What an utter mess - teens and DH - help!

[MyUmberFinch]

I need to find a way through this. Other than "call social services / police".

My marriage has been awful for ages... over 15 years. DH is constantly complaining about me - he maintains I am a narcissist, I only think of myself, I'm an "idiot", a "drama queen", I'm "full of shit"....etc ...etc. Last time we went on a "date" he complained that I wasn't wearing makeup (I NEVER wear makeup) and said I looked like I'd just got out of bed. We were going out for a quick pizza, not a night at the Ritz. He tells me that all my friends and family think the same things about me, they are just too afraid to tell me to my face. He's talking rubbish, ofc.

My youngest son (15) hates DH, and has done for a long time, He recently threatened to kill him. He said some horrendously violent stuff. DH wrestled him to the floor and pinned him down. I was utterly shocked and this event has suddenly changed things. I don't want violence in my house.

DH has no family, doesn't earn enough to support himself, and is also unlikely to leave our rented home voluntarily. But I need to get DS and DH apart urgently, or something awful could happen.

I am self-employed, well-qualified (postgrad level), have some personal savings and the offer of some financial support from my mum. We rent from a private landlord.

Both my sons are out of education because of SEN (DS1) and mental health (DS2). Schools were hostile and completely unsupportive with both my sons - this in itself has been a huge challenge for many years - one I have faced completely on my own as DH doesn't get involved. DS1 has an EHCP and gets 1 hour of "provision" a week.

Hand-hold - what to do next? I tried Womens Aid - they only said to go to Social Services, but what can they really do? My personal and professional experience of "services" is not great.

DH is currently not speaking to me. I fear that if he does it will be a very explosive argument. I'm feeling exhausted and also trying to work.

I have done my absolute best to be a good person, love my sons, support them through life's ups and downs. I work hard, I look after myself, I have good friends who I gladly help and support with all sorts of stuff. I am a naturally positive and resilient person but this shitshow is really testing me and I just don't know what to do next.

I hope your son is getting help for threats and violence like that. What if he turns on you or his SEN sibling next?

I think your plan of moving temporarily into the Air B&B is a good one. Tell your husband he has 14 days to get his stuff packed and to leave. Tell him the marriage is over and you will be seeking a divorce. Tell your family and friends what is happening, get real life support wherever you can. Good luck!

Actually, the way I read it - it was the youngest son (15) who does NOT have SEN, who threatened to kill the husband - in response to his the husband restrained him by pinning him down. Everyone saying he is just a child, he may be by law, but many 15 year old are tall and strong and the son could easily be a real threat to the husband should he choose to. My 13 year old nephew is almost 6 ft and the size of a house. The police are not going to care about someone trying to restrain a violent 15 year old who is threatening to kill you.
In saying that, this is clearly not a healthy environment for anyone involved so I would suggest serving notice and looking for somewhere else to live. Unless you are leaving out information and you husband is physically abusive (this incident aside), in which case I would suggest trying to leave sooner if you feel things may escalate.

A lot of good advice apart from one. Get out or get him out as soon as possible. Your son was trying to protect you. Both sons have been signalling problems in the family for a long time. Good luck, you can do it.

Involve the police to get this pig out of your home.
Tell your LL the truth and ask will he remove your husband from the rental contract because of his abuse, and that the police are Involved.

Your poor son.
Get this man out, by any means necessary.

You need to get help for your son.

What kind of child threatens to kill their father.

Unless there is serious abuse going on.

Find a new rental make arrangements, don’t tell your husband anything. Move when he is out of the house. Send divorce documents via email or post.

Presumably he's seen a lifetime of your husband treating you like shit and abusing you, not surprised he has behaved in this way.

Jesus. Leave him and take the kids!

My post was out of date. All the apologists crawling out of the woodwork now Ignore them

I felt the exact same way towards my dad at 15. Then my dad did something to attack me in such a vicious and violent manner. I have never physically healed. My mum never got me medical help or left him.
You sound so put together and capable. Please either call the police or contact the landlord and give notice on the tenancy. Organise a new let or have your husband removed. But do something where you will all be so much happier. Your son hates your husband for a reason and his threat is not as serious as what your H did to your son. Good luck.

He sounds awful and your relationship sounds toxic but I wouldn’t just brush off your son threatening to kill his dad and saying horrendous violent stuff. That’s not normal either and you don’t explain what led to it happening. Was it in response to his dad’s verbal abuse? Has his dad been violent to him or abusive to him before?
Pinning him down depends on what happened- if he was sitting at the kitchen table saying he’d kill him that would be disturbing but not warrant laying hands on him. If he was coming for him or in his face then that would probably be self defence.

