Thread 14 - TalkLair: “What The Hell Are We Supposed To Use, Man? Harsh Language?”

[Kucinghitam]

(Previous thread 13).

Summer should be well under way, but the chilly wind, grey clouds and pouring rain beg to differ. Looks like 2024 continues to be a washout - on the bright side, the Tories got washed out too! In the TalkLair, we remain hunkered down keeping cosy and warm. The hearth is glowing, the walls covered in dubious artwork, books by non-approved authors line the shelves, rugs are down on the floors (and assorted pets curled up on them).

We just won’t mention the gnawed bones of our prey over there in the corner of the cave…

I was thinking more Joyce Grenfell.

I'm thinking of Pat Simmons who did the Speaking Clock voice. You can just hear her saying 'Fuck'.

telephonesuk.org.uk/speaking-clock/

I looked at those boots earlier. I'm assuming your toes don't go into the toes on the boot because there are only four of them. Not that I'm suggesting that they'd work if there were the standard five toes per foot. One does wonder how on earth they ever got made and assumes that the designer was on glue or similar.

Yeah, the four toed boots are as ugly as they are stupid. Clearly a designer who has failed to grasp the basics of design.

I've been at a poetry class on Tuesday evenings for the last three weeks, and today we read a poem by Ross Gay called Spoon. It's a long poem (link for interested parties, including a link where he's reading it - x.com/appraisal_daily/status/948306786016219136?s=61&t=5wM6rrCIVAeqWs6wZl1YCQ ). It's also a brilliant and beautiful and sad one.

Afterwords the teacher talked about how it was "queering masculinity" and "redefining masculinity", and I had to struggle mightily to keep my mouth shut because in the arts community here anything that suggests you might be harbouring Bad Thoughts is unacceptable. I did suggest that talking about real and close and tender friendship between men who are not lovers was not really redefining masculinity but this was heartily disagreed with so I shut up.

All the others in the class, including the teacher, are under 50, some of them well under. They obviously don't remember the 70s.

@Britinme It seems clear that, at some point in the early 21st century, we've gone backwards in smashing sex stereotypes.

Couldn't agree more; have said the same myself. Which is quite worrying, really.

And not just in that context. This morning we went to a "Living Well With Dementia" support group. Patients were about 50:50 men/women. Half way through we were divided up into two separate rooms, one for patients and the other for carers/relatives/whatever, to allow people to vent or just say what they couldn't otherwise say. As we stood up to go back, one of the older women said "Has anyone else noticed a difference between the two groups?" and yep, of course I had. Every single one of the carers was a woman.

So, as it happens, was every one of the half-dozen or so healthcare professionals at the meeting. And yet in every video, the voice of the narrator/explainer was a man's.

I did suggest that talking about real and close and tender friendship between men who are not lovers was not really redefining masculinity

They need to read more 19th century (and early 20th century) literature, where this is practically one of the defining features of a Good Chap. Holmes and Watson; Pooh and Piglet; Bunny and Raffles; the 3 men in a boat/on the bummel; Mole and Ratty; Tom Brown, Harry East & George Arthur; Darcy and Bingley ...

Stevenson (Alan and David), Buchan, Tolkien . . .

Aubrey and Maturin

Have these young people never read a book?

Do you need a reply to that, Dean?

Well, given that it was a poetry class and the young people concerned are allegedly interested in the Arts, a foundation in reading fairly widely doesn't seem like a hard ask.

Kirk and Spock for the non-bookish. O'Brien and Bashir.

Ennis and Jack off of Brokeback Mountain. Oh. Sorry.

I do agree that this is not some new thing and it is definitely not queering masculinity. Dear god what an absolute bollocks.

I don't know if anyone else watched/liked Thirtysomething when it was on telly, about a million years ago, but one of the things I loved was the friendship between the men.

I bloody LOVED Thirtysomething!

DBro called today, it's bad news from SiL's amniocentesis. Times like this, I hate being on the other side of the world from my family. I just want to be there holding them both in my arms.

So sorry for all of you Kuc.

I'm so sorry to hear that, @Kucinghitam . Sometimes distance is nothing at all and sometimes it is so painful. Love to you, your SIL and your DB.

Oh how sad, and how hard to be far away Kuc.

Oh that’s sad news @Kucinghitam and really hard being half a world away. Lots of love to you all.

I’m so sorry to hear that Kuc. Yes, very hard to be so far away from loved ones.

I'm very sorry, Kuchingham.

Oh, (((kuc)))

That's rough, Kuc. Feel for you.