may have been room there.
If they correct it now it’s going to look like a u-turn. (Well it won’t look like one, it’ll be one.)

I don’t think reversing it would be on the cards. It would have made more sense to reverse the Tories’ unaffordable and unfunded NI cut that they left as an elephant trap. That might happen now.

The EU/UK FTA is up for re negotiation this year, there is an opportunity to reverse changes.

I think reversing the NI cut, whilst it should happen, cannot, it would be political suicide for Labour.

It was very clever of Hunt to do this, he knew it would put the UK in dire straights but did it anyway because he wanted Labour to carry the can... tories, inc Stewart, are always sly... the cut is costing the Govt £10 billion each and every year.

Reversing Brexit is a pipedream up there with Trussonomics.

However pivoting towards one of the less extreme versions that were on offer (who remembers the ladder ?) is probably more realistic. Especially as (with a ladder) it could be incremental.

As Brexiteers were too fucking thick to envisage, the EU of 2025 is not the EU of 2016 (in the same way the UK of 2016 is not the UK of 2025). A fuck of a lot has happened which means there will be places where changes can be made. If you look for them. It's very easy to find nothing if you aren't looking.

I don’t think anything - or not much - would be political suicide at this stage of the parliamentary cycle. If the economy and NHS are in better shape in 2028 there will be a lot of forgiveness for anything they do now. Starmer could certainly save political face with a reshuffle and a new chancellor.

I always thought the DM was right wing, interesting if they have changed sides.

The Mirror and The Sun as far back as I remember have always been the opposite to each other. In the run up to the election the Sun changed from Tory to Labour because they always like to support who they know is likely to win. However I have noticed that whereas in the past they have always been over the top in the praise for their supporting party, they seem to be quite critical of Labour at times.

Starmer could implement every election promise in the Tory manifesto and Tory supporters would be up in arms in horror.

Just as on immigration, MN posters, well poster, says deporting 200 migrants to Rwanda is a deterrent but deporting 14,000 in 6 months isn't....

I know but he doesn’t have to impress dyed in the wool Tory/Remain voters, just retain and build on the votes from July. The one thing they really do have to do better is their comms - those 14,000 deportations are a very well kept secret, they should be shouting that news from the rooftops.

Nothing wrong with being critical.

Questions should be asked regardless of who is in government, they should, like Sunak once said, demonstrate integrity, professionalism and accountability at every level’.

The attacks on Reeves however started before she was even appointed.

I feel a bit bad for them on comms. Everytime they are all set to take back control of the narrative something big blows them out of the water. eg January was supposed to be all about Starmer's exciting plans for the NHS and instead it is about whether or not Jess Phillips is a rape genocide apologist....

I wasn’t suggesting reversing Brexit just some of the harms. There are some ways those can be mitigated by pivoting to a less extreme version.

Nobody is going to chose to invest in the U.K. if it’s going to cost them more time and money to do stuff here than it is to do the same thing situated in the EU. At least getting rid of some of the red tape would be a start.

Labour's approach to Brexit annoys the hell out of me, they seem so scared of the brexiteers who are now selling the country the US

EU youth mobility could be an easy first step

Nothing wrong with a U turn though. One of the worst things about modern politics is this idea that saying ‘circumstances have changed so I’ve changed me mind’, or, ‘well that idea isn’t working so let’s try something else’ is perceived as weak. It’s not. It’s sensible.

On comms I think the also have the problem that nobody much 8n the media wants to carry a ‘Labour do brilliant thing’ story so it’s hard to shout anything from the rooftops. Not sure what the answer to that is.

I don’t. It’s been absolutely woeful from the word go. They clearly haven’t got anyone who knows what they’re doing and some of it - like that awful TikTok video - is actually damaging. If I were Starmer I’d be offering Campbell six months’ consultancy to create a plan and recruit a crack team to implement it.

Our local Labour MP posted about them last week to tumbleweed. In the same community FB group that froths with "stories" about immigrants getting free houses for their dogs.

You won't change peoples perceptions with facts. You need a very very heavy hammer and their balls beneath it. Then they might suddenly accept they may have been hasty.

I unfortunately listened to Trevor Phillips this morning, much of it was about how borrowing costs have soared under Reeves....

He then went onto suggest we are heading for some sort of IMF 70s style bail out...

FFS, as much as Gilt yields have risen, its around 0.5% from 4.3% to 4.8% and its on money borrowed now, not the 100s of billions the Tories borrowed.

The very same media said nothing when yields went from 1.8% to 4.5%...

Its also on par with many other countries Bond yield increases.... but the media will report it as if we are Greece.

Its as if the media want Labour to fail.... its also more than comms, its policy... nothing on dentistry and social care will have to wait until 2028......

I think the mainstream media do want this government to fail. God alone knows why because surely it would be better for everyone if they didn’t? But there are ways to get their messages out and they’re just not doing it. I’m beyond frustrated with them. I’ll shut up now.

Didn't Alistair Campbell have a big falling out with the Labour party over Corbyn - can't remember which election it was ?2016/9 he was supporting the the Lib Dems??

Maybe mis-remembering it

Someone of his stature would be great because atm it's relentless

I refer you - and all - to looking at how Caesar came to power and what he did to bring it about. Civil war was just the price of doing business.

Both the right of centre dismissal of history and the left of centre dismissal of elitism have prevented the UK from maintaining enough people who would have spotted what was going on a mile off.

And we know what happens to people who don't learn from history, don't we ?

He was kicked out for announcing he was going to vote Libdem. I think he’s been forgiven now. I reckon he’d walk back into Downing Street for a few months in a heartbeat if he was invited.

Labour hasn't actually announced anything about disability benefits, has it? I am reading a lot of stuff that is unsubstantiated.

Meanwhile, MNHQ thinks this sort of rhetoric is fine and dandy.

Eta: I know they are/ may be doing something around ESA, but nothing has been announced about PIP, has it.

It's easier to hide shit in muddy water.

Just saying.

And before Caesar Sulla!

It’s just the latest episode of scaremongering @PandoraSox. And if there is a change to benefits all the people currently frothing about “benefit scroungers” will suddenly be up in arms about how cruel it is.