My sons behaviour 🫤

[MyThreeLittleLoves]

Hello

It has taken me a lot to post of here, so please be kind and no negative comments.

I am looking for some advice on how to tackle my 8 year old sons behaviour.

In a nutshell he is a very loving kind and caring boy. However he doesn’t like the word “NO”

Let’s take this afternoon for example, after I collected him and my soon to be three year old son from school and nursery, I needed to go and get a few things from the supermarket/department store.

He asked if he could have some new drawing pens and paper, now I would usually buy them for him, but I am trying my best to get out of the habit of always saying yes to both boys.

So this afternoon, I had the courage to tell him that he couldn’t have them, bearing in mind he has lots at home, and we are coming up to Christmas, in which that could be another gift for him.

My other son also picked up something, I also told him no, he accepted that he wasn’t going to take it home with him today and caused no fuss.

My 8 year old started to sulk, when we got to the checkout I asked him to help me put the shopping on the conveyor belt, as he usually likes to help me.

He picked up the loaf of bread and threw it, and it nearly hit the lady working on the check-out, I immediately apologised to her and she gave me a warm smile, then I turned to him and said “No, we are not going to do this, how dare you behave like this in public?” thinking back, I shouldn’t have said anything.

He then replied “Shut up, you f**!ing bitch” and those in front and behind me and heard this, I ignored him to not escalate the matter further. Once I paid for and packed my shopping, I just wanted to get out of there, but he thought it was be great to walk very slowly behind me.

Then refused to get into the car, but eventually did. I told him I’m not happy with how he behaved in the supermarket and how dare him speak to me like that, and call me that and I will be telling dad when we get home. His words were “I literally don’t care, you can tell him what you want, I wish I had a better mum than you”

All this because I didn’t buy him then pen and paper, my husband and I make sure to give the boys to best life, which includes private education, holidays each half term (Lapland & DisneyLand in the next few weeks, then Jamaica after Christmas and a three day ski trip then back to school) nice days out and experiences and of course lots of love and cuddles.

I just don’t understand why my son acts like this, when we got home he showered and went to sleep.

Please can I have help/advice on how to tackle this, because it really upsets me. And every time this happens I have to open a bottle of wine, then I will drink it all then feel guilty that I’ve drunk it all to myself and I find myself crying, then to make myself feel better I open another bottle, it’s just a vicious cycle. I’m disappointed in myself as I’ve been doing so well regarding “drinking”

I would try dealing with it there and then, ignore everyone around you, and tell him off. Then you're not keeping him awake, he knows you won't say anything in the shop. An 8 year old doesn't know he has such nice holidays and a private education - it's means nothing to him - he knows no different - it's not relevant to this. Stop being scared of him, deal with the situations. I am the same, just want them happy don't want to cause any upset but it doesn't get you anywhere. Definitely no iPad for a while.

I certainly wouldn't forget about it overnight. It would be the first thing I spoke to him about the next morning. He would have all of the things he enjoys taken away for a considerable time and left in NO DOUBT that if he ever repeats this behaviour the consequences will be severe. You need to deal with this robustly to avoid your life turning into a nightmare and your younger child will likely follow his example

I am also the teacher that gets called the same on a daily basis in some cases. It is secondary. See where it starts??

Oh OP. Sounds really tough.

What time does school finish? Is it unusually late? It’s not normal for an 8 year old to be so exhausted after school they can’t even manage tea and can do nothing but sleep. His sleep/eating pattern sounds awful to be honest, especially if he is also regularly waking up to eat later on at night. It doesn’t excuse his behaviour but I am not surprised he is on a short fuse if he’s chronically hungry and exhausted.

He absolutely cannot swear at you like that. You need to explore where he learnt that and what he thinks he is achieving by swearing. That is the main thing from your OP that needs tackling.

More generally, he also needs to practice being disappointed. If he has always had everything he has ever wanted I’m not surprised he lost it tonight. He’s never had to handle disappointment before. I think you need to talk to him about that as well - you need to stress to him it’s fine to be disappointed but there are ways to show that disappointment and throwing things and swearing is not it.

It doesn’t make sense what has happened since. He just goes to bed when he feels like it, then wakes up for dinner and expects you to make something I assume? What time does he go back to bed for the night?!

