Loving Sarah Vine on This Morning -Ozempic

[AmyFFowler]

She said we live in an obesogenic society and need to be realistic about the need for weight loss drugs like ozempic. She also said we are genetically programmed to eat as much as possible when we can as our ancestors didn’t know when the next wilderbeast would come along. Now we can just sit in our house and deliveroo will bring us food.
Completely agree with all of the above. I am currently working very hard and managing to lose weight without the help of drugs, so I do also ‘get’ the personal responsibility side to this. I just think as a society we are fighting a losing battle if we don’t embrace the new wave of weight loss drugs. Hopefully in time there will be more studies into long term use.

I am not anti ozempic or anti Sarah Vine

But…

if it was simply a as fact of life that we are now all obese… why are there so many people who do NOT struggle with their weight? What is their secret? They were part of the same evolution and are in the same obesogenic environment

maybe more studies need to look at how non-y people manage it?

Ozempic sounds great but us it really safe long term? I know it is Big pharma’s dream to have everyone on long term medication..

That's a bit like saying why are there tall people v short people, or bald men v non bald men, or happy people v depressed people, or people with a thyroid problem v those without. Genetics and how your individual body works plays a role.

There are also psychological factors - why are some people addicts and others aren't could be both genetic and psychological factors. But if we waited for all of that to be unraveled before trying to help anyone have a bit more willpower with a weight loss injection, the NHS would buckle from our ever increasing levels of obesity and all the cancer, heart issues, joint issues etc that obesity causes.

So why not let people help themselves by using weight loss drugs if they want to?

I seem to be the only person who has noticed the 'large bag of crisis' which seems apt!!! Wins the internet for me today.

I have taken Wegovy and lost 3 stone. I'm not lazy, poor or stupid. I put on the weight because menopause changed my metabolism. I was going to the gym 4 times a week, cooking from scratch and yet I kept piling on the weight. Turns out I can only eat 1400 calories a day to maintain my weight these days.

The excess weight really depressed me, but more importantly obesity is linked to so many cancers I really was scared for my health. But eating 1000 calories a day consistently was impossible for me. Wegovy made it possible.

In 2021 to 2022, 63.8% of adults aged 18 years and over in England were estimated to be overweight or living with obesity.

People of a healthy weight are now in the minority.

I'm way oversimplifying here - but why are my eyes brown and my friend's blue? Why can't I change to be more blue-eyed? Obviously I can eat less to be thinner, but what if I tell you that you and I could eat the exact same number of calories in a controlled study, but you might lose weight whereas I wouldn't? If you have two sets of slim grandparents, and two slim parents, you are likely to be slim - and the opposite is true. If you were born via C-Section, you are more likely to be obese as an adult because your gut bacteria are not as varied as someone born vaginally - in fact faecal transplants may be a viable treatment for increasing the variation in gut flora in people who do not have a "good" mix.

And the percentage of people who are overweight or obese is growing, too.

They're also not really in quite the same obesogenic environment. We know that rates of obesity are higher in more deprived areas. The physical environments people live in and access to more nutritious food are not all the same. It doesn't affect everyone equally.

@Movinghouseatlast yes, spot on. Age is a huge factor. Many can be smug in 20s, 30s or even early mid 40s, you must be a secret binger if fat!

Mid 50s & you can be a stone up despite not changing a thing or even more.

To add - the studies into how thin people stay thin would likely show that they don't get as hungry, or they are not insulin-resistant, or their microbiome is naturally varied and healthy. I could be next to a naturally slim person and eat the same meal, but my blood sugar would crash whereas theirs might not. I am then left hungrier through no fault of my own (ie. no failing in willpower). If you look into the Zoe study it's really enlightening as to how different bodies react to different food groups - and none of it is to do with conscious choice, it's how the body is designed.

😂 @Limberinta! Come on, if the research to back up your claims was available, you'd post it, holiday or not. I think you've posted rubbish and don't have the grace to admit that...

Re: 1930s a lot of kitchen staff etc talk about the tall, whippet thin, ‘gentry’ womenfolk even post birth. Women staff MUCH more active & didn’t eat more yet much stockier. Genetics again? The courses in ‘big houses’ endless.

@StarsHideYourFir3s it’s interesting how I am suddenly ravenous when I begin to eat, but not always before.

A better diet almost certainly. I think a lot of people overeat as a comfort. Hence fat people are more likely to be poor etc

@Fatnold the 30s staff often got the leftovers, even sirloin on Sundays in London in some households. In 30s, if staff, all food freshly made from scratch & you’d work a 14 hour day quite possibly.

Or it's exactly what I said. Look it up or don't, I really don't give a fuck, I have bigger issues of my own life falling apart that need my energy so please pp stop quoting me as if I said I hate ozempic and read what I said properly, because that wasn't what my point was at all. I posted on here as I saw it and it was a distraction. I saw the research, I watched the speakers. I really don't care anymore, so please stop quoting me

Me too. The sad fact is that in our 50's we just don't need 3 meals a day.

