Thread 3 Starmer: Digging has started, bigger shovel required

[DuncinToffee]

Previous thread

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5117727-thread-2-starmer-return-of-the-labour-government?page=1

There is a lot of explicit racism on here now. The tactics are just the usual nibbling away of “but in this case the skin colour of this person”.

However this place is better than a lot of others. I live in London and there is sewer of this stuff on local websites, community WhatsApp etc. And it is unvarnished hatred.

If you do try to "counter" you may as well paint a target on your back.

I was saying to DP last night I wonder if this will cause some clearer rules around what is allowed on the Internet. It is disgusting that the Southport tragedy was coopted this way and it happened pretty much immediately. So quickly it appears to me there must be bad actors scanning the Internet for events to use as a trigger.

I trust Yvette Cooper to want to look into this. The problem is FrEeDom of SPeAcH.

Yes.
For one I'm fed up with reading about "needing to take legitimate concerns reasonably". Racism is never a legitimate concern.

I'm also annoyed by the posters who "correct" you if you call Islamophobia racism. "Islam isn't a race". It's disgusting deflection.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1818343641930514674.html

Thread on the #Southport anti-migrant and anti-Muslim disinformation and propaganda. In this thread I highlight key spreaders of disinformation, the chronology, and some points about some of the inauthentic activity evident. I will focus on X.

Tommy / Stephen started from the Luton Firm certainly. Luton has really cleaned up its act, though.

I’ve given up on most social media. The blatant racism, homophobia, and ableism is just awful to read. It feels like there is a groundswell of hatred.

I understand that there are a lot of men feeling like they have no place. Wealth inequality, lack of consistent manual labour jobs, schools and education falling apart, and media ramping things up all play their part.

It just always surprises me, despite knowing how these violent people become who they are, That instead of striving to improve things for themselves and their families, they lash out.

To me it often feels like the response of a cornered animal. They see no way out and fight to the end. So yes, we need to crack down on the behaviour itself, but we also need to improve social and professional opportunity. if people have hope that they can improve things for their future, we should see a reduction in this sort of violence.

@CassieMaddox agree. I notice what is the “ordinary discourse” where I live is hardening. Recently had “do you know your neighbours”. That escalated into a clear hatred of foreigners which was explicit. Racists are bolder in my area than I have ever seen; it will all be about loving “what England represents”. That is the big problem Labour have. I fear that unless they really improve the quality of life for people then this will grow and grow.

I’m half tempted to ask in Site Stuff for a Racist Mumsnetters board
But a) easy banhammer for MNHQ b) I don’t want to piss off the people who asked for the various boards by co-opting the same arguments they legitimately used (a place for the rest of us to hide where Racists can happily chat together without fear of invasion by Non Racists. And possibly c) it might be too popular

I think the truth is c). It would be popular with a sizeable minority.

I agree @DrRiverSong . Also, the fear of losing a good job if you are a racist twat isn’t there, because the good jobs aren’t there.

Oh and @Piggywaspushed , what you said a way upthread, about where the infiltration became clear, I completely agree, despite us having very different views on the core issue.
The far right will keep pushing at a slightly open door or window until they are in. It’s what they have always done. Fighting them when they are in just gives them even more of a thrill, so it’s really important those doors and windows are barred. Proscribing EDL would be a good start.

I was coming on to comment about inequality.

I agree entirely with what you have said on this.

Sometimes when housing is discussed, or lack thereof I I somewhat flippantly point out there are a million empty homes.
Some posters like to point out that the rich pay a high proportion of the tax in this country. Which if they stopped to think, just shows how unequal the country is.

In my view, community support, such as Sure Start, youth groups and so on, together with a reduction in inequality are the only ways out of the mess we are currently in.

They’ve done a good job of cleaning up lots of stadiums and the reputation of the British hooligans overseas. But those thugs need to go somewhere and the EDL provided a home for them. Or at least certainly knows how to mobilise them as an army.

I'm so angry today. Think I need a day off the Internet

Me too Cassie.

The MN racists have woken up and the agreed line today seems to be not to not to condemn the EDL but to whine about "two tier policing".

They wanted the police to kick the thugs heads in?

Olympics are a great distraction. Fred Sirieix was just talking about synchronised diving

(His daughter is competing)

Of course they have. MNHQ seriously needs to take a look at the bilge they are hosting now. To coin a phrase from that Site Stuff thread, I’m not doing the job of picking up dogshit for them any more. They need to get staff on proactive moderation because Britain is a fucking powder keg at the moment.

On Sky news now, there are live pictures of the mosque in Southport. There is a crowd or workmen, appearances suggest of a wide variety of backgrounds repairing the damage that was done.

At a guess that is not an organised thing, but the local community taking a day off work to do what is right.

Yes naturally. Could have predicted that.

Sometimes I feel like this is what it must have been like in Germany in the 30s. A large section of society seem to have completely lost their humanity.

Is it a large number of people?

The crowd yesterday was smaller than the number of people who turn up to my local junior parkrun each week.

Is that not the kind of line we expect from the contemptible former Home Secretary Braverman? I think it is. She should have been condemned by her party, instead they were weak. Rishi Sunak is responsible for that not happening.

Yes thank you. That's my fear speaking