I'm not trying to be cruel, but is it possible he takes himself off to bed after one of these outbursts because he knows your response will be to get drunk and cry? You'd be surprised how much children know about what happens when we think they're not looking. Parents drinking to excess is very frightening and destabilising for children.

Loving, kind and caring 8 year olds don't tell their mothers to 'shut up you fucking bitch' when they don't get something they want or are told 'no'.

Suspect your 8 year old is spoiled rotten, based on your own OP, and is only 'nice' when he's getting everything he wants. Hence your fear of saying 'no'. When he's only 8.

He's going to be bigger than you someday. And stronger. Suggest you crack down and nip this attitude, sense of entitlement and behaviour now rather than duck and hide from it out of fear of 'what people will think' if you don't pull him up Every Single Time he behaves like this.

Willy wonder choc factory shows you the one with her dad that wanted the golden goose. You guys should watch that together
He is very spoilt maybe don't do anything as much as you do
Maybe show him kids that are starving in Africa and how they would love to be able to have what he has

First off threatening him with his dad is one of the worst things to do. From making you look ineffectual to making dad the “ bad guy” ( in son’s eyes ) it has no good points.
It’s boot camp time. Get two jars, one for each child, good behaviour gets a token, poor behaviour gets nothing ( but do not remove any earned) On Saturday tokens earn a treat. You work out the exchange rate eg 4 tokens = small chocolate bar. 10= toy. Don’t make it too easy or too hard to succeed.

Any poor behaviour is met with just a disappointed look, shake of the head and “ you’ve let yourself down” . it sounds mild but can have surprising results. I used to teach kids that threw the furniture, swore, spat…. and this reined them in quicker than anything. It’s worth trying for a couple of weeks ( ignore any I don’t care attitude— they do care just don’t want to show it)
It’s also far less stressful for you. I’d have been a shredded wreck if I’d shouted a few dozen times a day, my sad, disappointed look was much more effective.

His going to bed is avoidance. I’d leave that as it is for now as he won’t get his reward. Make sure your other son gets his reward in the jar but don’t over praise him in front of older son as this builds resentment. It’s a fine balance but make sure he knows his good behaviour is great. Obviously if older son behaves and gets his token you tell him what it’s for.

if none of this works then we move on to boot camp #2.

@TallNeckedGiraffe I am going to be completely honest with you, I am a very emotional person, the least little thing can stress me out. It got to a stage where my husband takes no notice of the drinking and crying, although he has tried to help me in the past. Now he says “You’re never going to stop drinking wine, if you really wanted to you could do it”
@blankittyblank I was a very spoilt child myself, but it never got to the stage where I was swearing and misbehaving in public. I think this is God paying me back.
@TheCatterall I do most of the parenting, I recently went away for 3 days for my birthday, I left two of the boys with him, and they did misbehave for him once, he actually asked me how I deal with it regularly, I am used to it, He does sometimes take the kids to and from school/nursery, stay home with our 9 month old. But he never sees the boys at there worst because they behave when he is around.

I'm so sorry, that's really awful when you're trying your best and being very generous with your time and resources.

I think there have to be consequences and I also think both parents must be on the same page regarding this. I would say don't accidentally punish both boys because of the actions of one. Is he in a boys school? Maybe the culture is poisonous, move him to a kinder school?

I certainly don't wish you to feel pressure to reply. You have enough on your plate in real life which should be your priority

My DD8 is spoilt but there are consequences for bratty behaviour. Tablet gets locked down for at least 2 days. Pocket money gets reduced. No sweet treats either. I find the nest method for when she has a tantrum is to ignore until she has calmed down. I started giving her pocket money as I was also in tje habit of buying her stuff from the shops, she now gets £10 a week to spend and this is is her chores are done. Don't be afraid of your own child and follow through on any consequences

What’s with the im telling dad when we home line. You’re his parent parent him.

I would have left too!

https://www.katherineelizabeth.co.uk - If you don’t mind throwing some money at the situation…

she’s remarkable, has been to three or four of my friends houses, as well as ours. Truly transformative parent coaching. It’s a bit spenny - and feels a bit invasive while she’s with you - but I am a MUCH better leader of my little tribe than I was previously. Would do it again in a heartbeat.