I was born in 1961,so brought up in the 60s and early 70s.
I had bacon and egg for breakfast nearly every morning, a GOOD school dinner at lunchtime, a milky way on the walk back from school, and then a jacket spud with cheese, or liver and bacon casserole with mash.
Fish and chips on Fridays, and I was skinny until after the birth of my second child , which coincided with the proliferation of ready foods......

I've never been obese, but have been overweight by up to a stone, and have remedied that by eating 'clean' - normal foods, but nothing ultra processed.
I am convinced that UPFs are to blame for a lot of the weight issues in this country. People always point to the French - how are they so slim, so healthy. Have you been in a French supermarket?? Delicious food, but very little ready meals, a small selection of 'crap' food .

I'm not a French ambassador on here, usually roll my eyes at the fawning of everything Francophile, but their shopping habits knock ours into the rough.

Eat food you have to cook, rather than reheat is my mantra. Means I can still enjoy a bit of chocolate, a glass of wine, a pudding or a G&T without worrying about piling the pounds.

Re educating, reducing shite foods at a cheap price ( look at all the brilliant offers - it's always pizza, chips, ice cream Mars bars and a bottle of coke type of thing), promoting good foods, taxing bad.
Try that before just accepting that people are overweight and need drugs.

And I'm not talking about ANYONE who is overweight due to injury, illness or Meds they need to stay alive. I'm talking about people like me.

The school of thought that it is self-inflicted has some substance. I could be really fat (my parents are both large, my brother is clinically obese and I put weight on very very easily) BUT I exercise restraint. I eat healthily, I exercise, I limit the high calorie stuff. I have maintained a size 8 till 10 figure my entire adult life (I went from 69 kg to 51 kg after the birth of my second child). So I am NOT terribly sympathetic with the idea that society is obesogenic and we should medicalise being fat to the extent people are put of drugs for life.

I would also question how much of this narrative is being pushed by the Pharma companies who stand to make multi-billions.

So I am NOT terribly sympathetic with the idea that society is obesogenic

How does your own level of willpower tell us anything about whether a society with ever increasing numbers of overweight adults is obesogenic? Nobody thinks it's impossible for any human to exercise restraint to avoid becoming obese, but it's quite evident that this isn't the solution on a societal level.

It's legit to question the motives of Pharma companies. You're right to do that. However, obese people staying obese and more joining them every year also lines their pockets, given that obese people get more health problems younger.

@Choux I am not against ozempic or weight loss drugs at all

just hope there are no long term side effects, that’s all.

i guess I never thought being slim was ever only down to genetics, but maybe it is. Is that proven? Is being slim the outlier?

Yes, same for me - depending on what I eat. If it's e.g. weetabix with milk, I feel hungry very soon after. If it's an omelette with veg, I don't get that. If I monitored my blood sugars I suspect I would see them rocket and crash after the first breakfast, but slowly climb and peak/fall much slower after the second. I'm currently on Wegovy so I don't currently experience that ravenous hunger just after a meal - which I usually get and which always wrecked any attempt at eating anything other than whole foods. I normally have to eat about 800 calories to lose weight and about the same to maintain that loss which is totally wild and no doctors has every found it weird (despite me regularly exercising too... apparently I needed to "move more"). I won't even get started on how piss-poor current general medicine is at what causes weight loss and weight maintenance.

@Carelesswispalover can I ask where you got it from?
Are you having any side effects?
And could I be really cheeky and ask the cost?
I'm seriously considering it myself but I don't even know where to start!

@everythinglooksbetterpaintedblack there are a few threads about taking Mournjaro which have loads of really useful info on and people who have been taking it for a few months now. Mine was £125 ish for the first month and £138 for the second month

Wow, that attracted a lot of posts! I was being a bit tongue in cheek about Sarah Vine as I know her reputation so was surprised to hear her making what I thought was an excellent point.
People saying we should do something about the availability of cheap processed food, what do you suggest? We live in a free economy where if a product is made that people want and sold at a price they are willing to pay, it sells. We have a sugar tax and all that has done is increase our consumption of cancerous fake sugar (IMO). It’s very hard to interfere without negative unintended consequences.
I do agree that the research recently released has been backed by the drugs company. They are clever enough to have used reputable scientists and published in full so it can be put under the microscope. The drug has also been given the rigorous testing needed to be recommended by nice for short term use in certain circumstances.
Comparisons to the Astra Zenica Covid jab being removed from use are spurious. It was released quickly as people were dying of Covid and suffering the negative effects of lockdown. It did more good than harm as it was easy to store and give to populations unable to access other alternatives. Then when the negatives outweighed the positives it was righted discontinued.
I also agree that there are lots of contributing factors relating to obesity. Low smoking rates was one I hadn’t considered!
As I said in my OP, I hope in time it will be shown to be safe for long term use.

It's a profitable market, all right.

The market for these new drugs is widening, and could reach $100 billion by 2030, possibly $200 billion in the next decade, according to a note from Barclays Bank.

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2023/07/02/weight-loss-drug-eli-lilly-phase-2-testing/70374595007/

@Daisypod where are you getting it from?
Have you had any problems?