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Why are majority of the riots in northern towns?

1000 replies

PhoebeMcPeePee · 04/08/2024 12:13

DH & I were watching the riots on the news this morning like most people absolutely horrified.

He's from one of the northern towns affected although we live in the south and started discussing why these riots now (and historically) tend to be more focused on northern towns but didn't really come up with any one thing. Any thoughts on this?

OP posts:
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12
80smonster · 04/08/2024 22:12

Poverty, not enough to do, small mindedness.

BlackShuck3 · 04/08/2024 22:15

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Dont be silly.

Devonbabs · 04/08/2024 22:18

EddyF · 04/08/2024 19:15

So what if they don't want to mix??? Why can't different communities co-exist in peace? Look at the state of this lot; would you want to ‘mix’? It is okay for people to a live a different way of life if they do choose so. I mean what can they have in common? One is a culture of pubs, football and union flags and the other one is prayer five times a day and no alcohol. Mixing is being able to respect each other in the community. They don't have to be friends.

Actually society works by its members sharing norms, values and customs. If you move to a country you should intergrate by understanding, learning about and partaking in their customs. If you can’t do that, maybe that’s not the right place for you to settle.

Marchitectmummy · 04/08/2024 22:19

Everyoneesleistheproblem · 04/08/2024 22:10

Would human rights allow us to do that? Force people to live where they don’t want to?

Thats the system for everyone in social housing though. Accept what you're given or find your own place privately.

It's a pipe dream, where is the money for all of these houses coming from?

Currently social housing is provided via grants prrovided from the LA to private developers, who then build affordable flats, part funded by the sales of private hosung on the development. Housing associations then take on the housing and manage them.

So unless Labour has a magic money tree they do not have the mechanism to distribute anyone anywhere.

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:19

oObyeOo · 04/08/2024 12:15

There are more large cities in the north. However london and bristol have experienced some rioting

It wasn't Londoners rioting in Westminster

AvrielFinch · 04/08/2024 22:20

gotmychristmasmiracle · 04/08/2024 22:03

I live in the nw , I have always done on the road jobs and met people from many places and cultures.
Recently I have seen a lot of refugees in the area, they are being housed at a local army camp, where normally army families live. A lot of refugees now live at the camp as I don't think government has anywhere else to house them. I know a few women on the camp and they are scared to go out with their children now as the camp is now over 50% male refugees (no families) and they hang around camp in large groups. Working army families which are usually women and kids as the men are often away are intimidated. The refugees do not know our language and culture and they have probably come from an awful country where they have been traumatised and have had no one assess their mental health and if they need counselling etc. no one to teach them about English culture and life here. They have put these refugees in the middle of nowhere army camp and i am not surprised they can't integrate, government really needs to help them Integrate better than they have been doing.
Also I visit heavy Muslim towns and as a white female I have on occasion found this quite intimidating, a few going on about Allah, and how I should become a Muslim. I just explain I am here on business and respectfully I do not want talk religion/ politics.

What army camp? Where are these Muslim towns?
Frankly your account does not ring true.

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:21

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MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:22

Littletreefrog · 04/08/2024 12:18

Poverty and a feeling of being ignored by Government.

And racist right wing politicians winding these people up! Farage & half the Tory party should be arrested for inciting this racist terrorism.

Devonbabs · 04/08/2024 22:23

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You, and people like you are a massive part of the problem. By labelling people, many of whom actually have very valid grievances through experience like that, you are driving extremism as much as T Robinson

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:24

RainyWoodland · 04/08/2024 12:27

The Tottenham riots started in Tottenham. The statue toppling was in the south.

From what I’ve heard, this current unrest seems to be in the North West - people who possibly have been to Southport at some point for a holiday?

The Tottenham riots weren't conducted by a bunch of racist thugs.

Oldseagull · 04/08/2024 22:24

Devonbabs · 04/08/2024 21:59

This has made me laugh. I used to live in a very pleasant suburb, quite affluent. But slowly immigrants started settling there. At first it was - oh this is a nice cultural mix, everyone welcome. Then you started feeling a little uncomfortable when rather than going to the play area and chatting to other mums, all of a sudden you noticed many of the mums speaking a foreign language between themselves and having no interest in speaking with you, the kids not mixing with the white kids. Then you start noticing this more in the schools. All of a sudden there’s a lot of time spent in the school with kids whose first language is not English.

You notice that a lot of the drivers are very erratic and dangerous, quite a few people start getting hit by cars. The shops which had done well close down and are replaced by ethnic shops, pubs close and up spring numerous dessert places.

You get a letter home from school sailing back PE because of Ramadan. Your kids school wants to start serving halal meat.

All those community events which ran for years, the carnival, remembrance parade etc get cancelled because large numbers of residents don’t have any interest in typically British traditions.