My eldest never threw or swore at me in public - but I felt really impotent in the face of their meltdowns. I feel so much more confident managing it now - and as a consequence they are less common and much shorter lived when they happen. We have a happier, calmer home.

You were in the supermarket, of course he didn’t go straight to sleep 🤔

I have an eight year old. I cannot tell you how shocking I find this. He would literally never dare. And no I haven’t ever slapped him. So I would have stopped the shop right there, said sorry to the checkout woman and walked right out with him, gone home and given him a proper talking to. And if he dared to say you are a bad mum, I would say I didn’t ask for your opinions on my parenting, you absolutely do not disrespect me with that language. And I would be a little distant for the next hour or so indicating that I wasn’t all ready to play nice.

And he’s not a toddler so I would start saying no a LOT more. Why are you scared of him? He’s your son. He’s not your friend. Your job is not to make him happy all the time- it’s to ensure that he grows up with the right values and manners.

And saying, well I am emotional and so I cry (and drink) sounds a little like a cop out. We all have different personalities but it seems like you are using your sensitive nature to say that you don’t need to establish much much much stricter boundaries.

Lapland & DisneyLand in the next few weeks, then Jamaica after Christmas and a three day ski trip then back to school

Lapland, Disneyland, Jamaica and a ski trip all in the next few weeks? Holy moly. Even Mariah Carey would think that's excessive.

If there's no consequences for his behaviour, it'll just keep happening.
Those holidays are mad!
Wine won't fix this and it sounds like you know that.

These two things don't match:

"It got to a stage where my husband takes no notice of the drinking and crying, although he has tried to help me in the past. Now he says “You’re never going to stop drinking wine, if you really wanted to you could do it”"

And

My husband and I have a good relationship, he has never raised his voice to me let alone sworn or verbally abused me.

He takes no notice of the drinking and crying, is unsupportive of your parenting (slap your child?!), unsupportive of your struggles with alcohol, and seems to be avoiding childcare. What does a good relationship look like to you? Because this sounds like a bad one to me. If you had a daughter, would you like her to have a husband like yours?

@VivaVivaa 8.30-3.15pm, he does not go to sleep straight after school every single day. I think he was more tired today as we were out after school. I try my best to keep up awake, but he is usually showered and asleep by 7.30.

@Toastedpickle ^^ sorry if I confused you in my last post.

Can you ask the school for some parenting resources? Our primary ran some parenting classes. If not, see if you can find some videos online.

There must MUST be some consequences for his actions. Not just threats and pleading.

You definitely need to toughen up. Imagine what he’ll be like at 14 when he’s bigger than you!

Lovely, you've been honest and brave coming on here to talk about this. Mumsnet isn't always kind. Take the useful posts (especially the straight-talking but kindly ones, of which there are quite a few) and ignore the ones who just want to put the boot in.

Unfortunately the root of this behaviour is that your child needs better boundaries. Children need love, time from their parents, and good boundaries. The love is very clearly there, and the time, but the boundaries need a lot of work, and they need it now. The longer it goes on the worse it will get.

You need to take responsibility and not jsut say 'I'm going to tell your Dad'. (That in itself sounds rather childish I'm afraid)

I think you need to work out for yourself exactly what behaviour you will accept and what behaviour you won't. You need to talk to him about it and warn him that depending on what the situation is, he either gets one warning or straight to consequences - removal of screens.

You need to be able to bring yourself to say No to him, lovely, and to hold the boundaries. Teaching him that he can have anything he wants and that he can be abusive if he doesn't get it is extremely unkind to him.

I'm going to put it harshly; you need to take some responsibility here or you will let your children down. Pampering his feelings at the price of his greater wellbeing is a mistaken kindness. His good heart won't last long if he learns that what he wants is more important than respecting others.

Also for your own sake ... stop drinking. Alcohol is a depressant and will only make things worse.

I'm afraid you have to buckle up here. It's going to be hard, but it's necessary. Also, maybe talk to a (good and non-judgemental) friend whose parenting you respect and who has lovely kids who can take No for an answer.