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I can't cope with depressed brother being so reliant on me. Feel like a bitch for saying that.

789 replies

inigomontoyahwillcox · 02/12/2024 05:47

I'm so sorry - this going to be so long - but I need to get this out. I'm up with this awful cough/chest infection which makes it impossible to lie down and sleep. Been ill since last Tuesday. Have had virtually no sleep since then. Pretty sure a lot of you will think I'm a heartless cow, but I'm getting to my wits end.

Context. My brother (quite significantly older than me) has suffered from depression since he was a teen. He has been on antidepressants since then, except for a couple of occasions when he's taken himself off them for one reason or another, which have ended up in disaster. He lives about 2.5 hours away from me.

For some years now he has been spending more and more time at my house with my DH, DD and I. He lives alone and came to stay with us during lock down, and has often come to stay with us, sometimes for weeks, off and on since then when he's feeling low or had a crappy couple of weeks (e.g. work stress). I've always said to him of course he can come, how can I not, but he's often then stayed and stayed, prolonging his stay without discussing it with me - just declaring he's not going to go home for another week at the end of his planned stay.

He has a fantastic job in the civil service, but has had lot and lots of absences for various ailments over the past couple of years and they are understandably getting serious about his attendance. He seems to think this is very unfair and how they just don't understand. I've tried gently - but seriously - to explain that you can indeed be dismissed for repeated or lengthy absences.

In May this year he started getting some odd physical symptoms - balance issues/vertigo mainly (other very vague things like feeling cold, and out of it) - I rushed down there to him when this initially happened as he took himself to hospital thinking he was having a stroke. Ultimately anything serious was ruled out and after taking him to a few appointments for some further checks I drove him back to mine to stay. He decided that these symptoms were due to his antidepressant (that he'd been on for 15 years), so agreed with his GP to reduce his dose to an incredibly small one (questionable that it was even therapeutic anymore - it was 1/4 of the starting dose, he had been on double the starting dose for 15 years). His physical symptoms did clear up eventually - he put this down to this reduction in his antidepressants - I wasn't so convinced. I also voiced my concern that he was now effectively not on antidepressants and we all know how that had ended up in the past and that he needed to push to try another antidepressant if he didn't want to go back to his old one.

He eventually went back home and to work, and was there for a few months until he started experiencing stomach issues, now diagnosed as IBS (which I know is not fun - I've had it for years myself) and yet again took himself off work. He was working with his GP and a dietician and put on the FODMAP diet which he's still on. Again, he came to ours for a few weeks. His work were getting very ancy by this time and he started to do some hours remotely from ours as he had no choice. Eventually he went home again, he was home for a week only then for his depression to increase so I told him to get an emergency appointment with his GP who told him to double his dose last week. Well all hell broke loose (assuming side effects of increasing the dose). I've been ill for a couple of months now with all these bloody relentless viruses (also been very anemic for a lot longer and recently had a couple of infusions and currently undergoing tests to find out why - so you can imagine how rough I've been feeling), but last Tuesday I came down with proper flu (raging temp etc.) and have been in bed since and have been mainly off work (doing work when needed from bed). I never take time off work, honestly have to be at deaths door - have subsequently developed a chest infection and am on antibiotics. Got a call from my brother at 5:30am on Wednesday with him feeling awful saying I needed to drive down and collect him, after explaining I couldn't as I was ill asked to speak to DH and asked him to go. I said to DH that he couldn't, he had work plus he was helping me out with a work event in the evening which I obviously couldn't attend any more but he still needed to arrange some stuff and be there for a short while. I put my foot down and said he had to either drive, get the train or wait until we could drive to him and if he was in crisis to call his local crisis team immediately. He eventually said he would drive as he couldn't fit all the stuff he wanted to bring in a backpack so the train was out (so he'd get obviously decided at that point he was coming for a while).

Since he's been with us he has been waking me up every morning at silly-o'clock (e.g. 5-6), as he's been experiencing massive anxiety. I've been woken up three times now to him standing in our bedroom crying and saying he can't cope. I am getting about 2 hours of sleep per night due to this chest infection anyway, and have usually only just dropped off when he's waking me up. At this rate I'm never going to get better. DH had to stop him coming into our bedroom the other day when I had eventually managed to doze off. Anyway, called the local out of hours crisis team yesterday morning and sat with him whilst he spoke to them, they're seeing him this morning and have told him to register as a temporary patient at my local GP and they are hopefully going to make a plan going forward - e.g. moving to a new antidepressant (I hope). On the phone he said to them he was going to stay with me indefinitely (no discussion with me) and can't see himself doing his job for some months.

In the past when he's had a crisis like this he's decamped to our parents who look after him for months whilst he recovers and he finds a new job - but he's decided that he finds it too stressful to stay with them (they're getting on now as well). I can see what is going to happen. He is going to loose his job, loose his rented flat as a result and have nowhere to live but here with us. So, unemployed, living with us indefinitely. And what choice do I have?