Your new neighbours buying houses off the long term residents who are leaving the area in ever increasing numbers don’t mix with you, as the only mix in their community.

Your kid starts secondary, half the kids can’t get into the same school when they would easily have done so previously because of all the immigrant children, often in large families get the places. The children your child has previously been friends with since age 4 are bussed all over. You child gets really upset, many of the kids in his new school won’t mix with kids outside their community.

you feel isolated and a stranger in your own town, you feel forced out. Crime shoots up, white kids are targeted in the local park. Yet if you say it was and Asian kid with a knife threatening your child with a knife people are more concerned with calling you racist than the fact your. Hold could have been stabbed.

Eventually you feel so stressed and isolated living there you pull your kid out of school. You have lost your attitude of “oh isn’t in nice to live in this mixture of cultures, let’s be welcoming” to “Jesus I’m not going through that again l” you look up the demographics of various areas and you’re veryvrelived it says 99.1% white British born.

The day you move your 1 remaining long standing neighbour cries saying they will feel so isolated now, no neighbours talk anymore.

But go ahead, encourage the immigrants into your area. You’ll soon regret it and turn out like the rest of us who have been through it. My area was nice, it wasn’t some inner city slum. It had many outstanding schools (why it was targeted). Look forward to hearing from you then.

You've completely nailed the experience.

We moved away too. The racism from the migrants was starting to get scary. The hatred for black people was shocking,I heard words and terms from gangs of the men that I'd never heard in person before.

They were friendly enough when there were only a few families and they had to mix. As soon as they hit critical mass it started to get weird very quickly.

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:24

QueenAstrid · 04/08/2024 12:36

I’m in a culturally diverse, inclusive Northern city and joined the counter protest this morning. I have no idea why the far right chose this city to stage a ‘protest’ but I felt so proud of how we showed them they are unwelcome here.

Good for you @QueenAstrid and thank you for sharing.

nc43214321 · 04/08/2024 22:24

@averialfinch

It's very true maybe take a drive around the north west and talk to people.

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:26

chaosmaker
Believing the reform 'party' probably and their racist nonsense

And this is exactly why they are rioting, because of comments like yours.

People are as entitled to vote Reform as you are to vote for whoever you voted for.

And the rest of us are perfectly entitled to view people who voted for racist parties as racists. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Sometimeswinning · 04/08/2024 22:27

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:24

The Tottenham riots weren't conducted by a bunch of racist thugs.

It doesn’t matter. Anyone who thinks looting, burning, destroying stuff is a thug. Does not matter if they think they have a cause! They usually don’t, they use a tragic circumstance for their own selfish needs.

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:27

jugglesandspins · 04/08/2024 12:57

I’ll probably be flamed. DH is from the North East. He’s lived down South for the last 25 years.

We live near Brighton in the area where I grew up. I was astounded and completely taken aback with SIL and her ex/husbands attitude towards LGBT. It was like hearing an echo from 100 years before. SIL told me not to talk about a LGBT family (my family) wedding in front of her 10 year old as she didn’t want her hearing about it as she’s not told her about things “like that.”My 5 year old was just like oh yeah Aunty T and Aunty S are getting married.

I think in some parts they are very traditional and it’s handed down from generation to generation and they’re not very open minded about things.

Completely backwards. In other words.

Tatare · 04/08/2024 22:27

Devonbabs · 04/08/2024 22:02

Just outside Birmingham

Tamworth is in Staffordshire.

It always amazes me when North/South threads pop up on MN how utterly parochial and ridiculously ignorant many people are about the North of England.

It was like this when I went to work in the City as a graduate in 1995, I don't have much of a Northern accent, but my goodness, when people discovered I was from the North. It was absolute madness the stupid ideas people had about Northerners.

I don't think everyone from London is a pearly king eating jellied eels and singing 'roll out the barrel'.

Why the utterly stereotypical ideas about Northerners?

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:28

@Sometimeswinning stop with the whataboutary.

WhimsicalGubbins76 · 04/08/2024 22:30

Devonbabs · 04/08/2024 21:59

This has made me laugh. I used to live in a very pleasant suburb, quite affluent. But slowly immigrants started settling there. At first it was - oh this is a nice cultural mix, everyone welcome. Then you started feeling a little uncomfortable when rather than going to the play area and chatting to other mums, all of a sudden you noticed many of the mums speaking a foreign language between themselves and having no interest in speaking with you, the kids not mixing with the white kids. Then you start noticing this more in the schools. All of a sudden there’s a lot of time spent in the school with kids whose first language is not English.

You notice that a lot of the drivers are very erratic and dangerous, quite a few people start getting hit by cars. The shops which had done well close down and are replaced by ethnic shops, pubs close and up spring numerous dessert places.

You get a letter home from school sailing back PE because of Ramadan. Your kids school wants to start serving halal meat.

