I can't cope with depressed brother being so reliant on me. Feel like a bitch for saying that.

[inigomontoyahwillcox]

I'm so sorry - this going to be so long - but I need to get this out. I'm up with this awful cough/chest infection which makes it impossible to lie down and sleep. Been ill since last Tuesday. Have had virtually no sleep since then. Pretty sure a lot of you will think I'm a heartless cow, but I'm getting to my wits end.

Context. My brother (quite significantly older than me) has suffered from depression since he was a teen. He has been on antidepressants since then, except for a couple of occasions when he's taken himself off them for one reason or another, which have ended up in disaster. He lives about 2.5 hours away from me.

For some years now he has been spending more and more time at my house with my DH, DD and I. He lives alone and came to stay with us during lock down, and has often come to stay with us, sometimes for weeks, off and on since then when he's feeling low or had a crappy couple of weeks (e.g. work stress). I've always said to him of course he can come, how can I not, but he's often then stayed and stayed, prolonging his stay without discussing it with me - just declaring he's not going to go home for another week at the end of his planned stay.

He has a fantastic job in the civil service, but has had lot and lots of absences for various ailments over the past couple of years and they are understandably getting serious about his attendance. He seems to think this is very unfair and how they just don't understand. I've tried gently - but seriously - to explain that you can indeed be dismissed for repeated or lengthy absences.

In May this year he started getting some odd physical symptoms - balance issues/vertigo mainly (other very vague things like feeling cold, and out of it) - I rushed down there to him when this initially happened as he took himself to hospital thinking he was having a stroke. Ultimately anything serious was ruled out and after taking him to a few appointments for some further checks I drove him back to mine to stay. He decided that these symptoms were due to his antidepressant (that he'd been on for 15 years), so agreed with his GP to reduce his dose to an incredibly small one (questionable that it was even therapeutic anymore - it was 1/4 of the starting dose, he had been on double the starting dose for 15 years). His physical symptoms did clear up eventually - he put this down to this reduction in his antidepressants - I wasn't so convinced. I also voiced my concern that he was now effectively not on antidepressants and we all know how that had ended up in the past and that he needed to push to try another antidepressant if he didn't want to go back to his old one.

He eventually went back home and to work, and was there for a few months until he started experiencing stomach issues, now diagnosed as IBS (which I know is not fun - I've had it for years myself) and yet again took himself off work. He was working with his GP and a dietician and put on the FODMAP diet which he's still on. Again, he came to ours for a few weeks. His work were getting very ancy by this time and he started to do some hours remotely from ours as he had no choice. Eventually he went home again, he was home for a week only then for his depression to increase so I told him to get an emergency appointment with his GP who told him to double his dose last week. Well all hell broke loose (assuming side effects of increasing the dose). I've been ill for a couple of months now with all these bloody relentless viruses (also been very anemic for a lot longer and recently had a couple of infusions and currently undergoing tests to find out why - so you can imagine how rough I've been feeling), but last Tuesday I came down with proper flu (raging temp etc.) and have been in bed since and have been mainly off work (doing work when needed from bed). I never take time off work, honestly have to be at deaths door - have subsequently developed a chest infection and am on antibiotics. Got a call from my brother at 5:30am on Wednesday with him feeling awful saying I needed to drive down and collect him, after explaining I couldn't as I was ill asked to speak to DH and asked him to go. I said to DH that he couldn't, he had work plus he was helping me out with a work event in the evening which I obviously couldn't attend any more but he still needed to arrange some stuff and be there for a short while. I put my foot down and said he had to either drive, get the train or wait until we could drive to him and if he was in crisis to call his local crisis team immediately. He eventually said he would drive as he couldn't fit all the stuff he wanted to bring in a backpack so the train was out (so he'd get obviously decided at that point he was coming for a while).

Since he's been with us he has been waking me up every morning at silly-o'clock (e.g. 5-6), as he's been experiencing massive anxiety. I've been woken up three times now to him standing in our bedroom crying and saying he can't cope. I am getting about 2 hours of sleep per night due to this chest infection anyway, and have usually only just dropped off when he's waking me up. At this rate I'm never going to get better. DH had to stop him coming into our bedroom the other day when I had eventually managed to doze off. Anyway, called the local out of hours crisis team yesterday morning and sat with him whilst he spoke to them, they're seeing him this morning and have told him to register as a temporary patient at my local GP and they are hopefully going to make a plan going forward - e.g. moving to a new antidepressant (I hope). On the phone he said to them he was going to stay with me indefinitely (no discussion with me) and can't see himself doing his job for some months.

