People of the left, can we learn some lessons from Trump's win please?

[Outandinbout]

And other things, like Brexit, the disaster that was Jeremy Corbyn and his campaign.

Whilst there will be multi-factorial reasons for the way all these votes went, one of the reason, imo, is that far too many people on the left think anyone who disagrees with them is thick and racist. Do you remember that mock advert for Labour during JCs campaign? ' You are thick and racist - Vote Labour!'. That raised laughs because it resonated with how people felt about the Left.

Just stop being so bloody certain you are right and everyone else is wrong and start bloody listening to people who voted the way you don't want them to. Figure out why that is. Realise they actually have some legitimate concerns. Find ways to address these.

Because, and I can't believe I actually have to point this out, insulting people is not the way to win them over. Addressing their concerns is.

Because its not smart to sit there smugly thinking you are always right, even when voters are repeatedly disagreeing with you. It feels nice to think that, yes. But all that means is that you lack the courage to move yourself out of your psychological comfort zone. Its lazy, not smart. And it shows a distinct lack of intellectual curiosity.

I'm pretty pissed at Trump winning as I support Ukraine. I think the Left in America needs to look pretty hard at itself as to why a candidate such as Trump has won. And the left in the UK has lessons to learn too.

This doesn’t make sense - a person can be left or right wing and also talk about ‘the left’ or ‘the right’.

But its the left that are condescending and rude to others on the right....

Well, there we have it.... you've done a better job than i ever could of showing what a complete bunch of hypocrites the 'right are.

Remind me again who wrote this.... Because, and I can't believe I actually have to point this out, insulting people is not the way to win them over. Addressing their concerns is

Bravo!!!!

Oh btw the democrats are by no stretch of the imagine the "left" plus you made it v clear in your OP you were talking about the left in the UK learning from the USA.....

Totally 💯

I believe we’re trying to play chess with a pigeon.

What’s horrifying me this time is how many people I see on British social media who are spouting pro Trump crap. Posting the same kind of videos about not believing what you see online etc. when we all know he’s a convicted felon, sexist, racist bigot if only based on the words coming out of his own mouth. That’s before we even get to all of the things he did during his last presidency and, you know the insurrection. If none of that’s enough for people, did separating children from their parents and never reuniting them not do it, no?

parade of glittering celebrities

I’m hearing this so many times today, must be rife on the pro Trump algorithms. ‘But her emails glittering celebrities…’

Definitely a great reason to go for the racist, bigoted, convicted felon who talks about women like shit then!

dayatatime · Yesterday 11:40

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"Wow. Vance must really be something because graduates of SOAS and Harvard tend to be pretty bright."
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Lammy went to Harvard on a Masters which is impressive. Getting into SOAS to study law less so.
Vance to Yale under a GI Bill.
Of the two Vance is by far the intellectual superior.

I’ll take your word on that.
Very worrying that an intellectually superior man is a Neanderthal in respect of women’s rights. That some men support Trump because they don’t know better is understandable. That Vance presumably does and still chooses misogyny is alarming.

Plenty of intelligent men don't really see women as human, look at all of those saying being a woman is nothing more than a feeling of gender.

The thing we need to realise is that most people don't care about politics
In the abstract.They don't have the time or the energy or the inclination to go into the nuances. They base their vote on what affects them personally on the day. So, weekly shop more expensive? Vote against current government. Weekly shop cheaper? Vote for current government.

Yeah you are right, I did lose my shit and get snarky. I am tired of the left repeating the same mistakes and getting the same results and I am tired of the same old ' Its so incomprehensible to me. They must all be so stupid' rhetoric when someone votes a way they do not like. And someone saying ' but why didn't you say what the Right has to learn' in the context of a post on the back of a massive win for the right in the USA did send me over the edge. It was not a smart comment. If the left keep trying to divert away from their own responsibility like this they will keep on making the same mistakes. If an absolutely enormous defeat like the USA election does not make the left wake up, and look at what they are doing wrong, then clearly nothing ever will.

As for your strange comment about my post showing the hypocrisy of the Right, this makes no sense being as am not a right wing voter. But thanks for making it clear that you think anyone who disagrees with you must be right wing.

Anyway, I watched really interesting footage yesterday which made clear why Trump won.

Exit polls of voters showed over 70% of them were dissatisfied or very angry the state of America. They were also very unhappy with Biden. Two separate commentators looked at this and said they didn't see how Harris could win, given this. The only way she could have won was if she distanced herself from Biden, but in her campaign she explicitly did the opposite, repeatedly saying she could not think of anything she would do differently.

So she presented herself as the continuity candidate at a time people were deeply unhappy with the status quo and desperate for change.

