Southport - reporting restrictions

[mids2019]

So the attacker in Southport was a child (17) so will be not be reported on due to reporting restrictions. Due to proximity of the alleged attacked to adulthood and the severity of the crimes do you think in this case it is in the public interest to release at least some details of the alleged killer? Not releasing details fuels speculation that at a public level may not be helpful in my.opinion.

In addition I would think there may be a high chance the attacker had a severe mental illness so after the Nottingham attacks will the debate about personal responsibility for actions during psychosis be raised again?

The internet has got out of hand. There are far too many places online which entice susceptible young men and teenagers, and indoctinate them with abhorrent, violent or extremist views against others, particularly against women and girls.

This is what has to be tackled, and it has to be a global response.

It is also what probably had the same effect to lead to last nights riot. Angry people (seemingly majority men) looking for any excuse to start launching things and causing havoc.

we have seen the worst of humanity it more ways than one in the last 48 hours. But we have also seen how well the majority of people can come together to support each other

What is in the public interest is to get the EDL under control. There was a big far right rally in Trafalgar Square last weekend as well. They all seem to think because Reform got some votes it’s time for them to go nuts. Angela Rayner needs to get them under control and check the laws we already have in place. That is urgent.

It’s pretty clear what the law is for under 18s. Online platforms must be made to respect the law, they publish as well. Twitter needs to be held to account too.

Yeah I'll see your people you know and raise actually being a forensic clin psy. Average period of detention for murder is 16.5yrs. However, whilst people spend around 8yrs in special hospitals on average, no one is ever discharged from a special hospital to the community, the pathway is to MSU then LSU then supervised discharge. In the case of a px with a history of relapse like Calocane I would expect maximum caution to be exercised.

In any event it isn't a decision for his treating team. he's on a restriction order.

People detained under the MHA cannot be detained once they recover as that is a clinical decision. But people detained under a s41 restriction order can only be discharged or moved to a less secure setting with the approval of the Minister of Justice (in practice a panel of experts at the MoJ). Its incredibly hard to secure discharge from a restriction order. there are only a few hundred patients on them nationally.

Its highly likely he will stabilise on antipsychotics, indeed may have done so already. His long-term risk is of relapse if he suffers any exacerbation of symptoms and loses the insight necessary to take his meds.

I accept people are angry about this. But in the absence of a whole life order, which could never be justified when 5 expert opinions found he was in active psychosis at the time of his crimes AND when he stopped taking meds and thus not culpable there's no way a prison sentence would support public safety.

quite!! If he is the son of Rwandan immigrants he is most likely to be Christian as Rwanda is a predominantly Christian country. Only around 5% of Rwanda’s population is Muslim

Why? The law is the law. What kind of shaky judicial system would we have if laws were just disregarded merely to appease a load of braying, nosy vultures? It will all come out at the trial. People need to back the hell off, let the police and courts do their job, and allow those poor families to get through this with as much peace as is humanly possible. It’s not a bloody reality TV show.

Like Barack Obama.
Oh wait ..

"I can’t ever remember reading about a person with serious MH issues targeting little girls in a dance class. He wasn’t randomly walking down the street, attacking those he came across. He planned this. It was in a secluded place, down a cul de sac. Also, if he had MH issues, wouldn’t they have already said he’d been detained under the MH act."

People in the grip of a schizophrenic psychosis may do absolutely hideous things that make zero sense to anyone else but make absolute sense to them because they're experiencing profoundly delusional thinking and emotions. `People can be in this state for months or years - believe they're Jesus, or that they're being stalked by zombies. I knew someone who experienced a psychosis where they genuinely couldn't tell if they were alive or dead. When my son was in psychosis he believed he was photosynthesising and that his family were poisoning his food with mercury, and barely ate for months.

Psychosis isn't just a momentary loss of control. It's a state of profoundly disordered thinking and emotion.

They don't need to section him to arrest him and keep him in detention. Sections are usually used when someone needs to be admitted to hospital.

The people I know are forensic social workers one of 30 years who work on rehab in the community and take a different view. But that doesn't at all surprise me as there are often disagreements between teams who are on different sides of a case.

If TwiX is correct - and obviously this info is to be taken with a large pinch of salt - he is not far off turning 18. At which point I presume reporting restrictions would stop.

And Keir Starmer thinks 16 and 17 year old should be given the vote. If that's (seriously) the case then this daft age restricted reporting must be lifted.

Has he yet been charged and appeared before a magistrate?

That will lead to an initial court date, when reporting restrictions, bail and other matters will be settled.

I think it is, entirely correctly, a decision for the judge

Last I heard from local media a few hours back was police had been given an extension to the time to question him before charging.

We need to know if he's an incel before more of them commit to various cruel acts.

People need to become aware of incel culture.

Do we ever need to know his name?

He should not become famous as a result of his actions

Exactly and whatever his motivations his voice shouldn’t be given any attention. Let him rot in prision and be forgotten about. Keep the names of the innocent victims and the heoroes going instead.

If, as Sirzy posted, he is still being questioned and has not yet been charged, his age is currently not the key factor. The police do not reveal anyone's name at this point. It happens after the accused first appears in a magistrate's court (usually same day as charges are laid, or following one if v late at night).

With a minor, the magistrate will almost certainly refuse to permit the publication of the name, leaving it to the judge at the Crown Court to decide

Even if he had a 'mental episode' he was sane enough to choose his victims carefully.

He didn't storm a pub or a factory full of blokes.

Not buying it.

Police have confirmed it

Detectives investigating the mass stabbing at a Southport dance and yoga event which left three children dead have been granted more time to question the 17-year-old suspect.
Merseyside Police confirmed officers had asked magistrates for more time to question the teenager, who has not been named because of his age and remains in custody.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/police-granted-more-time-question-29649838

Everything will come out in due course. We do not have the right to know details straight away, especially as the facts may not be clear until the investigation is completed.

many white eastern european countries are Muslim, through the influence of the Islamic Ottoman Empire

I would like to know the reason he did it, partly because I think the more information we have the more likely we are to recognise when someone might be in need of supervision/help before they do something heinous.

Actually, I'm not sure that IS why; I'll be as truthful as I can, and admit that I am certainly curious as to his motivation for no real reason. I'm ashamed of myself.

Horrific situation for all involved.

His name is out but must not be shared and with the information that is now freely available on x and elsewhere, it might sadly also be a systemic failing as so often.

My thoughts and prayers go to all families affected by this awful situation.

Rather than race riots, people should demand that communities and schools are supported adequately.

Really ? Certainly the name and information that was circulated is fake. So wouldn't trust anything that had come from social media.