In the past when he's had a crisis like this he's decamped to our parents who look after him for months whilst he recovers and he finds a new job - but he's decided that he finds it too stressful to stay with them (they're getting on now as well). I can see what is going to happen. He is going to loose his job, loose his rented flat as a result and have nowhere to live but here with us. So, unemployed, living with us indefinitely. And what choice do I have?

It's really stressful when he stays with us - just the whole dynamic/routine of the household goes out the window. He has always been single and as a result his life revolves around himself, he spreads himself and his things around the house, and changes/moves/breaks thing (little things, but they all add up) and gets argumentative when I ask him not to do something. My home just doesn't feel like my home anymore; I can't spend evenings chilling out lying on the sofa in front of the telly with DH, as we often do, he's often lying on the sofa watching TV himself, he smokes although takes himself outside but his clothes smell of smoke. He is in our small spare room (well, he's on the sofa tonight for some reason) which we had just recently decked out as DD's study as her bedroom isn't really big enough for a desk; she's finishing her mocks tomorrow and has her GCSEs in May - she has ADHD and it's been incredibly challenging for her academically, but we'd really turned a corner recently and she's determined to get into 6th form, I'm so worried all of this is going to upheave her, stress her out and affect her performance; she's been so proud of her achievements recently and I think if she does badly now what little confidence she'd recently gained will disappear.

I am pretty sure a straw will break the camel's back and I will end up loosing it with him at some point, or just getting incredibly stressed and ill (stress usually manifests itself physically with me as I just try to ignore it and push on through - I've had my own mental health battles). But how can I effectively abandon my depressed brother? I love him dearly, and want him to be well, but he's come to rely on me so heavily that it's becoming too much. He's really not helped himself; taking so much time off work for spurious reasons and now he really needs the time off they are challenging him and his job is in jeopardy; him not taking my advice about not going cold turkey on the antidepressants without a plan to start a new one; just the assumption that we can constantly put our lives on hold. DH is being incredibly understanding - but I can even see him getting frustrated by my brother over the past few months. DH also had a huge mental breakdown last year and attempted suicide twice, he's only just got back on some sort of even keel about 6 months ago but is still recovering. Jesus, what if HE ends up breaking down again and then I've got 2 men in crisis to look after?! I've got my own full time stressful job to do as well, plus a neurodivergent daughter to keep on track. I'm terrified! I honestly don't know what to do for the best. He has very good friends but they don't live in the same city as him, but other than them and my parents, we're all he has.

What the fuck do I do?

Is the implication that everyone should be thinking and talking only about him?

Doesn't make you a bitch at all. Not least because of the impact on your DC.

Between her father and her uncle, all I can think of is just how much trauma your daughter must have seen and experienced over the last few years. Please start putting her first.

He's not going to leave voluntarily, that much is clear, so either you or your DH throws him out.

That's hard to hear. But true. She is an absolute ray of sunshine, but I know she is very good at masking.

Yes @MiddleParking - certainly at the moment.

This is awful. I've suffered depression and anxiety attacks, my DH has suffered serious depression, my brother suffers from depression. None of us would ever impose on a sibling and their family like this. I remember once when my brother was very depressed he came to stay for a weekend. That's it. He wouldn't dream of staying for weeks on end.
I don't actually think you're helping him because he's not learning to deal with it. Whenever he feels bad, he just rushes to your house to get looked after. He's not learning to be an independent adult.
I feel so, so sorry for your daughter.

What you do is prioritise your daughter. You tell him she needs her space to work for her exams and surely he wouldn't want to see his niece suffer, struggle or fail her exams? He has to go elsewhere. This week.

Children before siblings, every single time.

You've done more than enough. Your brother might even be part of the cause of your DH bad mental health, as well as yours.

Oh no, I read on and see your brother doesn't want to hear about his niece's education plans. What a disappointing uncle and I'm being far more polite than I feel there.

Your husband deserves a medal, frankly.

This needs to end. I know that is nowhere near as simple as that sounds, but he is not your responsibility.

You have to put your foot down now or you are going to end up his permanent carer into his old age.

I do feel for you as I too have siblings who need extra support for a range of reasons.

He appears to be lining that up, doesn't he? His medical care is in the process of being moved to OPs area, which is the first step.

Oops, pressed too soon.

Your brother is very unwell but he is also a very selfish man. Your dd and DH must come first.

Your brother needs to leave today. And you all need space until your dd has finished her exams. No compromise.

