Thread 4 Starmer: Fighting back with brooms and community.

[DuncinToffee]

Previous thread

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5128710-thread-3-starmer-digging-has-started-bigger-shovel-required?page=40&reply=137271564

There’s nothing racist in that, it’s reasoned and sensible. If people with concerns spoke like this and considered all aspects instead of naming in about ‘illegals’ then maybe we could have the discussions they say they want. They don’t 5hough, because they are too scared they’ll hear something they don’t like, and they are racist so don’t care what the all around implications are.

I just rescued a grasshopper from out kitchen, not an easy tasks

Duty solicitors have worked through the night for long before that in police stations, although perhaps he introduced overnight courts, which of course would need solicitors.

She’s bang on the money. I can’t believe I agree with Patel 🥹😂 what is happening?!

Stephen Yaxley-Lennon has been trying to spread his poison to Scotland where he's already been told he's not welcome on 7 September , propagating the assertion that 3 women were stabbed in Stirling by a Muslim.

Tragic as the even was, it was one woman by a white man, from the local area, who has already been arrested and charged

Fortunately touch wood , Yaxley-Lennon failed in his attempt to foment discord.

John Swinney warns against 'speculation' after Stirling stabbing https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cv2ggn0x802o

As far as I can make out, there have been no thuggish riots in Wales or Scotland and only one in Ireland.

If they were introduce in 2011, and are up & running now, then how did they survive the Tory bloodbath of services since 2010 ?

Clearly someone thought seeing a lawyer was more important than seeing a doctor

They haven’t been running continuously though? They were brought in for the riots in 2011 and then for the riots this week is my assumption. Nobody has been routinely running overnight courts to clear the backlog. Just as an emergency response.

In the same way we’d run a critical incident response but we can’t continuously run on a critical incident plan.

Some extra tax from me since I’m in the fortunate position to be able to afford it. Miss Nora the chow taking a break on my dog walk today. If anyone needs a big black teddy bear in their life, I can tell you how to adopt her…

It’s an emergency measure. If someone thought seeing a lawyer was more important than seeing a doctor we wouldn’t have such a backlog of rape cases that it’s essentially been decriminalised.

@SerendipityJane I agree totally with your point about the NHS. I just think looking at emergency powers isn't comparable. I think it will talk far longer to fix. As will the general justice system which has a backlog of months and months.

There are a much reduced number of criminal solicitors now than there were in 2010, because the level of pay has been repeatedly cut.

That myth again

https://rapecrisis.org.uk/get-informed/breaking-point/#:~:text=The%20number%20of%20sexual%20offence,running%20of%20the%20Crown%20Court).

What myth? If you know you won’t be charged/tried there’s no legal deterrent.

That’s true. I have taught Animal Farm 😂

Good point @cardibach about racist people not wanting to have a discussion about immigration because they'll hear things they don't want to hear.

This doesn't excuse the lack of proper analysis and reporting in the media and in parliament though.

Bring on the facts.

Explore the feelz suffered by racists and try to help them feel better about themselves and by extension everyone else.

Yvette Cooper has just sensibly said that most people who have concerns don't pick up bricks. 👏

This is not to defend people's concerns as not racist. It's like condemning things as 'hate speech' with no attempt to understand why people are hateful and how to make them feel less hateful.
Dismissing people's feelings won't change those people's minds. It'll make them more susceptible to the likes of NF and will foster an unhelpful us and them mentality.

But @mibbelucieachwell those of us who aren’t racist are willing to discuss it - just not with people who talk about ‘invasions’ and ‘illegals’. It’s the brick throwers who are stopping any sensible discussion. It’s only people who don’t really want to discuss who say any discussion gets you called racist.

However, it is very similar to the Brexit debate. People were peddling complete lies about the EU, and particularly about immigration, and the racists were totally unwilling to even contemplate the actual facts.

It's almost like racists are a bit thick and won't listen to people who actually know what they're talking about...

Well yes. You set a standard about what is expected. Law.

That comes first. Then you start looking at domestic policy to address the wider problems we have, housing, education, job creation.

And immigration must be part of that. But let’s face it the brick throwers, the white English nationalists never want that discussion in that order. Why would they? It exposes them for what they are.

I blame Margaret Thatcher. She validated and encouraged people to only think about themselves and that wider society didn’t exist.

I hate her and hope there’s a very special place in hell that she now resides in.

She was responsible for denuding the industrial areas of jobs which is really where the unrest is rooted. No jobs and lack of social housing can be laid fairly and squarely at her door. Four decades later and here we are.

This is sooo true! They are the debate stoppers.

And I think sometimes it may also be so they think it’ll give them a free pass just to spew extremist comments because if you challenge them on the false slogans and DM soundbites they’re throwing out it’s “wah wah you’re not allowing me to be heard”

Over the last decade, Nigel Farage and similar are constantly on question time and platformed by the mainstream media in other ways, various Tory leaders have spent disproportionate anoint of times scapegoating asylum seekers and immigrants including Rishi with the stop the boats and Braverman who said all sorts of awful things, the Daily Mail has articles upon articles about it and yet they’re being “shut down”.

How tf have they been silenced??!

I’m a similar way that I am concerned about male bodied women in women’s refuges but can’t say that without being accused of being transphobic.

Sorry not trying to start a whole other discussion.

Yep. My husband lived in Sheffield during the miner’s strikes. He thinks that MT is pretty much the epitome of evil.

I agree with you all re Margaret Thatcher.