It's really stressful when he stays with us - just the whole dynamic/routine of the household goes out the window. He has always been single and as a result his life revolves around himself, he spreads himself and his things around the house, and changes/moves/breaks thing (little things, but they all add up) and gets argumentative when I ask him not to do something. My home just doesn't feel like my home anymore; I can't spend evenings chilling out lying on the sofa in front of the telly with DH, as we often do, he's often lying on the sofa watching TV himself, he smokes although takes himself outside but his clothes smell of smoke. He is in our small spare room (well, he's on the sofa tonight for some reason) which we had just recently decked out as DD's study as her bedroom isn't really big enough for a desk; she's finishing her mocks tomorrow and has her GCSEs in May - she has ADHD and it's been incredibly challenging for her academically, but we'd really turned a corner recently and she's determined to get into 6th form, I'm so worried all of this is going to upheave her, stress her out and affect her performance; she's been so proud of her achievements recently and I think if she does badly now what little confidence she'd recently gained will disappear.

I am pretty sure a straw will break the camel's back and I will end up loosing it with him at some point, or just getting incredibly stressed and ill (stress usually manifests itself physically with me as I just try to ignore it and push on through - I've had my own mental health battles). But how can I effectively abandon my depressed brother? I love him dearly, and want him to be well, but he's come to rely on me so heavily that it's becoming too much. He's really not helped himself; taking so much time off work for spurious reasons and now he really needs the time off they are challenging him and his job is in jeopardy; him not taking my advice about not going cold turkey on the antidepressants without a plan to start a new one; just the assumption that we can constantly put our lives on hold. DH is being incredibly understanding - but I can even see him getting frustrated by my brother over the past few months. DH also had a huge mental breakdown last year and attempted suicide twice, he's only just got back on some sort of even keel about 6 months ago but is still recovering. Jesus, what if HE ends up breaking down again and then I've got 2 men in crisis to look after?! I've got my own full time stressful job to do as well, plus a neurodivergent daughter to keep on track. I'm terrified! I honestly don't know what to do for the best. He has very good friends but they don't live in the same city as him, but other than them and my parents, we're all he has.

What the fuck do I do?

OP posts:
Namechangedagain20 · 06/12/2024 18:25

schmeler · 06/12/2024 16:10

Dotty cat said he had a personality disorder which is wandering womb. Same diagnosis. Neither proven to exist.

What are you on about? Wandering womb was a term given to women labelled hysterical years ago. Wandering womb or hysteria isn’t given as a diagnosis today and hasn’t been for 70 years.

Personality disorders (for instance paranoid pd, borderline pd, anntisocial pd etc) are a mental health condition which is well documented and have been diagnosed for years.

MMUmum · 06/12/2024 18:33

Where are you in all this OP? Who is looking after you? Someone needs to step up for you before you too burn out and need help yourself. Your brother needs to be told to.make plans for his future, with help from CMHT if necessary and it needs to be made clear to him that this situation cannot be long term. Take care 🥰🥰

saraclara · 06/12/2024 18:35

Good grief. How many derails do we have to put up with? No-one cares about wandering wombs and whether or not a disorder exists. Take your arguments to private messaging if those few of you are determined to continue.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

saraclara · 06/12/2024 18:39

@inigomontoyahwillcox I really hope that the transport to an in patient bed on his home area materialises.

I know you'll stay strong on refusing to have him back, and I totally understand you wanting to advocate for him. Also, keeping some control over the process is the best way to ensure that he is kept away from you and your family, and I'm surprised that others aren't recognising this.

schmeler · 06/12/2024 18:42

TheGander · 06/12/2024 17:20

Schmeler this isn’t about you, and please lay off @DistanceCall and @Oldrunner . You are at risk of derailing the thread. If you want to talk about the stigmatisation of mental illness how about starting a separate thread?

I do not want it to be about me. Stop making it about something it isn't and stop replying if you do not wish to converse about it.

You are the one derailing things by replying. I made one comment and then everyone piled on and yet it is me who is the issue...make it make sense.

I don't want to talk about stigma. You have it wrong. Stop making this the focus of the thread. It isn't about you.

Namechangedagain20 · 06/12/2024 18:43

Have you told your parents of your brothers comments about your DD @inigomontoyahwillcox ? Hopefully your father now realises that you cannot be responsible for your brother.

schmeler · 06/12/2024 18:43

saraclara · 06/12/2024 18:35

Good grief. How many derails do we have to put up with? No-one cares about wandering wombs and whether or not a disorder exists. Take your arguments to private messaging if those few of you are determined to continue.