Either way you need to split because this isn’t a happy relationship.

Thank you to pp @Octavia64 for sharing your story. I recognise myself there. One thing worth saying for anyone reading along is that when you are in these long term situations where you are mediating between family members, you get this idea that you can somehow fix it. I think that's what I thought. I definitely couldn't and I have a lot of regret that I didn't act soon enough.

Please speak to Women’s Aid again for advice. Perpetrators of domestic abuse increase the abuse, if you try and get them to leave, this is due to them losing power/control over their victim.
Your children’s mental health will improve once DH has left.

@MyUmberFinch Would you be able to confirm whether you are in England or somewhere else? Obviously the law differs, depending on where you are.

If you are in England I am not quite sure why you have to give three months notice? Are you still within a fixed term AST or are you now in a statutory periodic tenancy?

Again, if you are in England, any tenant can give notice to their landlord, even if this is a joint tenancy. One tenant giving notice ends the tenancy for all tenants.

https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/private_renting/joint_tenancies/how_to_end_a_joint_tenancy

Sorry, I meant to say that this only applies (giving notice on a joint tenancy) once you are outside of your fixed term AST and are in a statutory periodic tenancy.

What exactly happened here, did your son attack your husband and your husband restrained him?

Are the kids your husbands kids? I'm assuming they are but just checking.

How has this been going on so long? Did the awfulness start before you had kids?

Are the kids MH issues due to your husband? It sounds like they might be.

I am glad you are thinking about leaving. I'm sure it will be very difficult and stressful to do but that you need to leave.

Good luck.

I agree. She was very vague about what happened with her son

@MyUmberFinch

I'd start with speaking to the Landlord. Ask if there's anything he can do to end the tenancy and/or to get your H (not so 'D') off the lease. I'm not sure, but I don't think a landlord can just say "Begone" to a tenant, joint or single tenancy. Unless there's a really good legal reason I'd think he'd have to give some kind of eviction notice and I don't know if you can evict just one member of a joint tenancy. If there's nothing he can do without notice period etc, ask if he will remove you from the tenancy. But if your H doesn't have the money to keep paying the rent, the landlord may not be willing to do that because he'd be faced with months of no rent trying to get him evicted. Even if the landlord is a nice person, they have to think of their own finances first.

If the landlord can't help you out, speak to a solicitor. Since you're married and have children under 18, you'll need one at some point anyway, for a divorce. Ask them what can be done to get your H out. Or to get you out without continuing rental liability.

I do think it's imperative to get your sons away from him. I understand it's a complicated situation due to their SEN and MH, but if it looks like you won't be able to leave right away (due to rental liability) would they (or at least DS1) be able to stay with your family until you get things straightened out? Obvs, only you know whether that would help or hinder their wellbeing.

If you are in England and you are outside the initial fixed term of your tenancy then either of you can give notice to terminate. This normally requires one months notice to coincide with your rent payment period.
Your landlord CANNOT just remove your husband from the tenancy. He does not have that power. He could arrange a new tenancy in just your name after the notice period has expired and your husband moves out.

You were clear. It's awful.

Find a rental, or move to your mums, file for divorce, notify the police it might get nasty and violent. Protect your kids.

Regardless of whose "fault" it is the situation would clearly be improved by separating your teens and your H.

Don't get involved in thinking about fault.

To prevent another one they need to be separated.

In your shoes if you can afford it I'd give notice in your rental. Keep paying for it until notice is up but move out to Airbnb.

I spent 4 weeks in 2 different Airbnb's before we got a more secure place.

If you can't afford it then you can't afford it. Give notice anyway and consider having a conversation with your H along the lines of "you two aren't safe together. I don't want you to go to prison if one of the teens calls the police so you and they need to live separate". He might (might!) respond to that.

I don't know. If by "threatened" then OP actually means her DS was standing in front of DH with a knife in his hand and saying, "I'm going to stab you," then pinning him to the ground seems like a proportionate response. That's not to say that DH isn't abusive or that they shouldn't separate.

You are in an abusive relationship seek help for yourself with a domestic abuse charity then you can get legal aid and an occupation order and legal fees paid for the divorce.

I’m surprised that’s all women’s aid have done go back to them and try again or try another DA charity there are local equivalents.

Yes indeed