Christmas market attack in Germany tonight😥 article linked

[Treetops11]

https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/dec/20/germany-christmas-market-madgeburg
I have attended many Christmas markets over the years. They are so crowded especially at the moment as German children finished school for the Christmas holidays. Frightening, my prayers are with all the victim's 🙏

This has been such a strange thread.
In irA time they had a modus operandi, call and warn :bomb.

If we wee in irA times and someone called and warned and bombed you surely wouldn't get posters saying... Well it wasn't ira was it?
How do you know blah blah.

How do you think that the authorities knew who planted a bomb during those times?

We do live in different times, especially with lone wolf actors.

Do you think you know the political motivations of this individual?

@cakeorwine it's the tone and sort of moral superiority of some posters.

Everything has screamed classic isis but the profile is odd, as I said right at the beginning of the thread, older, 50, doctor etc.

I didn't jump on the isis extreme Islam train myself. However I don't think I came across as morally superior and rude to people who did.

It's got every hall mark of an extremist attack nice 80 plus killed the bataclan, 9/11 etc etc. All these heinous pointless atrocities by Islam extremist including the Berlin market?

It's not a stretch to think people tired scared and worn out by this new and totally pointless threat may think, car ramming a packed Christmas Market.... Islam extremist??,

@cakeorwine go back and forensically read through my posts if you have the time.

I find it deeply repgunant how some posters have held this barely concealed contempt
I really do.

I also said pretty early on the man has been said to be fragile, mentally ill, paranoid and possibly pyscotic rambling.

The bottom line is he is an asylum seeker who had been flagged up by people including Saudis and nothing was done and now those poor people are killed and had life robbed from them.

I also thought about an islamic attack at first. Turns out I was wrong and doubling down on it won't change that. I'll probably examine my bias in the future.

@katter yes, but don't be too hard on yourself. WE'VE had the most awful attacks in recent years it's not surprising at all that your thoughts are here we go again.
Like I said if we were in IRA times it wouldn't be surprising would it

islam extremist or anti-islam extremist he should never have been allowed in Germany. You reap what you sow. Our elites have forced mass immigration on us against our will. They lied to us that immigrants would fund the national health and take care of older people. We now know that low-skill immigrants from poor countries are a net drain on the economy and degrade the quality of life. Time to have a conversation on how to start making things better. Onwards and upwards.

https://www.npr.org/2022/09/11/1122286865/nigeria-is-banning-foreign-actors-and-models-from-its-ads-as-of-oct-1

The one thing I've learnt is not to jump to conclusions.

Unfortunately that's what people do, they retweet misinformation and this only reinforces people's prejudices towards others and creates more division. People are so prone to falling for information that confirms their own viewpoint.

And we live in a world where it is so easy to spread misinformation and to have your own views reinforced.

He wasn't a low skilled immigrant and not a drain on the economy.
He worked as a psychiatrist with convicted criminals, which I think has probably a positive effect on society. Unless you don't believe in rehabilitation. We also don't know if he was already radicalized in Saudi Arabia.
If he was, the authorities really fucked up.
If he wasn't an arabic speaking doctor would certainly be an asset, don't you think?

It's not hate against any race or religion.
This is another horrific atrocity caused by an individual who was given asylum & shelter in a country which he repaid by murdering & maiming hundred of his new countries citizens.
Why do these individuals turn on the very country who has taken them in . They say their lives are at risk in their home countries, they get given refuge then attack & murder the citizens of their new country. They are committong the very crimes they are supposed to be escaping from..

katter. you really said the murderer had a positive effect on society? Maybe just read your post over a few times and think of the hundreds of Germans in grief and despair over this Christmas nightmare.

You may not hate, but many people do, and will pick up on any opportunity to justify or exercise that hate. So, it's important to be as accurate as possible in what we say: for example, it is relevant that this man has consistently and publicly stated that he is not Muslim, and that he has expressed anti-Muslim views, because as we've seen, many people assumed he was Muslim and that this was related to faith-based extremism. Incorrect assertions do matter. They have real life consequences for people.

Omg thank you for sharing this. I have been reading similar online tonight.
At the end of the day he is yet another asylum seeker who turned on the vulnerable, innocent civilians who welcomed him to their country. Shame on him & all the other evil ones gone before him carrying out such atrocities against the country that gave them refuge. Enough.

I said the job he did had a positive effect on society. Or do you think trying to rehabilitate criminals is wrong?
If you think I am defending the attack you clearly haven't read this thread.
And I am one of those germans. I just don't believe sowing further discontent and hatred against migrants is the way to go.

If we knew his motives, we could maybe answer that.

I can think of some terrorist attacks committed by people who were born in a country and grew to hate the Government of that country so much that they decided to carry out acts of terror.

It's not beyond imagination to think that even people who are given refuge in a country can commit an act of terror against that very country if they can justify it to themselves.

All sorts of reasons have been speculated on here. We don't know what his reasons were - it could be self radicalisation - but that's speculation, and I would guess that even people who were given refuge here can still have the same reasoning that causes people who were born in a country to carry out an act of terror.

Do you really think that's what she said?
Or do you think it's more likely she was talking about his job as a psychiatrist?

We don't need to speculate about his reasons. He was obviously mentally ill. We have to consider if it is a good thing to have few restrictions on entry for people who are literally and as proven in many court cases: dangerous, criminal, genocidal, misogynist, low intelligence, prone to grooming, raping, child-abuse, and cost taxpayers more than they contribute. That is literally and exactly the policy of the UK government for the last 30 years. Is anyone allowed to say it is not a good idea, and maybe we should not become a minority in our own country or do we just get arrested for pointing it out?

He was a psychiatrist who rehabilitated criminals so yes, he would have done a great deal of good. He also went off the rails in spectacular fashion. Most rational human beings know that life isn't simple.

As for the NHS and the care system - you think they can cope without immigrants?

Let me guess - Reform voter, right?

Is there actual evidence that he was mentally ill to the extent that it would mean he lacked responsibility for his actions or would be considered a mitigating factor in a court?

No . So it's ridiculous saying he supported one group. His other predecessors who carried out atrocities are linked to ISIS.
At the end of the day they all have the common denominator of being given shelter & asylum in a country who protected them in their time in need, they repaid their new country & it's citizens by carrying out grave terror attacks murdering & injuring the very ones who welcomed them

They weren't his ideological predecessors then. They were a different type of scum.

Well he did write about supporting the AFD, which is an extremely right wing political party.
Just because he used methods used by islamic terrorists in the past doesn't make him one.

i think the NHS would do just fine without immigrants. Earlier we posted a lot of links showing immigrants from developing countries are net drains on the economy, receive a lot more benefits than they contribute, cost taxpayers a lot of money. It is obvious that if we had fewer of immigrants from developing countries we would be better off financially. Not to mention the shock and alienation people feel when parts of the country they loved and grew up in are transformed to parts of Pakistan or Somalia. I am sure people in Somalia and Pakistan would resent if large parts of their country was taken over by foreigners who didn't understand them and disliked them.

As a female I no longer feel safe in my designated personal female spaces now that men can infiltrate them whenever they feel like it by saying they "feel" like a women .