Completely agree! Wish they would!

schmeler · 06/12/2024 18:45

Namechangedagain20 · 06/12/2024 18:25

What are you on about? Wandering womb was a term given to women labelled hysterical years ago. Wandering womb or hysteria isn’t given as a diagnosis today and hasn’t been for 70 years.

Personality disorders (for instance paranoid pd, borderline pd, anntisocial pd etc) are a mental health condition which is well documented and have been diagnosed for years.

They are the same diagnostic criteria - exactly. By all means show the the tests conducted on an individual to prove this exists.

They are well documented but still as of yet, no evidence stands to prove it exists.

WishinAndHopin · 06/12/2024 18:48

saraclara · 06/12/2024 18:39

@inigomontoyahwillcox I really hope that the transport to an in patient bed on his home area materialises.

I know you'll stay strong on refusing to have him back, and I totally understand you wanting to advocate for him. Also, keeping some control over the process is the best way to ensure that he is kept away from you and your family, and I'm surprised that others aren't recognising this.

Because it’s not true.

The best and ONLY way to keep him away is to get an injunction, and report the situation to police and social services.

Advocating for him without doing the above will only make social services assess him as having a family member who can care for him, thus making him ineligible for funded care (and thus OPs problem).

schmeler · 06/12/2024 18:50

Lollypop25 · 06/12/2024 18:12

It's pretty distasteful to continually argue around the point of an emotionally manipulative man refusing to accept responsibility for himself well into his adulthood.

I'm not sure if you're projecting your own experiences on the situation here but no one could argue that OP hasn't done her absolute hardest up until now whether or not she decides to continue to advocate or cut ties.

You should probably consider arguing about personality disorders elsewhere.

You're right ppl should stop making excuses for him and hold him to account shame you misunderstood.

Iamnotalemming · 06/12/2024 19:10

@inigomontoyahwillcox I am so sorry you are going through this. It must all feel desperate but you are right to prioritise your DD and DH. You also need to prioritise yourself.

Your brother is ill but he is also selfish. It sounds like he feels his needs are more important than yours or your family. And your family sounds like it is in desperate need of support itself! You've already done an enormous amount for him.

I wish I had something wiser to tell you but I just wanted to send you strength and hugs Flowers

NadineMumsnet · 06/12/2024 19:16

Hi all, we've had a few reports about this thread, so we're popping by to ask for posts to get back on track so that OP can keep on getting the advice and support she needs. Thank you.

Autumnleaveswhenthegrassisjewelled · 06/12/2024 19:24

Iamnotalemming · 06/12/2024 19:10

@inigomontoyahwillcox I am so sorry you are going through this. It must all feel desperate but you are right to prioritise your DD and DH. You also need to prioritise yourself.

Your brother is ill but he is also selfish. It sounds like he feels his needs are more important than yours or your family. And your family sounds like it is in desperate need of support itself! You've already done an enormous amount for him.

I wish I had something wiser to tell you but I just wanted to send you strength and hugs Flowers

This, I'd recommend some family counselling for you, DH and your DD. You might not realise how much this has been affecting you all.

OhBeAFineGuyKissMe · 06/12/2024 19:32

I’m going to agree that you shouldn’t continue to advocate for your brother. Your parents can do that. You need to do the steps someone else outlined above:

get an injunction
inform the police of the threat
tell social services as well

You have to go no contact to protect your daughter , she must be your priority now.

Harshtruth1111 · 06/12/2024 20:47

Gillettethebest · 06/12/2024 09:58

Maybe tell him to learn a new language or learn coding. He needs to shift his mind from being vacant.

I assume you haven’t read the latest updates. OPs brother is now in hospital. He has shared that he has experienced violent impulses towards her daughter.

OP now needs to focus on herself and her partner and child.

Edited

Sorry
Didn't not realise he was in hospital
Hope he recovers soon

WishinAndHopin · 06/12/2024 21:08

I just want to add, I personally think you should tell your daughter of his threats. This will give her the knowledge to protect herself from him should he approach her in the future.

She’s 15/16 so old enough to deserve to know, and be enabled to develop her own judgment which will help keep her safe from him and other men.

