Cost of living in the UK v the birth rate

[Potterpot]

I was reading an article where a young couple living in an expensive part of the country said they wouldn’t be able to afford having kids so they’ve made peace with that decision. I can understand why, especially after seeing on another thread that some people’s full time nursery bill costs £1600 a month for one child. The UK average property price at current rates is £1300 a month. That’s £3000 gone, before you’ve even thought about council tax, utility bills, food shopping, travel, saving, disposable income.

I understand being able to make the short term sacrifice financially to afford one child.

Unless one parent can be a SAHP or have significant family help, how are people affording two? Do you have to be high earners for this lifestyle now?

@Potterpot Where is cheaper than £240k?

There are absolutely loads of places. They may have to take a drop in salary but that's offset by the cheaper cost of living. Just had a quick look on Rightmove. 2 bedroom new build house in a nice area, 150k. 3 bedroom end of terrace 170k. Get out of your bubble.

Where is this 2 bed new build for 150k? Do you have a link?

@Potterpot Ours is 2 and a half. We were thinking about having a second by the end of the year, but realistically I think we'll have to space them out so there's no double nursery fees. I'm a SAHM at the moment and we choose to send LO two days a week but if we had a second and I was back at work, my salary would never cover that cost entirely.

To be clear, I wasn't trying to comment on whether people on normal incomes could afford two. I was clumsily making a point that even on a high income, we are having to discuss finances in a way that I don't think people did in the past. My husband was one of six, they all went to private school and lived in a five bedroom house in a very expensive area. His dad earned slightly less than my husband does now (adjusted for inflation) and his mum didn't work! Even my parents could afford a better standard of living than we do now for two children on literally half what we have (again, adjusted for inflation).

@idontlikealdi eh? Where did I say I have no mortgage? If I did, it was a typo! Sorry!

well as someone in my mid 20s me and my friends just don't we having kids we can't afford it, buying or renting is expensive, wages have stagnated and that's before we mention the childcare crisis

Is it actually offset by the cost of living? Is childcare, electricity, council tax, petrol etc all cheaper? Or are we just transferring the same struggles to a different place on a smaller scale?
Break it down for us - £150k house, what are local incomes like, how much is a day at nursery?

We are early and mid thirties, 2 primary aged DC, and we have a high combined income particularly for area we live in (NW). The one thing we struggle with is time. We could afford more children but I feel like I’m spread too thin as it is juggling work and DC. We could afford for me to become a SAHM but we would have to cut back on luxuries which we don’t want to do. I also enjoy working and would worry about being financially dependent on someone. The only family I know that have more than 3 DC have a SAHP.

I was establishing my career in my 20’s and would’ve struggled to financially support a child then, especially considering nursery fees.

I also didn’t meet my husband until I was 29. I’m very glad I waited but then having kids wasn’t a must for me.

I completely agree with this. I had a nice childhood, in a family of 3,grew up in Ireland and my parents while wonderful, never had spare cash for extra curricular lessons, driving lessons or enrichment activities. I want to give my kids some nice opportunities I didn't have.
We're in the final months of nursery fees with our second child and it really feels so much more expensive than it used to. Probably because there has been hyperinflation which has disproportionately affected younger people who have to pay £££££££ for their homes. I'd have to reconsider having two if I was starting a family today rather than 8 years ago.
This is a real problem for demographics going forward. Policies that support families more would help redress the balance.

Quite a few houses like this round here. Cheapest is 92 for a 2 bed. 180 is about norm for 3 bed.
Council tax in a band c is, I think, 200?
Gas and electric 200.
Childcare.... not actually sure anymore.
Petrol: depends how far you work. I pay 200 a month. But I don't work local.
Jobs: airbus and NHS the big employers. So salaries around average or more.

We had kids when I was 30 and 32 (2013 and 2016). I wanted a similar timeframe to the one my mum had. We'd been together for 9 years at that point (married 3). We'd bought a 3 bed terraced house in our mid 20s for 112k just after the 2008 recession. We had low wages at the time of having babies. Honestly, the only reason we could afford that gap was a unexpected inheritance (awful though - dh's dad).

With property and nursery costs what they are today, I think we would have stuck with one dc if we'd waited until now. It's truly a dire situation. Lots of friends had theirs later and have stuck with one or waited until the youngest was at school.

@Potterpot sorry, i meant it had been a new build a couple of years ago. First sale and it's up for 150k. Just had another look and a bigger brand new 2 bed is 199k. All I'll say is it's up north.

My friend is originally from London. Both her & her DH grew up in a part of London that at the time was seen by people as being 'rough'. She says it wasn't that bad. It had some dodgy parts but it was mixed. Do you know why her childhood area is now like all of London and unaffordable for lots of people? Because lots of people moved there because they couldn't afford housing in other parts of London. What do you think will happen if lots of people move where you are? Do you think property will remain cheaper? It won't.

My house was 240k bought in 2022, and my mortgage is £600 per month.

I still can't afford children though as me and DH are both on less than the national average. Money is swallowed up by bills. I can't understand how other people manage

Did you have a large deposit/low interest rate?

@DragonFly98
How is it a choice though? Unless you deliberately plan to go on benefits? This was the choice we faced when considering growing our family: as public sector workers on modest salaries, we could have sold our house which we'd just bought, for very little profit, and attempted to rent privately, which would have necessitated applying for substantial benefits to top up rent and pay for childcare. It felt like a really irresponsible choice, so we didn't.

I didn’t say that the solution should be to move.
I think the implication that there are no ‘decent’ jobs in these areas is rude and insulting to those that live and work there

@Chickenwing2 that's ironic because many of us are wondering how you even managed to get on the property ladder and to buy an expensive house in the first place?. £600 isn't exactly extortionate split between 2 people I would say its very cheap. I'm a single person and rent is £500 per month!

@Chickenwing2 when in 2022 did you buy your house? For 7-8 months of 2022, the interest rates were at historic lows so unless you bought from August onwards you're being disingenuous mentioning your mortgage as if it is relevant in a discussion about 2024 costs.

(Also disingenuous- or downright misleading- if you did buy it at a high interest rate but had a very high deposit)

I think that's sadly pretty normal, not just expensive part of the country.

I don't know what the answer is but yes, having young kids now and having to pay for childcare is beyond expensive, especially alongside all other increases. It's very difficult for people in their early 30s in particular who may have just about saved up to buy a house and they're dropped into an even larger sea of expenses straight away. There's never a breather and basics are becoming luxuries despite working hard and making reasonable money. It's a very sad state of affairs.

@Ahugga A local nursery takes babies for 360 pw. I know someone in London who pays lots more than that. I don't know about all local salaries. Big employers are nhs, HMRC, DWP, Car makers, financial and tech services. Im currently paying £1.42 for petrol. Council tax band c is 2,037. Electricity won't be cheaper obviously. All Bus fares are £2 because of the cap. I think pints in pubs are cheaper. How does this all this compare to you? I'm in the North of England and this area is generally considered to be a cheap place to live. This was evident by the large amount of Londoners moving up here after Covid.

That's a hefty rate for band c.

The people I know have toddlers now. I'm not talking my grandparent's generation.

Just checked our neighbouring county and it's very similar.

15-20 years ago isn't your grandparents generation is it?