Politicians need to know the mood of the country and she misread it and Trump didn't.

Don't waste your time. I started voting when Wilson was Prime Minister and if there is one thing I am sure of it is that the left forgets nothing and learns nothing.

So certain are they of the correctness of their beliefs, that anyone who does not 100% agree can only be (a) stupid, (b) evil or (c) a combination of (a) and (b).

There is a level of arrogance in this view that is frankly seriously unpleasant.

Labour learnt its lesson after Corbyn (but it will forget it quickly, I suspect) and hopefully the Democrats will do the same (but I doubt it).

You (meaning the Democrats) are berated because you had the race in your hands and you threw it away.

Running Biden for a second term was a ludicrous idea from the start, and Harris hadn't got the wit to divorce herself from a POTUS whose approval ratings were in the 40s.

Hard to believe that the ancestors of today's Trump voters were the people who put Harry Truman in the White House in 1948.

Jonathan Pye can be irritating, but has nailed it here.
(I am a leftie btw)

At the present time, all the evidence is that only a man can run the USA.

In the days of Wilson it was easier to define left and right politics.
It seems to me now that the left and right labels are useless.Who can actually define the terms?

What they seem to mean is four legs left = good or two legs right = bad or vice versa according to subjective beliefs, it's objectively meaningless.

You would actually have to ignore the evidence to reach that conclusion.

Harris was a weak candidate, who failed to read the mood of the country and ran a badly misjudged campaign. A white man running that campaign would have lost too.

Crivvens he reminds me of Ben Elton's anti Thatcher rants in the 80's.
Quite funny & clever ranting.

Right.... Your OP made clear you were referring primarily to the UK and what the UK left can learn from the Trump win, as you made many references to UK politics, inc Brexit and Corbyn.

Can you not see that in that context, its the right here that needs to learn from Labour and how they ve turned things around since 2017 and 2019?

Supporting Ukraine doesn't automatically make you left leaning, seems to be a non party issue.

I would argue that what led to the Tories defeat is exactly what led to their defeat in 1997.... arrogance, corruption, running down public services and economic incompetence ie Black Wednesday, they learnt nothing from that period.

I also don't hold to Left is good and Right is bad, plenty of good ideas from the right, plenty of shit ones as can be said of the so called left too.

Of course the democrats have to realise why they lost but i happen to think it was mostly out of their hands, the Americans did not see that that recent economic woes were global in nature, they did not see the benefits in stock market growth or lower inflation either and blamed the incumbent party.

When American women vote for a party/President that wants to limit or take away abortion rights, its a very difficult job to win them over.....

Because the more conservative right are less likely to shout their voting intentions from the roof top. That's why they're known as a "silent majority".

Whereas the left just can't help themselves tell all and sundry their voting plans and trip over themselves to mock and berate everyone else.

Quite simply, say, there's a pollster on the High Street. The lefties will hang around and keep walking past just in the hope of being questioned so that they can give their views. The "silent majority" will avoid them, keep their head down, and say they're too busy to stop if asked to participate!

I think it happened in a UK election a while ago. All the opinion polls and exit polls were confident of a Labour win, but were then shocked when the Tories did far better than any of the polls forecasted them to do! I understand that the professional polling organisations now done a kind of "adjustment" to try to take into account the silent majority effect, also known as the "shy Tory" voters.

I think this pretty much sums it up. It's something that metropolitan left/liberal elite will always fail to understand.

Because, and I can't believe I actually have to point this out, insulting people is not the way to win them over. Addressing their concerns is.

Really? Why do you call people smug, lazy, lacking in courage and not smart. Are these not insults?

Your post is more than a bit hypocritical @Outandinbout. Be the change you want to see.

Silent Majority lol ...again, you must have missed the July GE result, which polling actually underestimated the scale of the Tory defeat.

you re referring to 1992? the margin of error in the polling was around 4% back then, the polls were, more or less, correct, it was just that that buffoon Kinnock, believed his own BS...

Polling in the US was also within the margin of error too.

The point of the last GE was that the Tories didn't defect to Labour, they defected to Reform. There was barely any increase in the Labour vote at all compared with Corbyn previously. So the point still stands really as both Tory and Reform are to the Right. There simply was no swing from Tory to Labour.

So she presented herself as the continuity candidate at a time people were deeply unhappy with the status quo and desperate for change.

I have no idea why she did that - maybe it was money behind scenes related.

She either didn't have enough time to distance herself and run a campaign or had too much time for the initial poll bump to disappear.

I also think her and Hillary Clinton will be used as reasons to block better female candidates coming though the democratic party - and possibly Republican at least for next few round - rather than focusing on actual problems which have led to not connecting with enough voters.