All those community events which ran for years, the carnival, remembrance parade etc get cancelled because large numbers of residents don’t have any interest in typically British traditions.

Your new neighbours buying houses off the long term residents who are leaving the area in ever increasing numbers don’t mix with you, as the only mix in their community.

Your kid starts secondary, half the kids can’t get into the same school when they would easily have done so previously because of all the immigrant children, often in large families get the places. The children your child has previously been friends with since age 4 are bussed all over. You child gets really upset, many of the kids in his new school won’t mix with kids outside their community.

you feel isolated and a stranger in your own town, you feel forced out. Crime shoots up, white kids are targeted in the local park. Yet if you say it was and Asian kid with a knife threatening your child with a knife people are more concerned with calling you racist than the fact your. Hold could have been stabbed.

Eventually you feel so stressed and isolated living there you pull your kid out of school. You have lost your attitude of “oh isn’t in nice to live in this mixture of cultures, let’s be welcoming” to “Jesus I’m not going through that again l” you look up the demographics of various areas and you’re veryvrelived it says 99.1% white British born.

The day you move your 1 remaining long standing neighbour cries saying they will feel so isolated now, no neighbours talk anymore.

But go ahead, encourage the immigrants into your area. You’ll soon regret it and turn out like the rest of us who have been through it. My area was nice, it wasn’t some inner city slum. It had many outstanding schools (why it was targeted). Look forward to hearing from you then.

You know what stood out the most in this? The “white British born” comment, and your relief at the statistic. The fact that you relate the skin colour white to being both British AND of some kind of elite status you feel you also identify as, calls you out for the racist that you are.

Your VERY long post started out like you were complaining about cultural differences, but if that were the case, skin colour wouldn’t have come into your preference of neighbours.

So you don’t want to live near black British people? Just the decent upstanding white folk that you view yourself as?

If you were my neighbour, I’d be moving out asap

Crikeyalmighty · 04/08/2024 22:31

Can I just ask those who feel as I do to go and support the lovely ladies posting on Muslim mumsnetters- some of who are feeling really frightened as things are.

BlackShuck3 · 04/08/2024 22:32

Oldseagull · 04/08/2024 22:24

You've completely nailed the experience.

We moved away too. The racism from the migrants was starting to get scary. The hatred for black people was shocking,I heard words and terms from gangs of the men that I'd never heard in person before.

They were friendly enough when there were only a few families and they had to mix. As soon as they hit critical mass it started to get weird very quickly.

I suppose this is inevitable. If people are migrating from cultures where extended family living is the norm they are bound to want to replicate that.
The greater the difference between the culture of origin and that of the host country the more immigrants will feel unable to bridge the gap and will cling to familiar ways of living.

MrsSkylerWhite · 04/08/2024 22:32

SummerSnowstorm · Today 21:31
MrsSkylerWhite · Today 21:23
Objectively - and for the refugees themselves - it would be far better for them to be housed in rich areas welcoming to them“

That’s a very sensible suggestion, ** . Currently live in a pleasant, pretty affluent area in the NW and would be happy to see more immigrants here. Local business in all sectors struggles to recruit.

In theory i see your logic, but it wouldn't take long for people to complain, i imagine there would be far more complaints in an upper class area than a working class area.
**
It would also make life less affordable for the refugees, even just looking at basics like being near waitrose rather than tesco with no access to a car.
Also upper class areas generally need a car to access more other things whereas poorer areas generally have better public transport.

Not so here actually. There’s a big variety of accommodation (we’re looking at rentals with our son atm because we’re relocating elsewhere shortly as we approach retirement and he wants to stay here, close to his older sister) There are very decent two bed flats available from £600pcm right up to detached houses at £3,000. We have M&S Foodhall, Booths (the Northern Waitrose 😁), Lidl and Aldi all within 15 min walk and the bus services are excellent. Regular and run until 11.30 pm at night. We also have a branch line with trains running every 20 minutes into Preston (25 minute journey) where there are further employment opportunities. There are also several outstanding and good schools all with places in every year because of falling roles. All round, a pretty perfect place for young families wanting to work hard in a pleasant environment (with a lovely beach to boot!)

Tatare · 04/08/2024 22:32

I also know that the people in the South are not an homogeneous bunch.

I wouldn't think that a bloke from the Medway towns was in any way comparable to one from Islington. At the same time, I'd not put a perception on either. They could be of any political stripe or educational level.

Because I'm well read, travelled and educated. As are many people. From all over the country...

Sometimeswinning · 04/08/2024 22:34

MadameMassiveSalad · 04/08/2024 22:28

@Sometimeswinning stop with the whataboutary.

You mentioned it. I pointed out all riots are led and carried out by thugs. Don’t like that opinion. Tough!

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