Has he had input from a good clinical psychologist? He needs to learn coping strategies and tools to manage his anxiety. Antidepressants aren't a magic wand.

Looking at this rationally:

Firstly, in order to help others - any others - you need to be well yourself. So you need to practice self care and look after yourself. At the moment you are ill. So you need to prioritise yourself.

Secondly, there are people in your life who need support and people who can offer it.
Your daughter needs support. Your husband needs support. Your brother needs support.

Your parents can offer support,

Do the obvious thing - match your parents to your brother - he needs support and they can offer it.

Then you are supporting your husband and your daughter.

That's a much more sustainable solution.

Just an fyi though. When you pull the rug expect him to come back hard. There will be drama and ructions with crises to pull you back into line. You need your husbands backup to stay firm. His only thought will be for himself and his needs. He will do and say anything to make things stay as they are.

Line up the phone numbers and let him fall on the professionals rather in your spare room. Itll be tough but you have to do this for your own household.

You being so ill was the perfect opportunity to start saying "No, you can't come." Instead you told him to get the train or drive over! You have to start saying no.

Just adding my voice to those of many other posters. You have gone way, way beyond what your brother might reasonably accept from you and you need to tell him firmly and kindly that he can no longer keep doing this to your family. You need to do it quite soon, too, as it appears that his treatment at your local GP surgery and by the local crisis team is starting to pull his 'NHS existence' to your home.
Ultimately, although I am sure it has been very helpful for him in the past, this situation is enabling his conversion of what might be a manageable depression into a more severe disability.

It does seem amazing that his depression can co-exist with what seems like a very large helping of a sense of entitlement. Perhaps this is not the case, perhaps his experience of his own needs just triumphs over the usual low self-esteem of depression and forces him to be demanding - even in situations where other depressed people would be self-obliterating in their fear of being a burden .
But perhaps he is someone who, for whatever reason, rides roughshod over other people's needs, or who has had a family history in which his needs are centred and yours are demoted?

As everyone has said, you must put your own family first. I don’t think a marriage can take this pressure for very long and your child is doing her GCSEs. Call your parents and deliver your brother to them.

I could have written some of your post. My brother is very similar. You have to, however hard it is, stop and put yourself first-along with DD and DH. You need to look after yourself and your own health otherwise you’ll be no help to anyone. Take a step back. Be honest with him you can’t cope with this all again. He needs to go to your parent’s asap. From personal experience the reaction won’t be pleasant however there will be light at the end of the tunnel-my brother has been “stable” for 3years now.

Oh, sorry, just wanted to add: I don't think you should be directing him to your parents. He may or may not decide to transfer his demands to them, but you don't need to frame the situation as one in which he replaces one crutch with another. Surely it should be about him accepting responsibility for himself, first and foremost. It is up to your parents to decide whether it is appropriate for them to step in, and whether it is within their abilities/resources as they get older.

Similar brother.deprssive, functional alcoholic.
Two long-term relationships - he broke those poor women.
In his 'good' periods we never saw him. He'd do nothing for us. Resent us getting in touch. Showed far less interest than our friends in our kids.
Once I saw this I couldn't unsee it. He's 50. So decades of this.
Now in his bad periods I feel quite detached. I parrot the obvious stuff a professional would - engage with experts, routine, but mostly I utterly don't get involved.
He has moved on, made new friends, continued to go through the get on track, successful at work, get miserable cycle without putting any hard work into diet, exercise and positive habits.

Would he make as much effort for you or your parents?

This would be the final straw. That and him saying he was staying indefinitely.

I once knew someone like this. He got depressed after a divorce, but it continued indefinitely(it was years after when I met him).He wasn’t a friend as such but someone I knew through my job. The more people did for him, the less he became able to do for himself. He was in a pattern where he would get into a total mess at home and then someone would come and sort it out. Over and over again. Sadly he even relied upon his teenage daughter to do this. None of it helped though, because it was a pattern that ultimately needed breaking.

You MUST rely on your parents while they’re alive. Only once they pass or are unable to help should you step up. I’m saying this as someone in a similar situation. You really need to make your own family memories during this precious time and not rush into being a carer for your brother (which you are at the moment).

Sometimes siblings of those with MH problems don’t even realise they’re a carer or have been for years. If he’s had MH problems since a teen and is older, maybe you’ve always been a carer to him of sorts which is why you’re struggling to draw your own boundaries. Rethink the MH charity used to do sibling support groups and events, those might be useful if they’re still running. You deserve some support to enable you to step back.