Dumbledore167 · 06/12/2024 21:14

I can relate to this situation, unfortunately.
My brother (6 years older) also has a history of MH issues and extremely poor choices in life which often led to things like hospitalisations after getting beaten up. 6 / 7 years ago he had a full psychotic break which manifested itself in religious delusion (completely random as we had always been staunch atheists as a family) and was sectioned, for the first time - after repeatedly calling our mother “the devil”. My parents totally lost the plot emotionally and I had to step in and take over and become his advocate. Fighting with the hospital to get him help, battling with housing to find him a home, sorting his benefits, attending his consultant meetings, searching for him for hours when he escaped secure units, listening to him tell me how my children were going to die (an ‘end of days’ prediction, he was omniscient you see - god wouldn’t spare my kids apparently). All alongside having a 3yo, 5yo and a very full time job.
After these few intense months, my parents recovered from the trauma and took over most of his caring, although he lives independently and has no quality of life - he’s still insane, the medication he’s on makes him almost catatonic with very little interest in life. Unlike your brother, no tears, attention demanding, neediness etc but the worry and sadness for the entire wider family is so real. They say you’re only as happy as your unhappiest child and that’s so true for my parents who are truly amazing and kind. Although I stepped in for them (both my parents and my brother) temporarily, they took over as they got their emotions together and they are retired whereas I worked full time with kids. I am fucking terrified as to what will happen when they die. My brother has told me on a number of occasions, he’ll wait till they do then kill himself. Unfortunately, I believe him. The whole thing is just tragic. My parents are still finding his stashes of bottled water, tinned food and weapons such as crossbows (!) that he stashed in their loft while secretly preparing for Armageddon.

I really hope you’re OK OP, I couldn’t relate more to your ‘damned if you do, damned if you don’t’ comment - the sadness and guilt are intense either way.

Livingtothefull · 06/12/2024 21:46

WishinAndHopin · 06/12/2024 21:08

I just want to add, I personally think you should tell your daughter of his threats. This will give her the knowledge to protect herself from him should he approach her in the future.

She’s 15/16 so old enough to deserve to know, and be enabled to develop her own judgment which will help keep her safe from him and other men.

I think the OP and her DH should use their judgment about when & how to tell their DD about this. She probably will need to be made aware at some stage, but (given how massively upsetting it will surely be for her) I would question whether she needs to know right now, when she is still very young and is studying for important exams - provided the OP is confident she can be kept entirely safe.

If the OP chooses to report this as some posters have proposed, perhaps the police or other agencies (or her school) can advise on any measures to keep DD safe.

TheGander · 06/12/2024 21:47

Really sorry you and your parents are going through that @Dumbledore167 it sounds really hard. You have done your best.

Gillettethebest · 06/12/2024 21:51

Livingtothefull · 06/12/2024 21:46

I think the OP and her DH should use their judgment about when & how to tell their DD about this. She probably will need to be made aware at some stage, but (given how massively upsetting it will surely be for her) I would question whether she needs to know right now, when she is still very young and is studying for important exams - provided the OP is confident she can be kept entirely safe.

If the OP chooses to report this as some posters have proposed, perhaps the police or other agencies (or her school) can advise on any measures to keep DD safe.

Yeah I think this would be wise. Finding out would be so distressing and likely mess up her exams. Aside from being ND she’s obviously had a lot to deal with already assuming she knows about her Dads mental health struggles too?

So if they can wait until she’s a bit older it would be better.

I think it’s best they keep an eye on the situation and if OP is still going to be involved from afar she can keep track of where he is and ask that none of her local friends invite him to stay again.

IMO would be best to cut contact between the uncle and child too and she can decide when she’s an adult if she wants to resume contact with him.

WishinAndHopin · 06/12/2024 22:44

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

saraclara · 06/12/2024 22:51

Man in a mental health crisis severe enough to require hospitalisation = a murderous parasite?

SheilaFentiman · 06/12/2024 22:54

@WishinAndHopin you are just being horrible to OP and you have no basis for saying such things to a woman handling an immediate and severe crisis. Stop it.

murasaki · 06/12/2024 23:00

saraclara · 06/12/2024 22:51

Man in a mental health crisis severe enough to require hospitalisation = a murderous parasite?

He's living in her house, contributing nothing, and said he fantasised about strangling her daughter so yes. The OP is doing absolutely the right thing in sorting help and waking away to a distance she feels comfortable with to keep her family and her safe.

Livingtothefull · 06/12/2024 23:12

To be fair to the OP, I don't see anything in her posts that suggests she is not going to absolutely prioritise her DD safety and do the right thing by her.

The OP has the distress having to contend with a lifetime of conditioning from her parents as well as DB himself, to assume responsibility for him. The history she has described is v revealing.....that she 'gave' chickenpox to her DB, how come she knows that? By way of contrast: I know that in my own childhood I and my siblings had chickenpox around the same time too, but I couldn't say who had it first/who gave it to whom. My parents never discussed that because it was a non issue.

We really can't speculate but other posters have talked about how mental illness have caused their loved ones to act out of character; also we don't know DB condition. So I think it is important to give this man the benefit of the doubt.

At this stage though it doesn't really matter whether it is him or the mental illness talking....he is not safe to be around the OP's DD. I am a little concerned though about how the OP can continue to advocate for her DB without risking being drawn back into his care. He undoubtedly needs help - but not convinced that help should come from the OP. I think she needs to not only prioritise her DD safety (as I am sure she will) but be seen to do so & be able to demonstrate to DD that she has done so.